Talk:Spark

Watt isn't related. Watt is a lil' sparky. HK

What's the related species in Yoshi's Island?--Sticklyman (talk) 09:35, 8 August 2012 (EDT)

Piro Dangle. LUIGIRULES71

"Sparky"

What we have here is a creature with a plethora of different, but similar Japanese names, while Piro Dangle and Wire Trap, which both share a Japanese name with one of those but have different English names,m are listed separate, despite still attacking about the same. Either way, some of these travel on wires, some travel along surfaces, who are we to say they're intended to be the same thing? I find it rather unlikely that an enemy from Donkey Kong Jr. was intended to be in Yume Kojo: Doki Doki Panikku. I'm not sure that this page should be renamed so much as split. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:18, 5 November 2017 (EST)

For what it's worth, while Perfect Ban Mario Character Daijiten is a wee bit split-heavy, it does group the Donkey Kong Jr. and Game Boy Donkey Kong Sparks together, even though they're both pretty different and the change is noted in the description. It also lists the Super Mario USA Spark separately, but it is also mildly renamed from the Super Mario Bros. 2 Spark, with which it shares its name as stated in its profile (it, along with Tweeter and Flurry, wasn't listed in the Doki Doki Panic manual). Although the original intention isn't clear, given the existing Mario references already in Doki Doki Panic (POW, Stars...), I see little point in splitting off that game's Spark - the Sparkies in March of the Minis / Mini-Land Mayhem! even have a similar design, which would seem to solidify the connection. I'm also willing to believe that the Game Boy Donkey Kong (and, by extension, Mario vs. Donkey Kong) Sparks/Sparkies are at least a reference to the Donkey Kong Jr. version. I think, at the very least, Wire Traps should be grouped together with the wire Spark(y)s; Piro Dangle, though, is obviously a fire creature instead of an electrical one, so I believe that one is a case of coincidental naming. That said, it does make sense to split the article between the enemy's platform-based and wire-based versions, but at the end of the day, both types would still be Sparkies going by recent, common naming. LinkTheLefty (talk) 17:25, 5 November 2017 (EST)

Piro Dangle seems to take more from Hothead than anything truly fiery, actually. And it acts just like a slow version of the SMB2 Sparks, except it de-energizes sometimes, which I'm still not sure if that is a "weak moment" or anything. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 18:24, 5 November 2017 (EST)

If Piro Dangle is deliberately Spark but the fact just got lost in translation, it would be just about the last Yoshi's Island enemy to be moved back to its intended counterpart. It still looks like a ball of flame, though, which is additionally noted in its Shogakukan description. Since they apparently reappeared in Yoshi's New Island, I'm curious to know if their name was also changed to Sparky there - and if so, the current name matching would confirm to me without doubt that it's definitely supposed to be the same thing or is at least closely related in some way (after all, they did do the same thing for Ukiki). LinkTheLefty (talk) 19:09, 5 November 2017 (EST)

Well technically there's still Spiked Fun Guy, which didn't appear in YNI due to vanilla Pokeys appearing, and them having the same JP name, just absurdly different appearances and attack patters in comparison to other enemies in that game.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:40, 5 November 2017 (EST)

i'm Confused...i Think We Should Split Them For Now? LUIGIRULES71

Split Magnet Sparky from Spark

This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit any of the sections in the proposal. If you wish to discuss the article, do so in a new header below the proposal.

split 8-0
Given our recent re-split of Mega Mole and Morty Mole, I consider this to be a similar case. Plus, the plethora of confusion surrounding the aforementioned case doesn't apply here, as Magnet Sparkies actually have patterns that make them unique from Sparkies; they only travel along Magnet edges, and they enter certain (officially named) generators on the Magnets for brief periods of time.

Proposer: Toadette the Achiever (talk)
Deadline: April 23, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

1. Toadette the Achiever (talk) Per proposal.
2. Niiue (talk) Per proposal.
3. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) Been hoping someone would propose this (I've had a lot on my plate recently to make proposals), thank you! Per proposal.
4. DerpyLobster (talk) Yeah, they probably should...
5. BubbleRevolution (talk) Per proposal.
6. TheFlameChomp (talk) Per proposal.
7. LuigiMaster123 (talk) Per proposal.
8. LinkTheLefty (talk) I'm fairly certain you can't place this enemy without a Magnet Sparky Generator in Construction Zone, so though it's not quite a toy, this behavior difference alone is enough to set it apart.

Comments

This refers to both of the MvsDK Sparks, right? Since they both followed the "Magnetized Surface" rule? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:53, 8 April 2018 (EDT)

Yes. ^(T|C) 01:05, 9 April 2018 (EDT)

I am honestly so confused.DerpyLobster 1:15, 9 April 2018 (EDT)

Piro Dangle

It would seem that Piro Dangle has an identical Japanese name. This, combined with both being spheres with masklike eyes surrounded by a field of vague orange damaging glow that travel around platforms, makes me think that perhaps they are intended to be the same thing. While they are slower than the SMB2 enemy and occasionally lose their "spark," so to speak, plenty of SMB2 enemies appeared in the game with different behavior from before. Additionally, unlike Harry Hedgehog, it wasn't renamed to be a subtype in YNI, and unlike Spiked Fun Guy, they aren't replaced with the original counterpart. Anyways, there is the "electricity" vs "fire" debate, which I personally find a little silly, as Sumo Bro did the same thing (though that one could be argued as to depend on the floor). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:29, 7 December 2018 (EST)

Isn't this similar to the talk section above? Correct me if I'm wrong. ^(T|C) 21:12, 7 December 2018 (EST)

Similar, yes, but not identical. These seem more functionally similar to me than Spark and Magnet Sparky or what's currently under Wire Trap (with a proposal going to do more). I find it more likely that a SMB2 enemy was intended to be in SMW2 (as there are several other cases) than a DKJr enemy was intended to be in YK:DDP. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:20, 7 December 2018 (EST)

Additionally, aside from the English name, there's not much that indicate's that that's definitely fire, it looks to me like the orange area Hothead has, particularly in Smash Bros. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:15, 8 December 2018 (EST)

Just a heads-up, Shogakukan's Yossy Island and Super Mario Advance 3 guides describe it as 火 (hi, fire), and the Yoshi's New Island guide describes it as 光 (hikari, light). LinkTheLefty (talk) 07:30, 9 December 2018 (EST)

Also, Piro Dangle's eyes look more like Fryguy's eyes, and normal Sparks don't have a mouth. -- FanOfYoshi 10:25, 11 December 2018 (EST)

Once again, please recall how off--model many things were in SMW2. I still maintain that the Spiked Fun Guy in that game was a one-off redesign for the generic Pokey, with Needlenose being called sanbo more generically. Note how one appears alongside normal, on-model Pokeys in a later game, and the other conspicuously doesn't. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:01, 17 December 2018 (EST)

I also think that Spiked Fun Guy was intended to be a redesign of a Pokey, since their appearance is more closer than Needlenoses. (The Yoshi's New Island Guide doesn't have an entry for Needlenoses, nor on the Pokey's entry, indicating that Needlenoses are, despite their Japanese name, different species of Pokey). Anyways, i think we're getting off-topic. -- FanOfYoshi 13:06, 17 December 2018 (EST)

Not really, I'm just pointing out another insanely-different redesign of an SMB2 enemy in SMW2. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:20, 17 December 2018 (EST)

So you mean by "another insanely-different redesign of an SMB2 enemy in SMW2" that you think that Spiked Fun Guy is intended to be the Pokey itself? Also, while Spiked Fun Guy (Pokey)'s design were changed to their actual appearance, Piro Dangles remain their previous design. For Needlenoses, they are clearly intended to be different things despite their Japanese name, as they have no entry in the Yoshi's New Island Guide, nor mentioned on the normal Pokey's. Spiked Fun Guy's appearance is definitively more closer to Pokey's. There was a proposal to split both Spiked Fun Guys, with one option that had splitting Yoshi's Story Spiked Fun Guy while merging the Yoshi's Island one. -- FanOfYoshi 06:55, 20 December 2018 (EST)

The thing about the Yoshi's Island depiction is that Shogakukan's Super Mario Advance 3 guide suggests that Needlenose and Spiked Fun Guy are actually the same thing (note the description, whose last sentence translates as: "It sometimes hangs from a balloon or rides in a pot." - describing actions exclusive to Needlenose and Spike Fun Guy, respectively). What I believe was intended to be the case was that what we call Needlenose is supposed to be its graphic as a basic projectile and what we call Spiked Fun Guy is supposed to be its graphic as a more standard enemy. Mind, the original Yossy Island guide doesn't have this sentence and both versions also include Bouncing Bullet Bill together with Bullet Bill, which was later split in the Yoshi's New Island guide. Still, the fact that traditional Pokeys do show up in Yoshi's New Island indicates that it's separate from one or both of these. I think of them more like the predecessor to Pokey Heads than a real redesign of Pokey. LinkTheLefty (talk) 07:45, 20 December 2018 (EST)

1) I think that the "describes Needlenoses" argument is not fairly valid, as it only mentions Needlenoses when it's the entry of the enemies that shoot them. It erroneously implies that Spiked Fun Guy hangs on Baron von Zeppelins. 2) Its design is much more closer to Pokey that what is Needlenose. (SMB2 even had it green) 3) Please note that Doc von Schmeltwick told me how off-model enemies are in this game. (take Bullet Bill and Boo to name a few) Bullet Bill was larger and was green. 4) SMB2 enemies reappear in this game, including Shy Guys, Snifits, and also, note that Tweeters we're planned to appear as seen in the unused sprite. I still think that "Spiked Fun Guy" is another insanely redesigned enemy "Pokey", as it has the same Japanese name. Yoshi's New Island doesn't mention Needlenoses on Pokey's entry, so Needlenoses are separate from this one, thus, Spiked Fun Guy is the Pokey itself and thus, should be merged. It also acts much more like a Pokey than what Needlenoses did, as it is just an enemy rather than an enemy and a projectile. Should i bring it up on its talk page rather than bringing it up here? -- FanOfYoshi 05:39, 9 February 2019 (EST)

Anyways, after my final decision with Spiked Fun Guy (which i removed the merge template), i think it should be kept as-is. -- FanOfYoshi 13:21, July 17, 2019 (EDT)

Zelda series

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"Spark" is also the name of an identically-acting obstacle in the Zelda series, appearing in A Link to the Past, Link's Awakening, Oracle of Seasons/Ages, and The Minish Cap. Considering they act the same, we list other Mario enemies' appearances in those games, and us grouping the DKJr and SMB2 entities together is already working a bit under assumption, would it be agreeable to note this on the page? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:09, February 4, 2021 (EST)

Seems quite reasonable to me, although I should point out that unlike other Mario enemies, these don't have a figurine in the Switch version of Link's Awakening. Nightwicked Bowser 16:06, February 4, 2021 (EST)

Neither do Podoboo or Thwimp. They seem to exempt the "obstacles" from it. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:35, February 4, 2021 (EST)

I've added it under "trivia" like how the Nitpicker from Ice Climber is handled, but I'm not sure if they're supposed to deliberately be the same thing. Hyrule/Zelda Encyclopedia (which is a whole other can of worms) doesn't mention it as being from the Mario series unlike the other ones, for whatever that's worth, but it also does bizarre things like the former splitting the Chain Chomp from A Link to the Past, despite numerous sources stating otherwise. LinkTheLefty (talk) 05:00, March 10, 2022 (EST)

OK, spotted evidence that they had the same Sparks in mind. Check out here, under "gomi7.CGX" - sure, there are a few Zelda enemies like Bubble/Anti-Faerie, but generally speaking, Spark is listed among the other series cameos (and there's even a scrapped Fighterfly). LinkTheLefty (talk) 08:37, April 11, 2022 (EDT)