User:Sorbetti/Proposalmaker
Split Piscatory Pete from Cheep Cheep (Second Lap)
This is the second attempt to separate Pete Piscatory from Cheep Cheep. This time, the proposal will address the flaws of the previous one and some of the opposition's comments. I kindly invite you to read it; you won't lose anything.
The previous proposal had several flaws ; this one won't. We know that there are several guides that classify Pete Piscatory as a different version of Flopsy Fish (Cheep Cheep), since they treat him as the aquatic version of the latter . That was the point that failed in the previous proposal. It doesn't matter if there are guides that classify them as different because, if the only difference is that it is underwater, why should he have his own page if that's how Cheep Cheeps work in all games? I have to admit that this was wrong on my part. I provided arguments for why these enemies were different, but I didn't explain why it would be beneficial to divide them. What can we say about Pete Piscatory that we can't say about Cheep Cheep?
Pete Piscatory is distinguished from Cheep Cheep in numerous sources, and even within the Yoshi's Island DS museum. This distinction has remained consistent, unlike other enemies such as the two types of Baron von Zeppelin, who, despite initially being seen as distinct enemies, were ultimately identified as Enemī Fūsen. Despite also being distinct, they share the same space in the Yoshi's Island DS museum. This demonstrates that Pete has maintained consistency regarding these distinctions. Furthermore, even the Shogakukan guides, which were the only ones to initially state that Pete and Cheep Cheep were the same, eventually separated them in later guides.
do not split 4-9
While before the only official guide we had classified them as the same enemy, recently in a discussion, another oficcial guide was discovered that does give it its own name in Japanese, which although it means Underwater Pukupuku, it is still a different name, this accompanied by the different names in other languages that also separate them, also the Yoshi Island DS museum where they are also separated as different individuals, and more importantly, thanks to an investigation by LinkTheLefty, it was found that Pete Piscatoryhas has his assets separated from Cheep Cheep assets.
All of the above without mentioning that Piscatory Pete has a sub-variant that is capable of chasing Yoshi, behavior that has not been seen separately from the enemy.
Proposer: Sorbetti (talk)
Deadline: April 1, 2025, 23:59 GMT
Split Fishy(Support)
Keep Fishy Merged(Oppose)
- Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) - A majority of sources in both Japanese and English treat these just as Cheep Cheeps, the most "primary" Japanese guide outright lists them together (the guide you mentioned, which is not of the usual Kōshiki guide series, is an outlier), and YNI and YWW use the same Cheep Cheep model for both the jumping and swimming types; the only differences in behavior are due to how Submarine/other-swimming-type Yoshi has changed. The fact that a separate-looking blue or yellow fish does not exist in YNI while swimming red or green ones do, despite the amount of other direct enemy throwbacks the game has, demonstrates the developers see it as an ordinary Cheep Cheep. Note the other enemies that are commonly recurring also have their designs updated in that game rather than using SNES-accurate designs like the ones that are pretty much exclusive to the series are given, even when that results in design inconsistencies between them and the "base" type (like with Propeller Piranha's spots, which still resemble SNES Piranha Plants' despite Piranha Plants themselves being given a modern design). Anyways, if they are split, "Cheep Cheep" with an identifier would be the name since that's the most current, and the English YIDS guides treated it as the game's "normal" Cheep Cheeps.
<-Also these look pretty similar to me, at least.
() -At least with Sky Blooper, regular Bloopers are usually not found flying. Cheep Cheeps, on the other hand, are already usually found underwater. They are fish. Splitting this game's underwater Cheep Cheeps would be strange.
-Cheep Cheeps are already primarily underwater, and Piscatory Pete's been renamed to "Cheep Cheep" since Yoshi's Island DS. I think splitting Pete from the other Cheeps entirely due to an alternate Japanese name that already translates to "Underwater Cheep Cheep" is gonna be quite a mess.
- Piscatory Pete is basically the trap for "Japanese name's different, so it must always be different". No, being named Pete in another country is not enough of a difference for what looks like a Cheep Cheep, what moves like a Cheep Cheep, and what acts like a Cheep Cheep. Dare we say it, the difference between a Cheep Cheep and Piscatory Pete is no larger than the differences between your ordinary Fighter Flies and your "Nakaji"
-It walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, so it's a duck.
