Template talk:NSMBU challenge

Delete

Okay so like, the articles for each individual challenge in Challenge Mode (New Super Mario Bros. U) are not long. They have no business having two infoboxes, one with some of the data (Template:Level infobox has difficulty and a overall time limit) and the other with the rest of the data (Template:NSMBU challenge, which has everything but difficulty? Huh?). Why are we making readers hop between two different infoboxes anyway? We should just make a single infobox that has all of the data. And further, it should be a tweak of Level infobox that replaces it on applicable pages (Category:New Super Mario Bros. U challenges) not this template's weird stats/bestiary approach to the topic. We are fundamentally talking about a portion of a video game's structure, like Level infobox, and not a character within it, like Template:M&SATOWG Wii stats (Seriously, this is the best stat template I could find. Every other one is a "template for template's sake" and therefore bad.) Salmancer (talk) 17:50, August 1, 2025 (EDT)

To demonstrate the point, please compare the following revisions of Acorn Plains Speed Run:

• Before Template:NSMBU challenge
• After Template:NSMBU challenge

"Before" is the one that reads better, right? Salmancer (talk) 17:54, August 1, 2025 (EDT)

Support from me. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 17:59, August 1, 2025 (EDT)

100%, this template is completely unnecessary. — eviemaybe (talk / contributions) 12:23, August 7, 2025 (EDT)

I agree with deleting. Maybe make a proposal to formalize the decision? — Lady Sophie ^(T|C) 07:26, August 8, 2025 (EDT)

Writing proposals is a lot of trouble though. And on top of regular "write convincing argument" and "do the formatting right", the only way to do this topic justice in proposal terms is to actually have a replacement infobox ready to go. I have no clue how infoboxes work; so making that replacement would probably take a while. I was kind of hoping to not have to go all the way up to a proposal but I guess I can put this on the to-do list. Salmancer (talk) 00:04, August 11, 2025 (EDT)

Delete and replace with something different

This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit this section or its subsections. If you wish to discuss the article, please do so in a new section below the proposal.

Delete this template and instate Level infobox 8-1-0

New Super Mario Bros. U challenge
Acorn Plains Speed Run
Category	Time Attack
Course	Acorn Plains-1
Difficulty	★
Primary power-up	Super Acorn
Time limit	70
Goal	Goal Pole
Music track	Ground Theme
Challenge progression ← Previous Time Attack Trial Next → Full Speed Ahead New Super Mario Bros. U challenges

(Everyone who has read the above section please skip this recap paragraph.) Template:NSMBU challenge is kind of bad. In specific, it seems to exist for the sole purpose of putting more templates on pages. This is antithetical to the point of a template, which is to quickly communicate key information to readers and save writers the time they would spend writing sentences for boring system data like how each level's time limit. Worse, every article with this infobox already has Template:Level infobox, meaning readers have to flick between two infoboxes to find the all of the challenge's data, which indirectly weakens the usefulness of Level infobox. Why does only Level infobox have difficulty, but then this infobox have the course and the category? Plus, it just looks silly having two infoboxes this close together. Look at Hot Hidden-Coin Hunt for exactly that. (It's as bad as it is because the challenge has no enemies and therefore lacks a enemies section, which would stall for space and make Template:NSMBU challenge look slightly better.) Plus, NSMBU challenge is based on profile and bestiary navboxes in having a horizontal layout, but challenges in New Super Mario Bros. U are essentially chunks of gameplay. They have more in common with levels than entities, therefore they have no business using the horizontal infobox structure normally reserved for them. To conclude this recap, please look at Hot Hidden-Coin Hunt from before the edit that added the NSMBU challenge infobox. It just looks better than the current revision.

While we could just delete this template and put the information moved into it back into each article's body, and that is in fact an option for this proposal, I have a more constructive idea. There are 70 challenges in New Super Mario Bros. U, enough for Nintendo to ship an entire game of just New Super Mario Bros. U's challenges. Definitely enough for one infobox on each article to add uniformity and convenience to readers. Level infobox isn't quite the one though, challenges technically aren't levels as the level is an element of the challenge. Using level infobox on these pages is ignoring valuable nuance. Instead, we should make a new infobox based on Level infobox that has all the data NSMBU challenge has, then replace both Template:NSMBU challenge and Template:Level infobox with the new one! My example is at User:Salmancer/template NSMBU challenge infobox. You can see an example next to this proposal, based on Acorn Plains Speed Run. It is a kitbash of Template:Level infobox that grabs a few parameters from Template:NSMBU challenge then adds a few new ones. (I hesitate to call it a combination, being that I didn't reference NSMBU challenge at all except for what its parameters are, hence why this proposal is for deleting NSMBU challenge and not editing it.) Here are notes on what changes I made from Level infobox and what changes I didn't make.

• Added parameter "category" (for the challenge category of the challenge, like Time Attack or Boost Mode.)
• Added parameter "goal" (for the object that ends the challenge, which can only be Goal Pole, Goal ring (New Super Mario Bros. U), or in one case, Star Coin. It is not for coins or enemies, even if they do cause a challenge to be cleared.)
• Added parameter "course" (for the course the challenge is using, written as a level code to match the game's presentation. Use Original Course if there's no listed course, just like the game does.)
• Changed parameter image to specifically use the image that the game displays alongside the challenge. (If the game gives the wiki a fit for purpose glamour shot for every challenge, we might as well use it. The existing images can be put into Gallery sections instead.)
• Changed parameter difficulty to only display full stars (★) and not empty stars (☆). (More closely matches the game's presentation.)
• Changed powerup parameter to allow for power-ups the player starts with, in addition to what power-up most frequently appears in the course as normal. (Felt like an obvious tweak given the many cases where a challenge requires the player to be in a specific form.)
• Removed parameter directory (Since this is only for the challenges in New Super Mario Bros. U, the link to the full list is just baked into the template)
• Removed parameter objective (This isn't applicable to challenges. While it could be used for the challenge's description, I prefer them being the page quote. It's not like there's even competition for the page quote, given I doubt Play Nintendo has come up with something snappy for these. Also an infobox like Level infobox should avoid using multiple sentences if it can help it, because they get scrunched up by the format. If somehow Play Nintendo does give us some quote options, I would reinstate this parameter for the challenge's description.)
• Removed parameter game (There's only one game these challenges are in, and its in the title. Given the Switch game lacking Boost Mode challenges is a system restriction rather than any deliberate choice, I think readers will understand the situation better by checking the main article of Challenge Mode (New Super Mario Bros. U).)
• Removed parameters world, id, style, theme, turns, cr_limit, target, squad_level, and wonder (All not applicable to this subject)
• Did not add a "medal" parameter. (I personally feel like its better to have something as important and fundamental as how the challenge is graded in the body of the article. We also should try to avoid having really empty article bodies if we can help it, and some of the challenges that use existing courses would have a body that I feel is too empty without the Medals section.)

To repeat for people just in case, this infobox replaces both Template:NSMBU challenge and Template:Level infobox on all of the articles in Category:New Super Mario Bros. U challenges.

Please note that this proposal is specifically about creating a new template to use on the pages for challenges in New Super Mario Bros. U in place of Level infobox. The exact parameters and form factor of the replacement are not set in stone; we can change them if we want, like if we want to put the description into the infobox or not have a parameter for goals. Maybe it should instead be a general challenge infobox instead for something like the day a Nintendo World Championships: NES Edition-alike is released that is fully within the wiki's coverage or another game releases with a challenge mode. If it does become a general challenge infobox, there would be changes in order, like reinstating the game and directory parameters.

Proposer: Salmancer (talk)
Deadline: August 26, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Delete Template:NSMBU challenge, instate Salmancer's version of Level infobox

1. Salmancer (talk) Per proposal.
2. EvieMaybe (talk) per proposal.
3. Camwoodstock (talk) Looks good to us, and while we'd personally add a medals parameter, we can understand the thought process as to why it's not here/why it should be acknowledged in prose, and it's not a dealbreaker by any means. Per proposal.
4. Waluigi Time (talk) Per proposal.
5. LadySophie17 (talk) Excellently made template and explanation. Per proposal.
6. Rering644 (talk) Per proposal.
7. BMfan08 (talk) Proposal per.
8. Technetium (talk) Per proposal.

Delete Template:NSMBU challenge, do not instate Salmancer's version of Level infobox

1. Salmancer (talk) I mean, if you want to hurt my feelings... *sniff* Nah, being silly. But maybe there was a reason we never made an infobox specifically for the challenges? And also I just don't like NSMBU challenge so if my attempt isn't good enough I still don't want to use NSMBU challenge.

Comments (Delete Template:NSMBU challenge)

In case the template gets deprecated, I do believe that we should use the {{multilang profile}} instead. Right? GuntherBayBeee 19:36, August 12, 2025 (EDT)

We could, but somewhat oddly the challenge descriptions are probably outside the scope of in Template:Multilang profile. Here's the problem: for the most part a profile is in some way an addendum to the content. The content, the level or character or kart or what have you, can stand on its own without the profile. "The armored Warrior Wagon flies its banner high as it races to battle! Its special skill is Mini-Turbo Plus. Aim for a high score by performing a Mini-Turbo!" is simply not that important in the grand scheme of things. The challenge description is the crux of the challenge as it contains the player's objective and any rules they need to follow. It needs to be closer to the top of the page than the bottom, Template:Multilang profile was always designed as a template that goes in a Profiles section, and Profiles sections are usually among the bottom sections of a page. Long story short, I think the English challenge description should be the page quote, and therefore not in Template:Multilang profile. We can have a "Descriptions in other languages" section that uses Template:Multilang profile, but I think the English line(s) in specific stay(s) out of it. Salmancer (talk) 02:58, August 13, 2025 (EDT)

Here's a better idea. We can use a "Profiles" section for both the English line(s) and the lines in other language. Wouldn't that be great? GuntherBayBeee 09:29, August 13, 2025 (EDT)

I'm still down on printing a line of text at the top of the page, and then printing the same line of text near the bottom of the page. Worse, there's another part of Template:Multilang profile that complicates this. When collapsed, it only displays the English line. Readers would understandably look at it and say we're just repeating text to fill time. (They'd miss the "show" button, I'm sure of it.) Salmancer (talk) 19:53, August 15, 2025 (EDT)

@GuntherBayBeee But that's not what the purpose of {{multilang profile}} even is! Multilang profile is exclusively made for profile descriptions, and nothing else. It cannot convey what type of challenge it is, which times need to be met in order to get which medal, and now in which course the challenge takes place. At that point, it would be better to get rid of that profile infobox template and re-implement its parameters into the proper infobox template at the beginning of the article. rend (talk) (edits) 01:19, August 18, 2025 (EDT)

Sorry for the late reply. Actually, I'm just talking about using only the in-game descriptions for the {{multilang profile}} template. GuntherBayBeee 15:27, August 20, 2025 (EDT)

That description can either also be implemented in the proposed infobox template, or be placed in a {{quote}} template on top of the page, much like the Mario Kart Tour mission types. Trust me, we don't need a whole Profiles section on a short challenge article for covering only one short description blurb. rend (talk) (edits) 17:51, August 21, 2025 (EDT)