MarioWiki:Proposals

Proposals can be new features (such as an extension), removal of a previously added feature that has tired out, or new policies that must be approved via consensus before any action(s) are done. Any user can support or oppose, but must have a strong reason for doing so, not, e.g., "I like this idea!" "Vote" periods last for one week. All past proposals are archived. A proposal section works like a discussion page: comments are brought up and replied to using indents (colons, such as : or ::::) and all edits are signed using the code {{user|User name}}. Signing with the signature code ~~~(~) is not allowed due to technical issues. How To Actions that users feel are appropriate to have community approval first can be added by anyone, but they must have a strong argument. Users then vote and discuss on the issue during that week. The "deadline" for the proposal is one week from posting at: Monday to Thursday: 17:00 (5pm) Friday and Saturday: 20:00 (8pm) Sunday: 15:00 (3pm) Every vote should have a reason accompanying it. At any time a vote may be rejected if at least three active users believe the vote truly has no merit or was cast in bad faith. However, there must be strong reasons supporting the invalidation. "# " should be added under the last vote of each support/oppose section to show another blank line. Any proposal that has three votes or less at deadline will automatically be listed as "NO QUORUM." The original proposer then has the option to relist said proposal to generate more discussion. All proposals are archived. The original proposer must take action accordingly if the outcome of the proposal dictates it. If it requires the help of a sysop, the proposer can ask for that help. There are two topics that cannot be decided on through a proposal: the first is sysop promotions and demotions, which are decided by Bureaucrats. Secondly, no proposals calling for the creation of Banjo, Conker or Sonic series articles are allowed (several proposals supporting them have failed in recent history). The times are in EDT, and are set so that the user is more likely to be online at those times (after work/school, weekend nights). If a proposal is added on Saturday night at 11:59 PM EDT, the deadline is the next Saturday night at 8:00 PM. If it is a minute later, the deadline is a day plus 15 hours (Sunday), as opposed to a day minus 4 hours. CURRENTLY: 23:51, 25 May 2024 (EDT) New Features Super mario cartoons A few articles have information that regard the Mario cartoons as canon. For example, this can be found in Mario's biograpy: Abandoning carpentry and leaving Donkey Kong to his own devices, Mario entered the plumbing business with Luigi and formed Mario Brothers Plumbing as revealed in The Super Mario Bros. Super Show. The pair worked on plumbing from the business's headquarters, performed house calls, and also released a line of products. As the years passed, they remained financially unsuccessful, but gained a reputation for their plumbing skills and were recognized by the Grand Order of Plumbers as Plumbers of the Year in "Plumbers of the Year" despite an embarrassing appearance on David Horowitz's worldwide television show that ruined the reputation of their product line in "The Marios Fight Back" Mario and Luigi had a variety of mainly benign adventures. For example, in "Texas Tea" the brothers became rich from an oil well in their tomato garden. However, they were endangered on several occasions, such as in "Slime Busters" when the brothers were attacked by Slime Ghosts. Despite their adventures, Mario confided to Luigi in "Baby Mario Love" that he was dissatisfied with his current life, complaining it lacked glitz and glamour. Two conflicting stories of how the Mario Bros. returned to Mushroom World exist. The first originates from The Super Mario Bros. Super Show! introduction and later expanded on in "Toddler Terrors of Time Travel." Mario and Luigi were performing a house call for a slightly daft lady who hired them to fix her bathtub drain. Unknown to them, the drain was a Warp Zone connected to the Mushroom World. After Luigi cleared it, Mario and Luigi were sucked towards the drain. Mario grabbed onto the shower curtain bar, but Luigi was already in the drain's suction. Grabbing unto Mario, Luigi ended up pulling both of them down. Later, Mario and Luigi were forced to relive this event due to Ludwig von Koopa's Time Travel Tube. The events were slightly altered. Instead of struggling against the drain, Mario and Luigi openly jump through the pipe, accompanied by Toad. The three were warped from the past Earth to the present Mushroom World, ending the process of overwritting past events. The second was invented for "The Legend." While Mario ate lunch one day in Mario Brothers Plumbing, the brothers heard a cry for help through a very small pipe. Springing into action, they grabbed their plungers and followed the voice, which they later learned belonged to Princess Peach. However, Nintendo has confirmed that the Mario cartoons are non-canon. Therefore, I propose that all information like this should be removed or put into a non-canon information section. Proposer: Magikoopa67 (talk) Deadline: August 30th, 2008, 20:00 Support Magikoopa67 (talk) Per my proposal Oppose Cobold (talk) I don't see your problem. All other media are alternate-canon and are separated from the games everywhere. Time Q (talk): Per Cobold. When and where did they confirm that the cartoons are "non-canon" anyway? InfectedShroom (talk) - Per Cobold. Comments The whole CANON thing is a load of bullcrap: There,'s no official guide for wut is "canon" and what isn't, and besides, what is the point of saying "X NEVER HAPPEND" when we're still going to write about it, Anyway? On the other hand, I support rewriting the Mario biography to separate the Cartoon from the game, the whole thing is just confusing, misleading and doesn't really works. --Blitzwing 12:38, 23 August 2008 (EDT) Magikoopa67, are you going to support your own proposal or not? Pikax (talk) Also, Magikoopa67 has offered the option of putting the information from the cartoons into a separate section. Such a section exists in Princess Peach's article - Appearances in other media. I want to know why Mario's article doesn't have such a section and, right now, I put it down to terrible article writing. Pikax (talk) Stumpers (talk) queried some sysops about merging the Cartoons with the game and everyone was pretty much "YEAH YEAH DO IT", and when he did it, everyone gave him accolades. But when looking back at it, yeah, it was a terrible idea. --Blitzwing 17:43, 23 August 2008 (EDT) Splits & Merges E.T. Templates Currently, we have both Template:Alien and Template:Cosmic Species, and Garlic Man and I have had some disagreement over how it should be dealt with. I say the Alien template should be used for all species and characters not originating on the Mushroom World, while Garlic Man feels we should keep Cosmic Species. My rationalle is that typing {{Template:Alien}} is easier than {{Template:Cosmic Species}}, his is that the Cosmic Species template was around first. To avoid edit wars, I've brought the issue here, for more feedback over what we should do. Also, I feel it would be best to use this instead of the current configurations for whichever template we decide to use: it uses terms from both existing templates, and improves organization overall. Proposer: Walkazo (talk) Deadline: August 23th, 2008, 20:00 Use Alien Template Walkazo (talk) - Per myself. Stumpers (talk) - "Alien" is an in-universe term. "Cosmic Species" is not. InfectedShroom (talk) - I personally think this is a ridiculous proposal, as it is mostly about what name to use, but I like the fact that "alien" is easy to write. Oh, and if that's not enough reason, per Stumpers. The Writing Guy (talk) - Per all. For instance, Cosmic Species is just changing the name. Luigi001 (talk) Per all. Pikax (talk) - Like the proposal about changing "Species" to "Character type", "Cosmic Species" is unnecessary nitpicking. Stooben Rooben (talk) - Per Walkazo. (Yes, I did make those templates; feel free to rub the error in my face. o:) Toadette 4evur (talk) Per all. Tykyle (talk) - Per all Use Cosmic Species Template Garlic Man (talk) - Sort of contradicting on what Stumpers said; Alien, in fact, the dictionary definition is: "a resident born in or belonging to another country who has not acquired citizenship by naturalization", or a "Foreigner", or "a person who has been edtranged or exluded". What this means, is that Aliens are always something invading from somewhere else, so for instance, Shroobs are aliens, because they invaded Earth, and the Mushroom Kingdom. However, Luma is not an alien, due to the fact that it is in it's designated "home", where it belongs to be. In fact, if we twisted the definition of "Alien", we could even say Sonic is an "Alien" to the Mario series. Alien does not necessarily mean outer space, but Extraterrestial does. By saying extraterrestrial, we are signifying that the species/characters can be either ally or enemy. Aliens, although not neccesarily enemies, show that they are somewhere where they do not belong, and thus are invading, or there without permission of some sort. So, the "Extraterrestial Characters and Species" template seems more appropriate. I hope that makes my point clear. H Poke (talk) - I agre with garlic man "Alien" is someone from a different place that doesn't neccesarily mean other plent like Cosmic Beings Arend (talk) I've seen that the Cosmic Species and characters template appears to have more links then the Aliens template. So, yeah... Purple Yoshi (talk) In proper Mario games, they never use the word Alien. Anyway, Cosmic Species is more...mario-ish. Phoenix Rider (talk) See below. Comments I've only included options for one or the other now, as we can't have two templates about the same thing. Another idea I had was to limit Cosmic Species to Super Paper Mario extraterrestrial enemies, as then we might be able to include variations of the species that are found in other dimensions, but I felt this would confuse the issue a bit too much. - Walkazo (talk) Garlic Man: just because something is not native to a certain place doesn't mean they don't belong there. A Luma came to the Mushroom World, but it was born in space: it's not a native species, ergo, it is an alien. If you want to get into semantics, we can't even call these things Extraterrestrials because we're not talking about Earth we're talking about the Mushroom World. Arend: the only reason Cosmic Species has more links was because Garlic Man added them, after reverting my edit on "Aliens" that bolstered its link count, I decided to come here instead of retaliate on my own. Anyway, I stand by my assertuion that writing "Alien" is easier than "Cosmic Species", though I've designed a new template (see the last line I added to the Proposal) compromising between the two sets of terminology. - Walkazo (talk) Oh, no, Luma was NOT in the Mushroom kingdom, except at the very end of the story, if my memory is correct. Mario was the one who went to outer space to chase Bowser and Peach, and met the Lumas. The Lumas never actually went anywhere besides the observatory. Mario was the "alien" in this case. Also, saying that "Writing Alien is easier" is a lame reason, and has nothing to do with the proposal itself. Garlic Man (talk) And at the very beginning; but the point is, Lumas were on the Mushroom World, and that means they can be labeled as "aliens". This is why I suggested the compromise-template - so people won't get bent out of shape over the words. For example, Template:Fire included things that aren't actually fire, yet the name is used because it is descriptive and simple. If you want to add a template about "extraterrestrials", you'd try trying in {{Extraterrestrials}} or {{Aliens}} long before {{Cosmic Species}} comes to mind. Yes, I know you can always seek out a different article that has the template to find out the proper code, but people are lazy, and they get side-tracked (myself included). "Alien" seems like a more natural title for these creatures. - Walkazo (talk) Actually, the Cosmic species template was originally made for creatures like Cosmic Bullet Bills, Cosmic Goombas, Cosmic Bloopers, Cosmic Toads, Cosmic Tox Boxes, most of which later got merged into their respective articles. So, it became a template for any kind of species found in outer space, whether alien or non-alien, covering a wider variety of species. Garlic Man (talk) like i said in my vote aliens can refer to anything not from the same place as such Beanish are aliens to Toads Hemu (talk) Exactly. The Beanbean Kingdom and the Mushroom Kingdom were two different places; When cackletta sneaked into Peach's castle, she was an "alien"; but, not from outer space. Garlic Man (talk) Garlic Man: your template is not called, "Extraterrestrials" - it's called "Cosmic Species." So why were you arguing that extraterrestrials is better than alien if your template is called "Cosmic Species"? I'd be supporting you if you were using extraterrestrials. As to the word cosmic: "–adjective 1. of or pertaining to the cosmos: cosmic laws. 2. characteristic of the cosmos or its phenomena: cosmic events. 3. immeasurably extended in time and space; vast. 4. forming a part of the material universe, esp. outside of the earth." As you can see, cosmic has four definitions, where as extraterrestrial is, "–adjective 1. outside, or originating outside, the limits of the earth. –noun 2. an extraterrestrial being: a science fiction novel about extraterrestrials conquering the earth." In other words, extraterrestrial is much closer to what you are thinking of, especially if we use, "Extraterrestrials," because that is always a noun, and that always means "an extraterrestrical being" To the user that said aliens are not mentioned in a proper Mario game, you're wrong, but it doesn't matter: it appeared in an official Nitnendo published title (actually, all throughout the Mario Party series) and therefore should be considered official, canon, or what have you. I'm fine with using an unofficial term, but just make sure that it actually applies to the subject at hand. Stumpers (talk) So is this a proposal about which template we should use or what we should call the template? Pikax (talk) What we should call it. All subjects of the "alien" and "cosmic species" templates will be merged to the chosen template. Stumpers (talk) 12:56, 20 August 2008 (EDT) I've actually made an improved template (the link's up in the proposal too) with more species, higher organization and clearer terminology that I will put in place of whichever template is chosen. - Walkazo (talk) Just a small note, Walkazo, about your template, the Cosmic Tox Box enemy is no longer called that. ;) InfectedShroom (talk) I think the main thing that's got everyone so hung up is that the Cosmic Species template's header doesn't match. It does make it abundantly clear that we are referring to creatures from space. Whether it's official or not has no bearing on the outcome. It's about clarity. Phoenix Rider (talk) Yes, that's exactly what I'm trying to say. And saying that "Alien is a shorter word to type" seems more like an excuse than a reason; the cosmic species template, while the name is longer, is still more accurate as to what it has on the template. Everything on the Cosmic species template are "cosmic species", while not everything on the "Alien" template are not "aliens". Garlic Man (talk) Actually, the characters in the Cosmic Species template aren't "cosmic species", whereas they're all foreign to the Mushroom Planet and are aliens in that sense of the word (a sense that is made clear in the new template headers). Walkazo (talk) Mario Super Sluggers Cutscenes Currently, we have an article entitled Challenge Mode Cutscenes (Mario Super Sluggers). So my question is; is this article really needed? I mean all it is is the story of MSS in it's own article. It really doesn't have a point. Shouldn't it just be included in the main article? And having this page gives me a feeling that we need an article about cutscenes in Super Mario Galaxy, or Super Mario Sunshine. (Note how on those pages the cutscenes are merged nicely with the Story/Plot sections.) I'd also like to address the length matter. Number one: Does it really matter about how long the article is? Look at the SSBB article's story (or the Subspace Emissary in it's case.) It's extremely long, but no one is complaining about it. And second of all, I don't mean to put every single bit of information from the page in the actual article. All we need is the major details, because, like Moonshine said, we don't need to know who threw what to who. And as for the pictures, I say we use the best ones and put it right next to the story section, or, if we still want the pictures, make a gallery at the page's bottom that has them in it, and call it Challenge mode screenshots or the like. Proposer: Luigi001 (talk) Deadline: August 28, 2008, 17:00 Merge into main article Luigi001 (talk) Per myself (above and below.) Palkia47 (talk) Per 001. I don't think it would make it long; I mean, just look at the Super Smash Bros. Brawl article, it has info on just about every cutscene in the Subspace Emissary, and that article would be way longer even if the cutscenes for MSS were added to the article. Moonshine (talk) Per my comment below. As said below, if we merge it, we should shorten it significantly. King Mario (talk) Per All. The Challenge Mode stuff should be there with most of the images. Cobold (talk) Story mode of a game? Any modes don't get articles because that would leave little to say in the game's main article. Walkazo (talk) - Per all. Also, the Cutscene's page is too gaudy as it is, so merging it would be a good time to cut out the superfluous charts and screenshots. Keep Article InfectedShroom (talk) - It would be way too big with it merged. Arend (talk) - The MSS Page has enough info. Also, the cutscene article of MSS is detailed with everything what happens, for just 4 Cutscenes! And the article is already long enough to deserve a standard place on this Wiki. Other cutscenes, like SMG and SSBB aren't detailed, because there are many, many cutscenes of those games, and are long either. tanokkitails (talk)-Getting rid off them would take a while and if we merge it with anything else that article would be much longer so keeping it makes the most sense. MeritC (talk) - I also say that this should stay a separate article for the SMW. As others have pointed out on this section of the proposal, if this were to be "merged" with the main Mario Super Sluggers article, then it would be way too long. Besides, as long as this article has active links to to the main Mario Super Sluggers article page, then I don't see any need in merging the Mario Super Sluggers cutscene article. What we do need to know, however, is what criteria needs to be met to view the fourth and final cutscene so that we can make any necessary edits on that part of the cutscene article itself. Comments That's not entirely true Infected Shroom. Notice how on the SMG page there is a nice little paragraph about each cutscene. It doesn't have all that who is involved or the picture galleries. I mean, do we really need those? All we need are little paragraphs on the cutcenes, not an entire article. If we have the article, we may as well make one for every game with cutscenes. Luigi001 (talk) Yeah, it is true. First off, the SMS article doesn't have a giant table with all the characters on it. Also, the "Story" in Sluggers is supposed to be unlike the story of any other sports game. And no, technically we don't need them. It just makes for a better experience when reading the page. InfectedShroom (talk) All in all, I think that the Cutscenes page is essentially just the story of MSS, which the MSS page is missing. The story, especially in this case, is far more important that what's on the MSS page now. Why do we have an in depth explanation of Toy Field but no story? The page really needs to get it's priorities in order. It's not hard to cut down the cutscenes page. Simply merge it with the MSS page, give it it's own section entitled "story" and it's done. There's no need for each scene to have an infobox, and there's no need for 10 pics per scene either. You could put like 1 or 2 pics in the section, and get rid of the rest. Also, most of the info is unneeded and over-descriptive. We don't need to put 'who Mario threw the ball too in the intro' and things like that. If we do this then the MSS page won't be THAT long. But if we were to merge it the way it is now, I agree that it would be too long. Moonshine (talk) OK, to the opposers: IT'S AN ARTICLE ABOUT THE STORY OF A GAME! We may as well call it: Story (Mario Super Sluggers). And who really cares if it make the article too long? No one's complaining about the length of the SSBB or Mario articles! I mean seriously! Even if we put every last bit of information from the article in the MSS article, it would barely be half the size of either of the two mentioned articles! And what's so bad about taking long? There's no time limit to how long an approved proposal must take to complete it! All you have to do is copy & paste, then edit it to fit in the MSS article! Do you get my point, opposers? Luigi001 (talk) Yes, I do get your point. However, if I had total control over this wiki, I would split up the Mario and SSBB pages myself. And actually, you'd probably copy it, find a spot for it, and then paste it. 'Least, it's what I'd do. InfectedShroom (talk) But the fact is, they're not split like the MSS one. I still think that the cutscenes could, and should, be shortened if it's merged. -Moonshine (talk) Changes Princess? Currently, Rosalina's page is just called Rosalina because she is never called a princess in the games. But I found official proof. This is the first part of Rosalina's bio in Super Mario Galaxy. The whole bio can be found at the end of Rosalina's page. Not much is known about Rosalina, the lonely princess who wanders the cosmos in the Comet Observatory, a giant starship that travels the celestial expanse. Now we found proof, I think we can move the page. But before doing anything, users must agree with this. What shall we do? Proposer: Arend (talk) Deadline: August 28th, 2008, 17:00 Change to Princess Rosalina Arend (talk) Super Mario Galaxy has spoken. Tucayo (talk) Per Arend,and because she wears a crown King Mario (talk)- Per Mr.Arend YoshiAndMe10 (talk) if shes a princess than call her princess rosalina pretty simple. Dry Funky (talk) I agree with all above. Mr. Br Mario (talk) I agree with that. After all, he's using canonical information. Canonical information is the most precious information that could belong to Super Mario Wiki. So, let's do this! BeeBop! (talk) I agree with all above. As per (Princess) Rosalina's bio, she is known as a 'Princess' in Super Mario Galaxy KingYoshi64 (talk) Dat is a good idea Keep Rosalina Master Lucario (talk) Wearing a crown means nothing. I get a crown in my Burger King Kid's Meal. Am I a king? No. She's not royalty of any sort. I oppose this proposal. Garlic Man (talk) -- Whoa, whoa, wait up, here. Just because it says she IS a princess, the game never calls her by the title "Princess Rosalina". It calls her Rosalina. You know how Bowser is not King Bowser? Yeah, because he's Bowser. Nowhere is Rosalina ever fully called "Princess Rosalina". I oppose. (obviously) YellowYoshi398 (talk) - Per Garlic. Plus, even if we did discover an official mention of "Princess Rosalina," just plain Rosalina would outweigh it because it is used more often. Time Q (talk): Per Garlic Man. Just because she is something doesn't mean the article should be called that. Booster (talk) -- Per Garlic Man. Palkia47 (talk) - Per Garlic and AgentCH (below). If its not seen in the game or manual, then it probably had to be from a guide. We don't exactly allow information from guides (ie. seen in the MKWii Guide as Peach and Daisy are cousins). Stooben Rooben (talk) - Per Garlic Man. There are no citations anywhere on that page to prove that she is in fact a princess. If Nintendo has given no proof, then it is clearly speculation. LinkTheLefty (talk) - It's probably a translation error. If anyone remembers the travesty that is Sonic 2006, Blaze was called a Queen in that game's profile, yet she's supposed to be a princess. It could be a one-time thing. That, and the fact that Rosalina was a princess in concept development before ties with Peach were broken off. I think we should, however, mention it in the article... Provided it's from a tangible source (second or third party sources shouldn't make a difference). Walkazo (talk) - Per all. Moonshine (talk) - Per all. Another example being Mario. We all know he's a plumber, but we don't call him "Mario the Plumber" in the title. InfectedShroom (talk) - Per all. "Princess" is not her official title. MC Hammer Bro. (talk)- per all and see comment. Pikax (talk) - Per Garlic. We don't call Baby Daisy and Baby Peach "Baby Princess Daisy" and "Baby Princess Peach" because they're not given such titles in the games they appear in. Bob-omb buddy (talk)Per all. princess dosen't have to mean royalty. It can be discription, not a title. Dom (talk) Per all, including Master Lucario's LOL comment, and in particular Garlic Man's comment. AgentCH (talk) - Per Garlic and my own reason below. Yoshikart (talk)- I have no proof. Myles (talk) - Per Garlic Man and Pikax. I'd also like to add that we don't call Mario: Mario Mario, or Luigi: Luigi Mario. We call them what they are usually called. It should however be noted that she is a princess. Super Fuelbot (talk) - Per Garlic Man. Cobold (talk) - no source given. Check my comment below. Comments I'm leaning toward opposing, since "Princess Rosalina" is not her official title. But I'd like to hear a few more opinions, considering she is a princess. InfectedShroom (talk) I have placed a part of Rosalina's Official bio in the proposal. She is called a princess in the bio. Arend (talk) Just where is this official bio from? As has been said before, it's not said in-game that she's a princess, and I just checked the manual and it doesn't say anything either. Is this from a guide? A Prima guide, perhaps? AgentCH (talk) Wow, after I placed my oppose, there was a rush of opposes following mine... I feel Special. :P Anyway, I do also agree with AgentCH, because if it's not in-game or in-manual, then it's probably not our most reliable source. We may as well move Mario to Template:Fakelink (hey, a red link!). Garlic Man (talk) The term princess could be just a "nick name" and not a true title. The "princess that wonders the stars" Princess could be saying that she is a legondary person. Or maybe just because she is beautiful (I never said that. I've just heard people say she is ;) ). I think that it is just a play on words. MC Hammer Bro. (talk) Oh, then should Princess Peach move to Peach, and Princess Daisy to Daisy. Arend (talk) No, because (from what I know) they are both referred to as "Princess Peach" and "Princess Daisy", respectively, in the games. Rosalina is never referred to as "Princess Rosalina". Time Q (talk) Peach is called a princess, but Daisy is never called princess in every game she appeard in. In Super Mario Land, Mario just calls her Daisy. Other games she appeard in are spin-offs. Daisy (and Peach) aren't called princesses in these games. Daisy is only called a princess in game manuals. Arend (talk) But she is given at least once the title "Princess Daisy", isn't she? Because if she isn't, maybe we should think about moving her page to "Daisy" indeed. Time Q (talk) I did a little research. On the European Mario site (who doesn't exist enymore), Daisy wasn't called (unlike Peach) a princess. Nintendo said Daisy isn't called a princess in later appearences. But even in Super Mario Land, Mario didn't call her a princess. However, in Daisy's Smash Bros Melee a trophy discription, she is in one line called Princess Daisy (this is the only time she is called Princess Daisy in a game), but the title of the trophy still is just Daisy. Manuals also make great use of Princess Daisy. This is the only in game refearence I found. I Mario Smash Football/Super Mario Strikers, when you select Peach, Peach will say Pricess Peach, but if you select Daisy, Daisy will say just Daisy. Arend (talk) Bio where? Page what? The proposal fails to cite its references. The question in the comments wasn't answered. Enough reason to oppose. - Cobold (talk) 16:43, 23 August 2008 (EDT) I found this bio on Rosalina's page. I thought it was from the American game manual. I don't live in the US or UK. Game manuals can differ per region. I was wrong. Arend (talk)