12,672
edits
Talk:Mushroom: Difference between revisions
→Split Mushrooms based on their Roles
7feetunder (talk | contribs) |
|||
| (26 intermediate revisions by 11 users not shown) | |||
| Line 120: | Line 120: | ||
==Move Super Mushroom information to [[Super Mushroom]]== | ==Move Super Mushroom information to [[Super Mushroom]]== | ||
{{SettledTPP}} | {{SettledTPP}} | ||
{{ProposalOutcome|passed | {{ProposalOutcome|passed|4-0|split}} | ||
Yeah, I was the idiot who added all the Super Mushroom information to the Mushroom article. Anyway, this article is supposed to be dealing with types of Mushrooms, but I somehow screwed up and added the Super Mushroom information in this article. I say we move it to the Super Mushroom article, since it should specifically deal with Super Mushrooms. It's basically the same issue I had with [[Egg]] and [[Yoshi Egg]]. | Yeah, I was the idiot who added all the Super Mushroom information to the Mushroom article. Anyway, this article is supposed to be dealing with types of Mushrooms, but I somehow screwed up and added the Super Mushroom information in this article. I say we move it to the Super Mushroom article, since it should specifically deal with Super Mushrooms. It's basically the same issue I had with [[Egg]] and [[Yoshi Egg]]. | ||
| Line 306: | Line 306: | ||
== Split Dash Mushroom from this article == | == Split Dash Mushroom from this article == | ||
{{SettledTPP}} | |||
{{ | {{ProposalOutcome|passed|5-0|split}} | ||
I wanted to wait until a fourth game gave the Mushrooms this name and function just to be certain that they appear to be considered different. Now that ''[[Super Mario Party]]'' again names them Dash Mushrooms, I think it's about time we split these. They function noticeably different from the Mushrooms both in ''[[Mario Party 2]]'' and ''[[Mario Party Advance]]'' (Dash Mushrooms add three to the player's roll, whereas MP2's Mushrooms simply add a second Dice Block and MPA's Mushrooms grant Dice Block rolls), and we have certain items split from the parent item simply because they perform slightly different functions ([[Max Mushroom]] is split from [[Mushroom]] even though both are healing items that simply heal different amounts of HP). I'm also proposing that Golden Dash Mushroom be split from Golden Mushroom, since again it's a differently named item that performs a different function from a similar-looking item in the same series (Golden Dash Mushrooms add five to the player's roll, whereas MP2's Golden Mushrooms simply add a second and third Dice Block). | I wanted to wait until a fourth game gave the Mushrooms this name and function just to be certain that they appear to be considered different. Now that ''[[Super Mario Party]]'' again names them Dash Mushrooms, I think it's about time we split these. They function noticeably different from the Mushrooms both in ''[[Mario Party 2]]'' and ''[[Mario Party Advance]]'' (Dash Mushrooms add three to the player's roll, whereas MP2's Mushrooms simply add a second Dice Block and MPA's Mushrooms grant Dice Block rolls), and we have certain items split from the parent item simply because they perform slightly different functions ([[Max Mushroom]] is split from [[Mushroom]] even though both are healing items that simply heal different amounts of HP). I'm also proposing that Golden Dash Mushroom be split from Golden Mushroom, since again it's a differently named item that performs a different function from a similar-looking item in the same series (Golden Dash Mushrooms add five to the player's roll, whereas MP2's Golden Mushrooms simply add a second and third Dice Block). | ||
| Line 317: | Line 317: | ||
===Support=== | ===Support=== | ||
#{{User|Toadette the Achiever}} Per my proposal. | #{{User|Toadette the Achiever}} Per my proposal. | ||
#{{User|Kolafloro}} It has been done before, so, per proposal. | |||
#{{User|George Jones}} Per all. | |||
#{{User|Yoshi the SSM}} After some thinking, sure. Per proposal. | |||
#{{User|Owencrazyboy9}} Per all. | |||
===Oppose=== | ===Oppose=== | ||
| Line 322: | Line 326: | ||
===Comments=== | ===Comments=== | ||
And what about the ''Mario Kart'' ones that use that name in the PAL version of one game? [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 13:32, 19 June 2018 (EDT) | And what about the ''Mario Kart'' ones that use that name in the PAL version of one game? [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 13:32, 19 June 2018 (EDT) | ||
:Besides regional differences, I meant... (and yes, I ''will'' make a note of that via an {{tem|about}} template in the proposed article) {{User:Toadette the Achiever/sig}} 13:59, 19 June 2018 (EDT) | |||
As for other items that aren't covered by the proposal, but appear as items in Island Tour: | |||
*Setback Shell: too similar to the regular [[Green Shell]] and no other Mario Party appearance, so I say no. | |||
*Backwards Bill: There are [[Bullet Bill Orb|two other]] [[Bullet Candy|Bullet Bill items]] split from the [[Bullet Bill]] page. And this is different from both. So, Absolutely. | |||
*Blooper Chopper: Maybe. I mean, later the [[Blooper]] covers the screen with ink in [[Coinathlon]], but that is effecting a minigame, not the board. I say possibly. | |||
*Lightning Score Striker: Same as Blooper Chopper... except that it doesn't resemble what [[Lightning]] does. | |||
*Lakitu's Leech: One other appearance as an [[Lakitu Orb|item]] before and it is split from [[Lakitu]], but it is exactly like that item except it is just items now. I don't know, but possibly yes. | |||
*Super Star: Same name, no other appearances in Mario Party, makes sense for it to act like this. I say absolutely no. | |||
*Crazy Kamek and Chaos Kamek: Considering [[Kamek Orb]] is split from [[Kamek]], and both are different from Kamek Orb, I say yes. | |||
{{User:Yoshi the Space Station Manager/sig}} 20:05, 2 July 2018 (EDT) | |||
== Split Mushrooms based on their Roles == | |||
{{SettledTPP}} | |||
{{ProposalOutcome|failed|1-5|don't split}} | |||
Okay, so this page has seen its fair share of proposals. But given the ongoing [[Talk:Golden Mushroom#Split this page's distinct items|proposal concerning the Golden Mushrooms]] and the recent [[Talk:Super Mushroom#Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) here|Super Mushroom proposal]], I feel confident throwing this idea out there; splitting this big Mushroom into smaller Mushrooms based on their roles. So far, this page is covering the standard Mushroom as a healing item, an extra dice block and a boosting item. The Golden Mushroom is currently seeing a similar, if not the same, situation and I feel it's fine to apply it here too. I'm thinking at least three different articles for these Mushrooms, as followed: | |||
*'''Mushroom''': Keeping the page's original name, this would talk about the Mushroom as a boosting item, including its roles in the ''Mario Kart series'', ''Mario Tennis series'', ''Mario & Sonic series'' and its appearance as an item in ''Mario Golf: World Tour'', as all these instances include a boost in movement speed, be it for the player or golf ball. | |||
*'''Mushroom (''Mario Party series'')''': This article would talk about the Mushroom's act as an item in the ''Mario Party series'', including its 2, 3, 5, 6 and 7 appearances. That being said, since the most recent name would be the '''Mushroom Orb''', that name could also be used, as it's the most recent. | |||
*'''Mushroom (healing item)''': This article would talk about the Mushroom's role as a healing item, including its appearances in ''Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars'', the ''Paper Mario series'' and the ''Mario & Luigi series''. The naming would be consistent with the Super Mushroom (healing item). I can also argue that the Mushroom from the Luigi's Mansion remake could also be merged here, though that depends on the naming of that particular mushroom. | |||
The two other instances merged here are the ''Super Mario Bros. 2'' Mushroom and the ''Mario Clash'' mushroom. ''Super Mario Bros. 2'' seems like a bit of a mix between a healing item (as it grants an extra heart upon use) and the power-up (granting the ''Super'' form if in the Small form) while the ''Mario Clash'' mushroom seems to do something different entirely. I'd kinda support the idea of making the ''Mario Clash'' mushroom its own article too while merging the Mushroom from ''Super Mario Bros. 2'' to the Super Mushroom page. However, that might be dealing with more than this proposal is initially suggesting. | |||
'''Proposer''': {{User|Tails777}}<br> | |||
'''Deadline''': August 6, 2021, 23:59 GMT | |||
===Support=== | |||
#{{User|Tails777}} For now, I feel splitting the core three examples are the best option. The concern of other two is up for discussion. | |||
===Oppose=== | |||
#{{User|Keyblade Master}} We don't usually split items just because of functionality (especially if the games are different genres), as far as I'm aware these mushrooms have the same name and appearances between the games, most of these even the same basic effect of healing so I don't mind keeping it on the same page. The Golden Mushroom situation on the other hand is to do with the types having different names in Japan. | |||
#{{User|Somethingone}} Are we seriously going to disambiguate every single item page just because they have different functions? I was originally on the fence with the Golden Mushroom one but I was convinced after the whole “different name and style” thing, but this is just going too far. These mushrooms look exactly the same and they don’t have a different name. We shouldn’t split items just because the game series they are in has different mechanics from other game series that they are also in. What’s next? Splitting Banana Peel from Banana because one is a hazard? Splitting the Mario Kart coins because they increase the player’s speed? Splitting the SM3DW Shells because you can ride them? It’s really unnecessary. Unless they have an actual difference that DOESN’T tie to the game they are in having a different genre/style, They should stay merged. | |||
#{{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} Completely arbitrary, per all. Also, regarding the MK series one, [[Talk:Dash Mushroom|please see here]]. | |||
#{{User|Hewer}} Personally, I think that most if not all of this page should be merged to the Super Mushroom page for similar reasons to Somethingone's vote, and I feel like this proposal passing would make the problem of random iterations of the Super Mushroom being picked and chosen to be on different pages worse. | |||
#{{User|7feetunder}} I'm just going to quote what I said [[Talk:Super Mushroom#Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) and the old Mario Party Golden Mushroom?|here]]: ''"You might as well say that [[Blue Coin]]s from Super Mario Sunshine should be split because that's the only game where they're a finite collectible instead of being worth 1 or 5 regular coins, or [[Warp Pipe Orb]]s from Mario Party 7 should be split for having a different function from the previous games. Or that [[Shine Sprite]]s in Thousand-Year Door should be split because they aren't used to power up partners in any other game. Difference in function alone, especially between games in different genres, does not warrant a split."'' | |||
===Comments=== | |||
@Hewer I think merging this whole page with Super Mushroom would just clutter it a bit too much. [[Talk:Piranha Plant#Fire-spitting Piranha Plants|This discussion]] basically shows the road we should take for this sort of thing. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} 15:26, July 23, 2021 (EDT) | |||
:My viewpoint is that the mushrooms on the Mushroom page are Super Mushrooms with different effects for different genres (I don't think it's a coincidence that most of them look exactly the same), and some of them being called 'Mushroom' while others are called 'Super Mushroom' I don't think is a very good distinction (if [[Talk:Super Mushroom#Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) here|this proposal]] passes, then some healing mushrooms in RPGs would be on the Mushroom page and others would be on the Super Mushroom page, simply because of the names). There are also much bigger name differences than Super Mushroom and Mushroom that are merged (for example, [[Boss Bass]], [[Big Bertha]] and [[Big Cheep Cheep]] are all merged). At most I might consider splitting Dash Mushroom for its effect difference seemingly being very loosely based (if at all) on the Super Mushroom's effect and its unique name, but even that is pushing it. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 16:09, July 23, 2021 (EDT) | |||
::In the RPGs at least, Mushrooms and Super Mushrooms appear together and are treated as seperate items. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} 16:17, July 23, 2021 (EDT) | |||
@Doc von Schmeltwick: I wouldn't say this is arbitrary, I'd just say I'm thinking of the situation in the reverse. I'm not saying either or is right or wrong and I went into this thinking if it fails, it fails, no big deal. I just see this in a different light. I didn't go into this without any thought, I just went in with a different perspective, that's all. {{User:Tails777/sig}} | |||