Talk:Big Cosmic Clone

Merge Small and Big Cosmic Clone

This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit this section or its subsections. If you wish to discuss the article, please do so in a new section below the proposal.

canceled by proposer
These pages are basically the same, so I feel like we should merge them. Big Cosmic Clone is literally the same as Small Cosmic Clone but worded differently for the sake of not being the exact same. I 100%ed 3D Land multiple times and I can confidently say that the Big Cosmic Clone is just the Small Cosmic Clone but stronger (since it can break most blocks), five times as big and it gives you ten coins instead of just. But for the rest? The same models. The same same moveset. The same animation. The same voice lines. The problem is though; the pages are the same, just worded differently. Wouldn't it be better to have them merged into one Cosmic Clone page and let both the Small and Big Cosmic Clones have their own section?

Now we have three options:

Option 1

We merge them into one article named "Cosmic Clone (Super Mario 3D Land)" and then rename Cosmic Clone to "Cosmic Clone (Super Mario Galaxy 2). See my sandbox for an example of how that page will look in my eyes.

Option 2

We merge them with the Cosmic Clone article; this means that we will expand Super Mario 3D Land's coverage on said article.

Option 3

Status quo.

Proposer: Yoshi18 (talk)
Deadline: January 13, 2026, 23:59 (UTC) Cancelled on December 31, 2025, 23:50 UTC

Merge them into one

1. Cosmic Clone Yoshi (talk) Per proposal.

Merge them with Cosmic Clone

1. Cosmic Clone Yoshi (talk) Second choice.

Status quo

1. Sorbetti (talk) In my experience, having completed this game 100% and being one of the video games I've replayed the most, I can say that they are not the same. Small Cosmic Clone, as its name suggests, is a smaller variant of Cosmic Clone that doesn't die after damaging the player and doesn't move in groups. Meanwhile, Big Cosmic Clone is a larger version of Cosmic Clone that has a deeper voice and is capable of destroying everything in its path , often used in the game as a challenge. They don't act the same way, they don't look the same due to the size difference, they don't appear in the same levels, they have different names in Japanese and in every other available language, and in general, they are distinct. Also, both pages work well, with their own information organized and easy to understand, so I don't know what will happen if they are merged; the information could end up very disorganized. Neither of the two options really seems good. The first, merging both on the "Cosmic Clone (Super Mario 3D Land)" page, seems wrong to me since neither Small Cosmic Clone nor Big Cosmic Clone has been called simply Cosmic Clone, so it's a conjectural title. Furthermore, it forces us to use an unnecessary identifier, "(Super Mario Galaxy 2)," which can only cause more confusion. The second option also seems wrong to me because if both are different from Cosmic Clone by having different sizes, different names, and different mechanics-then why on earth should they be merged? Not only do I feel that this proposal doesn't clearly explain the reasons for the merge, but it doesn't even attempt to explain the benefits this change would bring. "They're both similar, so merge," but what about everything else?
2. Rift Wandering Poplin (talk) Having also painfully completed this game 100%, I can say that at least the Big Cosmic Clones deserve their own article. At best, we could merge the small Cosmic Clones back, although I'm not quite sure if I agree with that either.
3. Salmancer (talk) So like, "is big, may or may not bust down blocks", is like 90% of big to normal differences. We merge Small Cosmic Clone with Big Cosmic Clone, and Big Koopa Troopa, Big Shell, Giant Spiked Ball also have to get slurped up into Koopa Troopa, Koopa Shell, and Spike Ball respectively. Which I don't think we want to do. I think we like easily knowing which games have big things vs normal things even if it has caused no end of classification clashes, and applying "merge big things to normal things when there are few functional differences" will muddy that. (And make Category:Large variants harder to maintain.) Sometimes a page is really going to be "its X again, but with difference Y", because that's easy to implement in a game and easy to communicate to the player. (And occasionally a plot point because of how power-ups in the Super Mario (franchise) work, see Super Mario 3D Land and how a Tail Bullet Bill is just a Bullet Bill with a tail attack.) Besides, the Mario Portal page for Super Mario 3D Land] has different entries for Small Cosmic Clone and Big Cosmic Clone, and Mario Portal is gospel.
4. Bad Dark Shadow Arendmesis (talk) Per all; it does appear that both varieties have distinct differences and that Nintendo does recognize these as different entities. Also, while I get the idea to merge the two, it does seem silly to me to merge the big variety of an entity to a small variety of an entity, instead of the entity itself (even though in this case I wouldn't recommend that either). We don't merge Big Mario (who is similarly able to break blocks) to Small Mario either, for instance.
5. Camwoodstock (talk) Unless having a variable size is something that is just, an inherent part of the variance of the subject in question, we generally split size variants like this. We don't see any real reason to make this an exception.
6. Nintendo101 (talk) Explicitly delineated enemies in the mainline Super Mario series warrant dedicated article coverage. Perhaps consider if our articles are lacking details before assuming they are complete and should be merged. Many perceived redundancies and minimal info on the wiki is a consequence of poor research, not because there is not actually anything worth saying.

Cosmic Clone Comments

@Sorbetti, I 100%ed 3D Land multiple times as well and I can confidently say that the Big Cosmic Clone is just the Small Cosmic Clone but stronger (since it can break most blocks), five times as big and it gives you ten coins instead of just. But for the rest? The same models. The same same moveset. The same animation. The same voice lines. The problem is though; the pages are the same, just worded differently. Wouldn't it be better to have them merged into one Cosmic Clone page and let both the Small and Big Cosmic Clones have their own section? Should I maybe show you an example of what I mean? Yoshi18 (talk/contribs) 13:02, December 30, 2025 (EST)

Sharing models means nothing if they act differently and are officially categorized as separate things. I've seen both pages, Small Comic Clone and Big Cosmic Clone, under your statement that "the pages are the same, just worded differently" and that's not true. I don't think you even need to read it too much to realize that. Also, I don't know why the fact that Big Cosmic Clone is bigger, can break things because of its size, and that it has a deeper voice and a unique internal name separate from Small Cosmic Clone, doesn't mean anything to you. Sorbetti (talk) 13:12, December 30, 2025 (EST)

These changes mean nothing to me because even with these changes it's still the same playstyle. The player run away from the Cosmic Clone and the player gets hurt if the player comes in contact with the Cosmic Clone and both Cosmic Clones can be defeated. Big Cosmic Clone] just can't distinguish himself as good as Big Goomba. Big Goomba really ended up making itself a distinction from a normal Goomba. In Super Mario Bros. 3, Big Goomba was just a (normal) Goomba but big. But things started to change as off Super Mario 64. In said game, you take more damage from a. Big Goomba and Big Goombas are also slower than normal/smaller ones (traits that Big Cosmic Clone doesn't have; the player takes the same amount of damage from both Small and Big Cosmic Clone, and Big Cosmic Clone also is just as fast as Small Cosmic Clone). In both New Super Mario Bros. and Mario Party 10 (but mainly talking about , Big Goomba literally turned into a full-blown boss (you could technically see Big Cosmic Clone as the boss of Special 7-Castle...but still not quite...). In the other New Super Mario Bros. games, the Super Mario Maker games and Super Mario Bros. Wonder, Big Goombas are notable for not being defeated the first time you stomp on them and will instead split themselves into smaller Goombas (once again Big Cosmic Clone doesn't have this; it doesn't split into two Small Cosmic Clones when defeated for example. That would really distinguish Small and Big Cosmic Clones better). Big Cosmic Clone could really do better to distinguish itself from his smaller counterpart than just a lower voice and the ability to break blocks and pillars. Yoshi18 (talk/contribs) 14:18, December 30, 2025 (EST)

I don't currently see anything in this argument that really counters the original proposal which got these pages merged in the first place. They have different names in Japan, different names in English, and (somewhat) different functionality from their previous appearance. What's more, the Big Cosmic Clones' ability to break Blocks/Pillars is used for progression in a few stages, rather than a purely aesthetic upgrade. How do you plan to address all of that? Wandering Poplin (talk) 13:50, December 30, 2025 (EST)

Well @Wandering Poplin, to answer your question and at the same time I also wanna tell to everyone that voted on my proposal right now (@Sorbetti and @Salmancer); I think you all understood the proposal (or at least the first two options) wrong. That's why I made an example of the merged Small and Big Cosmic Clones page in my sandbox, so you guys can see my vision. Yoshi18 (talk/contribs) 15:20, December 30, 2025 (EST)

Also, @Wandering Poplin, to add up on this: My and Sorbetti's proposals are different. Sorbetti's proposals was tied to Galaxy 2's Cosmic Clone, since Galaxy 2's Cosmic Clones and 3D Land's Cosmic Clones were merged back then. My proposal is different than that. While it does have the option to merge 3D Land's Cosmic Clones with Galaxy 2's Cosmic Clones, there's also the option to merge both the Small and Big Cosmic Clone into one article named "Cosmic Clone (Super Mario 3D Land)" (see my sandbox for an example of my vision on how that page will end up looking) and Galaxy 2's Cosmic Clone article will be renamed to "Cosmic Clone (Super Mario Galaxy 2). It maybe looks about the same but is an important and crucial difference (since Galaxy 2's Cosmic Clone will still be separated from 3D Land's Cosmic Clone) to understand the point of this proposal. Yoshi18 (talk/contribs) 15:29, December 30, 2025 (EST)

That's worse than I imagined. You're not even merging the two pages, you're just making them one page with two sections and without any apparent change. Why? Sorbetti (talk) 15:40, December 30, 2025 (EST)

I don't think trying to lump both of them in one article does enough justice to the differences they do have. The sandbox example you provided also fails to show me any clear benefit from merging them into one page. Also, on the note of the Big Goomba comparison, there's also pages for dozens of other "Big" variants of characters with even less differences from their base counterparts than Big Cosmic Clones. Wandering Poplin (talk) 16:20, December 30, 2025 (EST)