Talk:Unwinnable state

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Bad title?[edit]

I'm not sure if this is an accurate title. By "unwinnable", the first thing that comes to my mind is the points at which the player encounters a level or boss fight that is literally "unbeatable"; as in, they are quickly defeated before they can actually beat the boss. (Mario and Luigi fighting the Shroobs from Hollijolli Village from Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time is a perfect example of what I'm talking about.) Perhaps we can move this page to "Unattainable progress" and redelegate the information about softlocking to the glitch lists. Any suggestions? Toadette icon CTTT.pngArchivistToadettefont.png(T|C) 15:51, March 13, 2019 (EDT)

Just "softlock" could work, but I'm not sure about the 100% section. Alex95sig1.pngAlex95sig2.png 15:55, March 13, 2019 (EDT)
As I've said, I don't think softlocks need to be covered on their own page when they can do just fine on the glitch list pages. Toadette icon CTTT.pngArchivistToadettefont.png(T|C) 16:07, March 13, 2019 (EDT)
Thing is, aside from the Minus World, the unwinnible situations listed so far are really more of oversights than glitches. Alex95sig1.pngAlex95sig2.png 16:10, March 13, 2019 (EDT)
I also support moving this page to "softlock". Something doesn't quite roll off the tongue right...probably because the term "unwinnable" has heavy colloquial connotations as compared to softlock, which sounds more encyclopedic and...well less colloquial. BabyLuigiFire.png Ray Trace(T|C) 16:13, March 13, 2019 (EDT)
Eh, "softlock" sounds rather jargonistic IMO Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:16, March 13, 2019 (EDT)

"Unwinnable" absolutely is the standard term for situations in video games where you can play but can't progress: it has a long history, is the name of the TV Tropes page describing the event and a google search for "unwinnable video games" bring up far more relevant and unique results, nearly all of which are about what is described here and not in fact about scripted battles in RPGs you can't win, which demonstrates to me the concern about potential confusion is unfounded. "Softlock" is also an accepted term and could work, but it's not self-descriptive and a a google search brings less unique results before trailing off about business software solutions and other things unrelated to video games, showing it's a more niche and less commonly used term (and though entirely subjective, I would agree with Doc von Schmeltwick's assertion above it is a very jargony word).

If the fact the 2nd paragraph of the page clears up any potential confusion isn't enough, I could suppose moving the title to "Unwinnable state" could be a compromise as it makes it obvious it's about a prolonged situation and not a mandatory speed bump in the progression of a game. Either way, it's not being moved to "Unattainable progress" because that's a terrible title lol --Glowsquid (talk) 20:27, March 13, 2019 (EDT)

"Unwinnable state" works for me as well. Toadette icon CTTT.pngArchivistToadettefont.png(T|C) 21:12, March 13, 2019 (EDT)

Re: Softlock patches[edit]

Would the removal of unwinnable scenarios in later ports of a game be noteworthy enough to add here? --ExdeathIcon.png Lord G. matters. ExdeathIcon.png 00:40, July 20, 2019 (EDT)

Yes. --Glowsquid (talk) 17:39, August 28, 2019 (EDT)

Sticker Star battles[edit]

In Paper Mario: Sticker Star, running out of stickers in a battle leaves you with the option to flee from a battle. However, some battles, particularily those against bosses, are pretty much impossible to run away from. This leaves you with the option of having the enemy kill you slowly until a Game Over, or resetting the game. I think maybe we should make note of this situation in this article, since it's a practically unwinnable situation that you can only escape from with "brute force". -- KOOPA CON CARNE 09:17, August 9, 2020 (EDT)

Doesn't the game give you jump and hammer stickers if your album is empty?
'Shroom Spotlight Shokora (talk · edits) 09:31, August 9, 2020 (EDT)
It does give you more stickers, but the conditions seem arbitrary. In some battles, I happened to get stickers even though I had plenty more useful ones to dispose of, but the game went whoopsie daisy in the final Bowser battle when I blanked all of my sticker book pages and had to let him kill me as a result. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 10:03, August 9, 2020 (EDT)
Interesting. Though it could be compared to running out of PP in Pokemon games, and having enough stickers is a deliberate game strategy.
'Shroom Spotlight Shokora (talk · edits) 10:17, August 9, 2020 (EDT)