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| Can [[Bowser]] enter/terrorize Toad Town in [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]]? Or can only [[Mario]] and [[Luigi]] enter?<br> | | Can [[Bowser]] enter/terrorize Toad Town in [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]]? Or can only [[Mario]] and [[Luigi]] enter?<br> |
| [[File:Mr. L.jpg|25px]] [[User:Ultimate Mr. L|<span style="color:green">Ultimate Mr. L</span>]] ([[User talk:Ultimate Mr. L|<span style="color:black">Talk</span>]]) 14:47, 4 October 2016 (EDT) | | [[File:Mr L Render.png|25px]] [[User:Ultimate Mr. L|<span style="color:green">Ultimate Mr. L</span>]] ([[User talk:Ultimate Mr. L|<span style="color:black">Talk</span>]]) 14:47, 4 October 2016 (EDT) |
| :It is more like passing though while playing as him. Only two Toads appear when Bowser enters the south entrance, but only one time. I am not sure about the north entrance. The southern Toads run away at the sight of Bowser. {{User:Yoshi the Space Station Manager/sig}} 14:52, 4 October 2016 (EDT) | | :It is more like passing though while playing as him. Only two Toads appear when Bowser enters the south entrance, but only one time. I am not sure about the north entrance. The southern Toads run away at the sight of Bowser. {{User:Yoshi the Space Station Manager/sig}} 14:52, 4 October 2016 (EDT) |
| ::Bowser can enter but he will not be able to jump. --{{User:A gossip-loving Toad/sig}} 06:37, 15 October 2016 (EDT) | | ::Bowser can enter but he will not be able to jump. --{{User:A gossip-loving Toad/sig}} 06:37, 15 October 2016 (EDT) |
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| == Infobox Image == | | == Infobox Image == |
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| | {{talk}} |
| I don't think Toad Town is actually the confirmed location in Super Mario Galaxy, which is used in the infobox. I think an image of Toad Town in either Paper Mario, Paper Mario: The Origami King or Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story would be a lot more accurate. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} 16:49, August 18, 2020 (EDT) | | I don't think Toad Town is actually the confirmed location in Super Mario Galaxy, which is used in the infobox. I think an image of Toad Town in either Paper Mario, Paper Mario: The Origami King or Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story would be a lot more accurate. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} 16:49, August 18, 2020 (EDT) |
| :I'm going to remove the Galaxy and Galaxy 2 sections, because whoever wrote that was assuming. <s>The infobox image looks ulgy too.</s> {{User:DarkNight/sig}} 17:10, August 18, 2020 (EDT) | | :I'm going to remove the Galaxy and Galaxy 2 sections, because whoever wrote that was assuming. <s>The infobox image looks ulgy too.</s> {{User:DarkNight/sig}} 17:10, August 18, 2020 (EDT) |
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| ==Remove content related to Super Mario Galaxy games== | | ==Remove content related to Super Mario Galaxy games== |
| {{SettledTPP}} | | {{TPP}} |
| {{ProposalOutcome|passed|8-3|Remove content}}
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| Following some responses from the discussion I started above, it seems like all mentions of Toad Town in these games are better off removed. There do not seem to be any official references that the areas in these games are labeled as Toad Town, and the area in the first game is labeled as "Castle Gardens" (which even has [[Castle Gardens|its own article]]) in the pause menu. The article itself even speculates it being Toad Town. | | Following some responses from the discussion I started above, it seems like all mentions of Toad Town in these games are better off removed. There do not seem to be any official references that the areas in these games are labeled as Toad Town, and the area in the first game is labeled as "Castle Gardens" (which even has [[Castle Gardens|its own article]]) in the pause menu. The article itself even speculates it being Toad Town. |
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| #{{User|Waluigi Time}} I think this proposal should've waited for further investigation to make sure nothing says it's Toad Town in either of these games, but with our current knowledge there's no reason to keep it here. | | #{{User|Waluigi Time}} I think this proposal should've waited for further investigation to make sure nothing says it's Toad Town in either of these games, but with our current knowledge there's no reason to keep it here. |
| #{{User|Toadette the Achiever}} Best to just relegate the info to Castle Gardens, especially since there's no mention of Toad Town anywhere in those two games. Per all. | | #{{User|Toadette the Achiever}} Best to just relegate the info to Castle Gardens, especially since there's no mention of Toad Town anywhere in those two games. Per all. |
| #{{User|Mister Wu}} [[User talk:Mister Wu/30th Anniversary Books Related Questions/Archive 1|The Japanese ''Encyclopedia Super Mario Bros.'' also rather refers to both villages as the venue of the Star Festival]], so yeah, better to avoid implying there is a continuity with spin-offs that is not explicitly stated.
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| #{{User|TheFlameChomp}} Per proposal.
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| #{{User|Benjaminkirsc}} Per all and proposal. No sources even said anything about any content of Super Mario Galaxy series.
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| #{{User|Superbound}} Per proposal
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| ===Keep=== | | ===Keep=== |
| #{{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}} Per LTL in the comments, the closest thing to a "direct" name is "Peach Castle Town," itself resembling an alternate Toad Town JP name anyway.
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| #{{user|LinkTheLefty}} What I said below: it seems more prudent to merge Castle Gardens with Toad Town, but that'll be a separate discussion at this rate.
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| #{{user|Seandwalsh}} Per LinkTheLefty. Couldn’t have put it better myself.
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| ===Comments=== | | ===Comments=== |
| @darknight I meant I made the section, but yeah removing it was your idea. And I would have thought there would be a source found by now since these games have been out for 10 years. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} | | @darknight I meant I made the section, but yeah removing it was your idea. And I would have thought there would be a source found by now since these games have been out for 10 years. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} |
| :You'd think so, but sometimes information is just assumed and then goes unnoticed until a proposal like this brings it to more people's attention, prompting a further dig into official sources. --{{User:Waluigi Time/sig}} 11:48, August 19, 2020 (EDT)
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| It isn't directly called "Toad Town", but has there ever been an instance where the town surrounding or next to Peach's Castle wasn't generally an incarnation of Toad Town? The Japanese name of the Castle Gardens is merely the same as Peach's Castle, which is true of at least [[Toad Town#Names in other languages|two]] [[Toad Town#Mario .26 Luigi: Superstar Saga .2F Mario .26 Luigi: Superstar Saga .2B Bowser.27s Minions|appearances]]. Incidentally, the English name "Castle Gardens" may itself come from the internal name <tt>PeachCastleGardenPlanet</tt> (shortened to <tt>PeachCastlePlanet</tt> in the second game), referring to the castle and its environment, and the town is split between <tt>PeachCastleTownAfterAttack</tt> and <tt>PeachCastleTownBeforeAttack</tt> (in addition to the starting <tt>PeachCastleTownGate</tt>) - which happens to make this situation sound similar to ''[[Talk:Mushroom Kingdom#Super_Mario_RPG_location.28s.29|Super Mario RPG]]''. If anything, I think the Castle Gardens article could merge with Toad Town. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 19:23, August 26, 2020 (EDT)
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| :That seems very debatable to me. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}}
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| ::Which part? If you mean [[Castle Gardens#Names in other languages|Castle Gardens]] possibly coming from the filename in localization, [[Wire Trap#Names in other languages|it]] [[Spiny Piranha Plant#Names in other languages|isn't]] [[Morty Mole#Trivia|unheard]] [[Special:Diff/2916911|of]]. If you mean about Peach's Castle having another town near it, I'm genuinely curious if that happened, since much like the name of [[Peach's Castle#Names in other languages|Peach's Castle]], [[Toad Town#Names in other languages|Toad Town]] has evolved over time. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 19:50, August 26, 2020 (EDT)
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| :::I don't think there has been a differently-named town near Peach's Castle, but I mainly meant the part about merging Castle Gardens with this article. Another discussion would probably be needed for that. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}}
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| ::::Yes, that will likely require a separate discussion. {{User:Toadette the Achiever/sig}} 15:05, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| :The real problem in all of this is assuming continuity between the ''Paper Mario'' and ''Mario & Luigi'' series and the ''Super Mario'' series when said continuity isn’t even in the ''Super Mario'' series to begin with. Was the ''Super Mario Odyssey'' Peach’s Castle a reference to ''Super Mario 64''? Sure, and yet its surroundings were very different. And both games and ''Mario Kart 64'' (and 8) lacked a town around them. Assuming that these Peach Castle Garden are Toad Town requires assuming some canonicity so that the town near Peach’s Castle is always Toad Town. Either we turn the Toad Town page into a much less useful page about what is around Peach’s Castle or we assume canonicity despite our policy and say that Castle Gardens are Toad Town because it is usually done so in the RPGs. Both these choices are suboptimal at best, in my opinion.—[[User:Mister Wu|Mister Wu]] ([[User talk:Mister Wu|talk]]) 16:54, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| ::At the same time, TOK uses a different JP name in-game than any previous ones. I think "using a concept so similar that having them separate is splitting hairs" and "assuming continuity" are two completely different things. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 17:24, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| :::Thing is, this page is already pretty big, splitting hairs would benefit the readers if they look for information only on ''Paper Mario'' or ''Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time'', but creating pages about concepts? I can see the point of it, more than once this was discussed, but I think that with the current wiki structure pages that put together a lot of related objects to deal with concepts only create humongous pages. It’s an interesting idea, and I personally like seeing the evolution of these concepts over time and the different takes the various development teams had on those, but we need a better way to do that.—[[User:Mister Wu|Mister Wu]] ([[User talk:Mister Wu|talk]]) 20:30, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| ::::By "concepts" I am not being absolutely nebulous here; Mushroom Castle Town and Toad Town are just as the same basic thing as Mushroom Castle and Peach Castle. I doubt SM64 was trying to make continuity with SMRPG with "Princess lives in Mushroom Castle," but sense dictates they're the same thing regardless. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 20:49, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| :::::The main problem is that at that point we should be making a page about a very generic concept of “town that sometimes is found in front of Peach’s Castle”. There isn’t consistently a town in front of Peach’s Castle, the Japanese name often changes along with the appearance, sometimes the town isn’t even named, references between the various renditions are quite frequently nonexistent. I’m not fond of putting together what we consider to be “same things” in a page that is already generously sized. At this point I would rather go for a further split of the differently named Toad Towns, as it would make the individual pages easier to read and information easier to find for the readers.—[[User:Mister Wu|Mister Wu]] ([[User talk:Mister Wu|talk]]) 23:57, August 27, 2020 (EDT)
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| ::::::We can, perhaps like we do for certain iterations of Bowser's Castle, but I see no reason to single out the ''Galaxy'' games. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 00:05, August 28, 2020 (EDT)
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| :::::::We could maybe start with a review of the Japanese names used in the various games to better understand the state of the subject and of the page, if we can find some recurring names tied to recurring references we can start from those.—[[User:Mister Wu|Mister Wu]] ([[User talk:Mister Wu|talk]]) 09:42, August 28, 2020 (EDT)
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| ::::::::It would probably look like splitting Star Hill - sure, we ''could'' do that, but there's multiple ways to go about it that aren't optimal, so it doesn't mean we ''should'' - or splitting Peach's Castle, which would be excessive. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 12:10, August 28, 2020 (EDT)
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| :::::::::Still, having a little review of what this page is about would be nice - if the page is already a page about a rather generic subject instead of a consistently named Toad Town then the criteria of what should be in the page and how the page should be organized change.—[[User:Mister Wu|Mister Wu]] ([[User talk:Mister Wu|talk]]) 13:58, August 28, 2020 (EDT)
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| ==Bowser64==
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| I'm planning to make pages for all the items in the shop that you can buy (In TOK Section.) [[User:Bowser64|Dreamy Bowser]] ([[User talk:Bowser64|talk]]) 07:59, March 24, 2021 (EDT)
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| == Mario movie section? ==
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| Question: should we put a section about the town appearing in the [[The Super Mario Bros. Movie|movie]]? Technically, the Monopoly board seems to count the town (Mushroom Heights) as a separate location from Peach's Castle, but I also see the [[Castle Gardens|''SMG'' version]] having its own page. {{User:Mariuigi_Khed/sig}} 12:38, April 26, 2023 (EDT)
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| :Probably should have Mushroom Heights as a page and make short mention in the Toad Town page about it. {{User:Mario/sig}} 20:19, April 27, 2023 (EDT)
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| == Toad town paper Mario in game map description ==
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| In Paper Mario, does Toad Town have an in game description on the map in the main menu? If there is, what is it as most of the other main places in Paper Mario have their game map descriptions already added on their own pages?[[Special:Contributions/73.231.36.92|73.231.36.92]] 08:05, July 21, 2023 (EDT)
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