Talk:Mario Kart 8 Deluxe in-game statistics

Units

So MatPat brings up something here: What do these Mario Kart 8 units actually mean? https://youtu.be/wkpqiKj9eLM?t=5m21s 18:19, 13 May 2018 (EDT)

Those are points (PT), each one takes to the next row of the statistic translation table, with big jumps in the actual in-game weight every 4 points. Until you consider the final weight of the whole combination 9 does not directly correspond to an in-game weight, which is why I created this section on the main page in the first place and also added an explanation before the table.--Mister Wu (talk) 22:39, 13 May 2018 (EDT)

Code names

I have to agree with the IP that real names are far better in this situation over the code names. Code names are beneficial really only to data-miners and game modders, the latter which is already extensively documented to them to begin with on dedicated modding sites. And the IP has a point too: if characters indeed use code names, the vehicle parts should too: Monster tires should say "TireB_Big, TireK_Big, and TireT_Big". If we should absolutely include code names, which I do think we should still regardless of the extensive documentation, do what this article does, list them in a separate cell than the main one. Ray Trace^(T|C) 14:54, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

The problem is what is the point of this part: since those first tables are already found in the main page with a user-friendly layout, these first statistics tables are meant to be a faithful reproduction of what is found in the binary tables - read copypaste of data with addition of headers, possibly those that are given directly by the game -, so it's also easier to spot interpretation or transcription errors in the main page, which already happened quite a few times before thanks to this layout. Since the second part - the translation tables - doesn't have a counterpart as there's honestly not much that can be done to make the tables more user readable, it includes descriptions along with the internal names. As for the codenames used only for the characters here is that only these were found in the binary files in the exact same order used by said files - the other parts don't have code names in the parts binary file, otherwise they would have been added. The link you pointed to doesn't refer to the internal names used by the binary files, so it's outside of the scope of this page, which stems from those.--Mister Wu (talk) 16:21, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Just because it's faithful to how it's originally displayed, doesn't make it the optimal solution. This page, just because it's more aimed at the technically-minded folk, doesn't mean we have to make it harder for people who don't know what these terms mean: we'll always get new people who are interested in this sort of stuff, and keeping the code name only because "that's how it is" is counterproductive to a wiki's purpose: to provide clear and accessible information, to the well-read and to newcomers. As it currently is, it's too inclusive and content, and honestly, I don't see the harm of "translating" the code to a clearer name either since you're not going to lose any information that way. The fact that we have an IP and me who disputes this says something about how it's not the optimal solution. Again, I also propose we add original names AND the code names: the code names are small enough to be compressed into yet another cell (since that's their purpose to begin with: be small yet descriptive). Ray Trace^(T|C) 16:30, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

I'll do it, since it's not a long job to do, but remember that the IP wasn't absolutely doing this. They were deleting the actual headers found in the files to put the names used by the game, which is a radically different thing - we were losing information which is fundamental for us to see whether we were reading the data right or not.--Mister Wu (talk) 16:46, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

That I can agree with: we can definitely use both, because code names had helped me in the past, when it comes to modding Super Smash Bros. Brawl. I should probably get around adding id names to Smash 4's my music page too, but it has a longer name than Brawl's so that could be trickier. Ray Trace^(T|C) 17:03, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Done, I put the names below the UI ones since we already use two lines for the parts with different PAL names and this way we don't have too many columns. If there are other improvements to the layout, please tell me.--Mister Wu (talk) 17:26, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Thank you very much. Ray Trace^(T|C) 17:45, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Is it worth putting the code names for the Kart parts too? Since having the Characters's CNs and the Karts CNs together would make sense. 79.67.209.35 17:54, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Mister Wu has already explained why the kart part names aren't on the list. The file names used for the model files and what not are not the same as what governs the stats files used for this page. They apparently don't exist, hence why there's nothing of the sort. Ray Trace^(T|C) 17:55, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Oh I see, never mind then. 79.67.209.35 18:00, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Indeed, I would have surely put them if I found them, as I actually could fix the character ordering in the original Mario Kart 8 page thanks to that list. Sadly, the vehicle parts don't seem to have a list of names. This is where this inconsistency stemmed. By the way, sorry if I was rude about your edit in my post above.--Mister Wu (talk) 18:24, 5 June 2018 (EDT)

Items

Should be said ho ast are the items? Pokemon (talk) 03:46, 9 December 2018 (EST)

These data cone from an older version, the statistics of the parts and drivers are maintained not to invalidate Time Trial times, but the item probabilities are updated very frequently. Furthermore, many more tables of unknown purpose are being used in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, which means that this aspect of the game will be very difficult to document even if we end up having up-to-date data.--Mister Wu (talk) 12:47, 9 December 2018 (EST)

Level 0 row in the tables ?

Hello, I think the level 0 are missing in the tables
For example if I play Baby Peach with Biddybuggy, Roller tires and Cloud Glider, I have a ground speed (SL) level of 0
But if I go to the table called "In-game speed statistics (SL, SW, SA and SG)", the level starts at 1
I guess that the stats should be 7.45 for Drive_SpdMaxFwd_L and 7.95 for Drive_SpdMaxFwd_H, but it would be good to add the Level 0 row, I think
The preceding unsigned comment was added by 80.12.67.54 (talk).

The level 0 is not really missing here, it's simply not coded. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe reuses the table format of Mario Kart 8 which avoided having any stat level at 0. With Mario Kart 8 Deluxe they forgot about respecting such cosntraints, and as such the game is now forced to pick a level which is not known to us - but is likely to be level 1.--Mister Wu (talk) 10:02, June 22, 2021 (EDT)

Oh OK, so if I use Baby Peach/Biddybuggy/Roller/Cloud I should have Drive_SpdMaxFwd_L at 7.475 and Drive_SpdMaxFwd_H at 7.975 ? Like if I had a SL of level 1 ?
The preceding unsigned comment was added by 80.12.67.54 (talk).

It should work like that. I doubt that they revert to the default values as those are pretty high for something that is supposed to be at the lowest level.--Mister Wu (talk) 10:43, June 23, 2021 (EDT)

Can someone please explain to me what Off-Road Traction is??

For starters, Off Road implies that its the same off road as the one where you lose speed but there's no ICE off-road, there's snow off-road but no ICE off road. Also by DIRT don't you mean grass? Grass is the most common off road in the entire game! Not to mention that I've tested Traction off road and there is no slipping. Also what does the L M and H mean? Seriously I need answers! By off road do you mean any road that's NOT pavement or metal? Does rain count on Neo Bowser City? What about Donut Plains 3? That main road is mostly dirt. I need help Birdygamer1122 (talk) 13:40, June 24, 2022 (EDT)

DIRT_S, DIRT_M, DIRT_H, SAND_L, SAND_M, SAND_H, ICE_L, ICE_M, ICE_H are all flags that are applied, usually on the collision model of the course. You can ask modders to know which flag is used where (Ray Trace (talk) too here has had a look at the courses' collision models and maybe could provide more info on where each flag is used). About the no slipping, while the difference in SlipRt is small, it's far from being nonexistent, although in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe there are less obvious comparisons than in the original Mario Kart 8 where using Lemmy with the Sport Bike with Slim Tires resulted in very noticeable slipping in 200cc compared to the same driver with Standard ATV and Hot Monster Tires.--Mister Wu (talk) 01:15, June 25, 2022 (EDT)

Is this stat useful? I was told that it affects like four courses in the entire game. Is it a stat worth using? Birdygamer1122 (talk) 11:33, June 25, 2022 (EDT)

We're not really a wiki for strategies, but I guess you can query about personal opinion in our Discord or in the Marioboards forums. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 20:15, June 26, 2022 (EDT)

Tables formatting

The formatting of this page is very bloated, and I think it should be condensed down. There's no reason to have multiple characters and kart parts that have exactly the same stats taking up multiple rows. The page would look a lot cleaner if all of these duplicate characters and kart parts were bundled into the same rows together. I don't know how to make those edits though, I'm just leaving this here as a suggestion.
The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.140.96.22 (talk).

Why do the handling stat abbreviations start with T not H?

The handling stats are abbreviated to TL, TW, TA, TG. Is there a reason we aren't doing HL, HW, HA, HG? Starting with a T seems like they are traction stats. I would just make the edit but these are so weird I feel like there must be a reason no one has changed it yet. --Jank (talk) 17:31, August 19, 2023 (EDT)

These are the actual abbreviations used in the game’s data, they likely stem from Turning, since they affect the turning capability of the vehicles.--Mister Wu (talk) 20:40, August 19, 2023 (EDT)