Talk:Polterpiranha: Difference between revisions

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OhoJeeOnFire moved page Talk:Ghost (Piranha Plant) to Talk:Polterpiranha: Proposal

OhoJeeOnFire

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 == Name, Again ==
-{{talk}}
 So, in light of [[MarioWiki talk:Naming#Make an exception to source priority for articles with identical names|this proposal]], should this be moved back to Yūrei Pakkun? [[User:Niiue|Niiue]] ([[User talk:Niiue|talk]]) 21:09, 29 January 2019 (EST)
 :In the Palutena's Guidance I just transcribed, they are still called "Ghosts". [[Special:Contributions/72.200.164.50|72.200.164.50]] 21:17, 29 January 2019 (EST)
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 ::::::::::::::Regardless, i still feel that it should be moved to Polterpiranha. <small><small>Oh, that's the proposal i want to override in the sense of internal filenames having priority over guide names.</small></small> Also, @Doomhiker, there's a difference between speculation and intent. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 03:38, March 28, 2019 (EDT)
 :::::::::::::::What i am trying to say above, is that there is a difference between speculation and what localizers intended. Regardless, it's pretty clear to me that "Ghost" is citogenesis, and just because of the Nipper Dandelion situation doesn't mean we shouldn't move this to Polterpiranha. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 09:14, April 13, 2019 (EDT) --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 09:14, April 13, 2019 (EDT)
+::::::::::::::::As I mentioned above, [[MarioWiki talk:Naming#Make an exception to source priority for articles with identical names|this proposal]] supports an immediate move to Polterpiranha. {{user|Niiue}} 09:16, April 13, 2019 (EDT)
+:::::::::::::::::Despite it being in-game? --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 09:19, April 13, 2019 (EDT)
+::::::::::::::::::Arguably yes, and it helps that there doesn't really seem to be any opposition to the move. {{user|Niiue}} 09:32, April 13, 2019 (EDT)
+:::::::::::::::::::<!-- Should make another proposal about the source priority exception for a more case-by-case basis --> It would seem that there is one disagreement. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 09:26, April 13, 2019 (EDT)
+::::::::::::::::::::After the Nipper Dandelion proposal, I feel that renaming Ghost, as off as it sounds, would now be an inconsistency. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 10:51, April 22, 2019 (EDT)
+:::::::::::::::::::::Why though? I supported the rename, and there was a major agreement on that. Here's the redirect : (cur | prev) 14:55, April 22, 2019 LinkTheLefty (talk | contribs) . . (34 bytes) (+34) . . (Redirected page to Ghost (Piranha Plant)) (Tag: New redirect) --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 07:47, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+::::::::::::::::::::::Because at this point, by allowing one from the same source but not the other, it really would be picking and choosing which in-game names we do and don't prefer. At least it has ''some'' basis to exist; Nipper Dandelion was a complete fabrication, and if we allow that, then there's no reason why we shouldn't allow Ghost as well. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 07:57, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+Except that Nipper Dandelion was a more concise name, and Ghost is too generic. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 08:21, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+:Doesn't matter - everyone should be well aware of the origins of Nipper Dandelion by now. This is twice now that Polterpiranha has been called Ghost, and the source priority exception proposal does not factor in-game names. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 08:42, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+::However, Niiue still agrees with that even though that the source priority <small><small>I'd like to make another counterproposal for certain cases</small></small> doesn't applies to certain in-game names. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 08:47, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+:::Believe me, I realize that the origin of "Ghost" is also sketchy, but having it both ways would be contradictory. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 08:50, April 26, 2019 (EDT)
+::::Even Niiue agreed on it. Why did you change your mind? --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 05:13, May 1, 2019 (EDT)
+:::::The reason I changed my mind was out of internal consistency on the wiki, not my personal feelings on the matter. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 05:55, May 1, 2019 (EDT)
+::::::Regardless, it should be moved to Polterpiranha due to it being more consise. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 08:19, May 3, 2019 (EDT)
+:::::::If we do, that calls into greater question the precise implementation of the source priority exception proposal. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 10:55, May 3, 2019 (EDT)
+Oh, so it had an actual English name all along? I’d move it in a heartbeat. It causes much less unnecessary confusion and in case the localization team has to reference the name again, hopefully they’ll realize their mistake. [[User:Technickal|Technickal]] ([[User talk:Technickal|talk]]) 10:18, July 18, 2019 (EDT)
+I think this is a good idea, as there are too many enemies on this Wiki called "Ghost". It would be much easier to move at least one of them. [[User:Matthew aka Mario|Matthew aka Mario]]
+== Proposal ==
+{{SettledTPP}}
+{{ProposalOutcome|passed|9-0-4|Move to Polterpiranha}}
+I heard that there had been a lot of discussion about moving this article to Polterpiranha. I will hold this proposal to settle this.
+'''Proposer''': {{User|OhoJeeOnFire}}<br>
+'''Deadline''': November 21, 2021, 23:59 GMT
+====Move to Polterpiranha====
+#{{User|OhoJeeOnFire}} I personally think this. Even though we have proof that it was called “ghost,” it should be moved due to a lot of articles named “ghost.”
+#{{User|7feetunder}} "Ghost" is a ''mistake'', not a new name, just like how "Daisy was in ''[[Mario Golf (Nintendo 64)|Mario Golf]]''" was a mistake. Let's use the ''actual'' name, not this wack generic half-baked citogenesis BS.
+#{{User|Somethingone}} As far as I’m aware, the reason it’s named ghost on this article was because of smash 4 using it as a shorthand for the normal name(as was said on piranha plant’s talk page), so yea, per proposal.
+#{{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} What 7feetunder said, this is a generic mistake based on someone at HAL/Nintendo's localization office not paying enough attention. This isn't like with Nipper Dandelion, where the name is reasonably descriptive and could have been come up with independently.
+#{{User|Scrooge200}} Polterpiranha is an official name that we have a valid source for, and "Ghost" is a mistake. Per everyone above.
+#{{User|Swallow}} I didn't understand how the name was used at first, but now that I do I'm supporting.
+#{{User|Archivist Toadette}} It's nothing like the [[Nipper Dandelion]] case, where that's the only English name we have.
+#{{User|WildWario}} Since Ghost was a mistake, per proposal.
+#{{User|Niiue}} Per all. The "Ghost" name was an obvious mistake, much like the SMW2 guide that listed Boo Balloons twice.
+====Keep as is (move to Ghost)====
+====Move to Ghost Piranha====
+#{{User|Hewer}} Per LinkTheLefty in the comments. This is probably what we would've used if that trophy description hadn't abbreviated the name.
+#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} Per myself in the comments below, and for everyone above repeating that Ghost was a "mistake," let me clear the air a bit: Ghost was not a mistake so much as a '''technicality''', albeit one made without the foresight of post-''Encyclopedia'' wiki; if we're being real here for a moment, Ghost Piranha (Plant) is most probably what the North American ''Super Smash Bros. for Wii U'' trophy writer was going for to begin with, as evident by the British English equivalent not having the space to use all the full names.
+#{{User|Niiue}} Per LTL.
+#{{User|Somethingone}} Per LinkTheLefty
+====Comments====
+So, as someone who has never played Yoshi's Island DS, is "ghost" used in that game at all, or is it only used in Smash Ultimate? The other name, "Polterpiranha", does at least have a source on the page associated with its only physical appearance. {{User:Swallow/sig}} 20:33, November 7, 2021 (EST)
+:I haven't played ''YIDS'' either, but based on the fact that many of the game's exclusive enemies have guide citations for their names (excluding ones mentioned in level names like [[Glide Guy]]), I doubt the game namedrops them anywhere.
+:{{User:7feetunder/sig}} 21:00, November 7, 2021 (EST)
+::It's Smash-exclusive, I've asked before in regards to the Super Big Unbaba, it doesn't name anything other than bosses. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 00:23, November 8, 2021 (EST)
+:I'm as surprised as anyone that Viridi unironically said "Ghosts" <small>(whoops)</small> but since this is a slightly unorthodox situation, I'm going to propose a slightly unorthodox solution - what if we used the Dutch version, "Ghost Piranha"? It's already perfectly in English, and most other Piranha Plant variation names are identical between English and Dutch (with exceptions being in regards to size, color, patch, and paper). For one thing, we already give similar treatment to Fiery Walking Piranha, whose name was modernized to Fire Nipper Plant via other language subtitles (and it happened to be used by the wiki at around the same time as Ghost Piranha, but most of us are in agreement that this could've easily been updated independently). The name Propeller Piranha was never technically used for another game either, yet it's understood to be the most recent in-game name as well. What most likely happened in the first place is that it was retranslated to be closer to its Japanese name, ''Yūrei Pakkun'', because Polterpiranha only showed up in (and potentially made up by) the Prima Games guide, hence why there's only that reference - had it been a Nintendo Power name, this issue may not've happened. Granted, that brings this article full circle, but again, look at Fire Nipper Plant. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 08:11, November 8, 2021 (EST)
+:Ok, I’ll add that. {{User:OhoJeeOnFire/sig}}