Talk:Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass

Tour Naming

Out of curiosity, will we eventually rename the Mario Kart Tour tracks' articles to match other classic courses? Tails777 Talk to me!16:57, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Once they are released, then we most likely will. Nightwicked Bowser 17:01, February 10, 2022 (EST)

Though technically, Mario Kart Tour will probably still be using just Paris Promenade if it returns instead of Tour Paris Promenade, so would that be inconsistent? Tour is just causing a mess with some topics. WildWario (talk) 21:14, February 10, 2022 (EST)

To be fair, we don’t know which variations of Tokyo Blur and Paris Promenade are being used. I feel they’re not gonna add the variation number based on which variation is used, which kinda complicates things further. Like if they use the Tokyo Blur 4 version, but simply name it “Tokyo Blur”. I assume the best thing would be to come up with a solution after the pack releases. Tails777 Talk to me!22:47, February 10, 2022 (EST)

I'd agree. The expressway route is available on "Tokyo Blur" in the trailer, but the actual route is only reachable in 3 and 4. WildWario (talk) 22:54, February 10, 2022 (EST)

it seems to me that the Tokyo Blur used in the DLC is a new version, thats yet to appear in Tour, so I'd make a new page for the course, like how we have new pages for each version of it already. RSM, hoping to make amends soon. 20:28, March 4, 2022 (EST)

Honestly, better to just wait until the pack releases. At this point, it's two weeks away so we'll have that answer soon enough. Tails777 Talk to me!20:32, March 4, 2022 (EST)

"Mario Kart 8 Deluxe Course" category?

I've noticed tracks like Sky Garden are in the Mario Kart 8 category even though they are absent from said game, I feel like we should add a Mario Kart 8 Deluxe category for the DLC courses, is this worth doing or should it be kept as is? RSM, hoping to make amends soon. 20:23, February 23, 2022 (EST)

I agree with this. Feel free. Ray Trace^(T|C) 20:38, February 23, 2022 (EST)

Some Trivia that should be added.

Since Mario Kart Tour was released after Mario Kart 8 Deluxe this marks the first time a Mario Kart game has featured retro courses of a game released after it. Can someone please add that to the article here?
The preceding unsigned comment was added by 35.136.180.207 (talk).

This is not notable, post humos DLC content for future games added to past games is nothing new concerning video games at large (see Super Smash Bros.) and Mario Kart is simply following a wider trend. Ray Trace^(T|C) 01:07, February 26, 2022 (EST)

Separate pages for the Tour tracks?

I'm curious about something. Since the Mario Kart 8 Deluxe versions of Tokyo Blur are technically different than the versions in Mario Kart Tour, should we make a separate page specifically for 8 Deluxe's version? Like 8's version of Tokyo Blur is on the Tokyo Blur page because of the name but it is drastically different in terms of map layout (in Tokyo Blur's case, each lap is based on a different variant, which would essentially mean that Tokyo Blur 1, 2, and 3 should all have a section talking about its appearance in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe). Paris Promenade on the other hand, contains many different elements than the original game, including going backwards, which isn't based on any version of the stage in particular. Ninja Hideaway is exempt from this because it's the exact same, but what should be the deal with this? PrPro03 (talk) 08:03, March 18, 2022 (EDT)

Well Paris Promenade is much the same, combining two variants so I think it would be prudent to have separate pages, specially given the remix courses have their onw ones too.

Guybrush20X6 (talk) 08:19, March 18, 2022 (EDT)

So does that mean we should make separate pages called "Tokyo Blur (Mario Kart 8 Deluxe)" and "Paris Promenade (Mario Kart 8 Deluxe)", or keep it as is?
The preceding unsigned comment was added by Prpro=03 (talk).

i think we should keep it as is, the necessary info is explained perfectly so what would the point be in changing it? RSM, hoping to make amends soon. 20:38, March 19, 2022 (EDT)

Ninja Hideaway's Naming

So I know this has been discussed on the talk page too, but considering we don't know if the lack of console prefix is a mistake or not, I think we should still go with what the game is going with at the moment and use just "Ninja Hideaway" as the name. It's the currently used name, if it is indeed an error, it's something that can easily be changed down the line, but for now, it's just going by it's normal name and I feel it would probably be better if we did too. Any opposition to this idea? Tails777 Talk to me!

I think it would be best to just have "Ninja Hideaway" but then have a sic template with it, so it reads "Ninja Hideaway^[sic]" RSM, hoping to make amends soon. 12:12, March 21, 2022 (EDT)

I think that only the city tracks are going to be named as a Tour track, I prove this because of Merry Mountain in the trailer for Wave 3 that was released on November 21, 2022. As for Sky-High Sundae, it will never be named as a Tour track because it was in MK8 Deluxe before it was in Tour. MarioKart8fan (talk)20:52, December 1, 2022 (EST)

I don't know why they decided to not even name Ninja Hideaway as a Tour track because it is a Tour track in the first place. I also don't get why they are doing the same thing to Merry Mountain in wave 3. More to come to this soon! MarioKart8fan (talk)15:22, December 2, 2022 (EST)

Honestly, I feel this is just a situation without a clear answer. Nintendo clearly does treat both Ninja Hideaway and Merry Mountain as Tour tracks, as they clearly show the game's artwork when introducing the tracks. But they just decide not to include the prefix. Why just those tracks don't have the prefix is beyond most of us. Tails777 Talk to me!

I would have to agree on that. But there is 1 other thing, in the trailer for wave 1 that I doubt anyone saw that was released on 3/18/2022 was they had Ninja Hideaway as a Tour track but in the said game it is not even labeled a Tour track. If you did not see that trailer listed above, I will copy and paste a link to it so you other users can see my point. The link is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PpEiH23bMs. MarioKart8fan (talk)19:25, December 5, 2022 (EST)

It's noted that Ninja Hideaway doesn't use the Tour prefix, despite trailers showcasing that it's from Mario Kart Tour. The article itself does have a paragraph noting that. Same deal with Merry Mountain; both are clearly shown to be acknowledged they're from Tour, but no prefix is given. We know they're Tour tracks and we know Nintendo is acknowledging that, but we don't know why they don't use the prefixes and such an answer is unlikely to surface, at least for now. Tails777 Talk to me!

I agree. Who knows if this was just a mistake or Nintendo is doing this on purpose. Also, I made a Halfpipes are back section on the bottom of this discussion page. Please check it out and make any edits you want. MarioKart8fan (talk)20:46, December 5, 2022 (EST)

unreleased cups redirect?

I think that the pages for all the cups that are yet to be announced should simply redirect here until they have been announced, to reduce the number of red links so the page is more visually pleasing and looks less ""unfinished"". RSM, not who i used to be. 20:38, April 6, 2022 (EDT)

Move article to include hyphen.

The article uses a "–" in its title, which is not on the traditional keyboard. As such, all links that use a "-" instead are all redirects. To fix this, the article needs to be moved to "Mario Kart 8 Deluxe - Booster Course Pass" (using a hyphen symbol) - RSM 10:39, June 16, 2022 (EDT)

There's no problem with titles having characters not on the standard keyboard. It happens periodically, and redirects can fix that anyways. ^(T|C) 10:59, June 16, 2022 (EDT)

Wouldn't this be a good datamine?

I doubt this would get the wave 2 tracks correct by coincidence

Remembered Old Buddy 08:13, July 29, 2022 (EDT)

Already included in trivia. WildWario (talk) 08:34, July 29, 2022 (EDT)

Datamine

Since we're already covering the upcoming leaked courses on this page, would it be okay to add them to the courses section with a citation for the leak? Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 17:20, August 6, 2022 (EDT)

Should internal content section be separated into a new page?

This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit any of the sections in the proposal. If you wish to discuss the article, do so in a new header below the proposal.

Don't separate internal content 1-10
I've been thinking on this for a while now, because I've got an issue with it. Personally, I wanted the section of internal content (ergo, the datamine) to have a separate page. I know datamine or inner content stuffs can be alluring to some folks out there, but some others, like me, can be exposed to those things if not careful enough, and would rather learn about which incoming tracks by surprise (just like those Item Boxes!) while avoiding the leaks at the same time. I knew that from personal experience when browsing the page with my phone weeks before my Nintendo Switch gave me the news of a proper teaser about Wave 3.

Proposer: Starry Windy (talk)
Deadline: October 3, 2022, 23:59 GMT

Support

1. Starry Windy (talk) Because I made this proposal, yes vote.

Oppose

1. Hewer (talk) I'm pretty sure we don't tend to do this things like this, and there's a precedent of proposals like this one calling for hiding spoilers failing (example, example, example, example, etc., basically just search for the word spoiler in this page). A split like this should only happen if there's so much content in the section that it can work as its own article, which there isn't as it's only a few paragraphs.
2. Waluigi Time (talk) Per Hewer.
3. Ray Trace (talk) Responsibility of restraining viewing of unreleased content should be left to the readers, not the editors, who our jobs is to document information.
4. Killer Moth (talk) Per All.
5. Sdman213 (talk) Per all.
6. TheFlameChomp (talk) Per all. I could understand splitting if there was an issue with length, which there currently isn’t, but it is generally agreed upon that we do not change content solely to hide spoilers.
7. Arend (talk) Per all. If certain users don't want to read about the internal data, they can skip to the next section, or even go back to the last page they visited (or close tab).
8. Archivist Toadette (talk) Simply put, readers should read at their own risk. The general disclaimer already explicitly states this, so don't be surprised if the staff decide to veto this proposal sooner or later.
9. RealStuffMister (talk) I believe that in most contexts, this proposal would be a good idea, but seeing as this is the MarioWiki I believe that leaving it on the article is the better option. I also believe that the music datamines should be mentioned on the respective course's articles (like how Tour is mention on Shroom Ridge's article in a section called "other appearances", but that's a conversation for another day) that would just make the pages have repetitive, stubby sections actually, maybe that should be left on the booster course pass page instead, on second thought.
10. ThePowerPlayer (talk) Per all.

Comments

Alternatively, I'd like this section to have spoilers warning regardless if this proposal will go through or not. In fact, when I accidentally watched the leaks from this page, it didn't explicitly say that it's a spoiler and whatnot, which can be a problem, too. Plus, I'm sure some other viewers most likely didn't even bother with the disclaimer page, so putting a spoiler warning so that the viewers can think twice before reading can be the second best choice. Starry Windy (talk) 16:40, September 19, 2022 (EDT)

As I pointed out in my vote, we don't have spoiler warnings, and haven't had them since this proposal. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 16:47, September 19, 2022 (EDT)

If that's the case, maybe it's about time we reconsider putting in the spoiler warnings proposal once again, at least? Starry Windy (talk) 17:57, September 19, 2022 (EDT)

Considering the overwhelming support when it passed, and at least two failed attempts to reverse it that were strongly opposed, it's highly unlikely. Ultimately, if someone is concerned about spoilers for something, then they shouldn't be poking around places where they're likely to find them. -- Too Bad! Waluigi Time! 18:06, September 19, 2022 (EDT)

Halfpipes are back in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe!

I don't know why anyone has made a section about this, but halfpipes are back in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe Booster Course Pass wave 3! I would put this under Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, but I would rather put it here. The 1st track in Wave 3 is very clear because we saw it in the teaser trailer from the 9/13/2022 Nintendo Direct, Merry Mountain. There is also 1 more which is Maple Treeway. You might not have noticed it, but on the Maple Treeway page it does say the halfpipe is maintained under the Mario Kart 8 Deluxe section. You other users can check it out here. The link is https://www.mariowiki.com/Wii_Maple_Treeway. This was something I decided to add because it is something very interesting to be noted, especially for the Mario Kart Wii fans. This was made by MarioKart8fan (talk)19:39, December 5, 2022 (EST)

The return of half-pipes has already been noted on articles on which it's relevant, including the main Mario Kart 8 Deluxe article where it's listed under "new course elements," and the respective Merry Mountain and Wii Maple Treeway articles which point out that the half-pipes are retained in their appearances in 8DX. This article only serves as an overview of the courses included in the Pass, and doesn't need to report on every little thing that returns or features for the first time, such as arrow fields or free-roaming Chain Chomps in DS Peach Gardens. Sincerely, Ender R. Musk. 22:45, December 5, 2022 (EST)

Oops, I did not realize as I am new to the Wiki. But, something to point out, most people do not check out those parts just so you know. Also, most people would like to know this especially for Wii Maple Treeway because some might not have noticed in the trailer. MarioKart8fan (talk)17:09, December 6, 2022 (EST)

If someone wanted to know this about Maple Treeway in particular, I bet they would probably go to Maple Treeway's article, which as stated does have that information. But it's not really that big of a deal, as everyone will find out anyway when the courses release tomorrow. Sincerely, Ender R. Musk. 17:47, December 6, 2022 (EST)

You are correct on that one, but again this should stay up for future waves in case of other tracks from Mario Kart Wii like Waluigi Stadium or people that do not notice in the upcoming trailer for waves 4-6. MarioKart8fan (talk)17:51, December 6, 2022

Are we getting other tracks with different names in the Pass?

So this is something that I have been wondering about for a while since Wave 3's release. This is mainly because of 3DS Rock Rock Mountain/3DS Alpine Pass. The reason: because in the British English version of the game Rock Rock Mountain is referred to 3DS Alpine Pass. I know that is noted in the Course section on the Article page, but moat people don't notice that kind of stuff. Now the good thing is, most of these courses I'm about to list are NOT datamined, just random guesses. The course are Wii DK Summit/Wii DK's Snowboard Cross, 3DS Maka Wuhu/3DS Wuhu Mountain Loop, 3DS Wuhu Loop/3DS Wuhu Island Loop, and 3DS Cheep Cheep Lagoon/3DS Cheep Cheep Cape. This is something that is just a theory and might not happen, but could. For my talk page, use the following link... https://www.mariowiki.com/User_talk:MarioKart8fan. This was made by (User:MarioKart8fan)21:00, December 13, 2022

Tour based on Deluxe or Deluxe based on Tour

So something has been on my mind as early as when this DLC released; we currently say many of the tracks (3DS Toad Circuit, N64 Choco Mountain, etc) have their designs in MK8D based on their appearances in Tour, which makes sense. But then we also have a few courses where we say the Tour appearances are based on their appearance in MK8D. In of itself, it's not incorrect to say, but at the same time, I just feel it's not entirely meant to be true. To get to my point, is it really accurate to say the tracks in Tour are based on their appearance in 8 Deluxe when the entire BCP in 8 Deluxe is based on the designs of Tour? I know we've kinda tread this water before with the whole Sky-High Sundae thing, but that at least had something to back up the possibility of being an 8 Deluxe track, as it was marketed as "new" for both games. There's nothing that's really saying these tracks were intended for 8 Deluxe before Tour. I'm thinking for tracks like Wii Coconut Mall, DS Shroom Ridge and GBA Snow Land, we simply remove parts that make it sound like the 8 Deluxe appearance was the intended appearance and simply say something like "The design differs slightly compared to its appearance in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe" before listing changes between the two versions. I know this doesn't seem like a big thing to really focus on, but I just want to see what others think of this. Tails777 Talk to me!

Given that all DLC courses use the same course models from Mario Kart Tour, with at least a bit of difference between both versions, I agree with your suggestion, and I think it should be taken into account soon.

--SuperJuancho64 (talk) 19:46, February 22, 2023 (EST)

After seeing your edit on the page of Wii Coconut Mall and after thinking about it, I also agree with this suggestion as I find it better as well.

--Taupe (talk) 21:59, March 1, 2023 (UTC)

Listing tracks based on their designs for Mario Kart Tour or not ?

I have noticed that the first part of the page saying that the "courses are based on their designs from Mario Kart Tour" has been altered. Considering these courses are currently not in Tour, most people, if not everyone, figured out over the time that all the tracks use their Tour designs from that game as they are ported from here, even if Nintendo decides to release these courses first into 8DX and keep them unreleased in Tour. While I feel like the current wording is better than the previous one, should the tracks not present in Mario Kart Tour (for now, GCN Waluigi Stadium and, if we decide to include it somehow, Yoshi's Island) still be listed ? --Taupe (talk) 2:06, March 3, 2023 (UTC)

Didn't "port" really mean "re-releasing a game on a different platform with minor changes", not just a course model? ¬¬
The preceding unsigned comment was added by SuperJuancho64 (talk).

"Kamek is the first Mario Kart Tour newcomer to be playable in a console Mario Kart."

I feel like this is a statement notable enough to include. Tour has been in this gray area where some people don't consider it to be a mainline game, and some didn't think Tour-exclusive characters would make it into Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. This is the first time Nintendo has brought a mobile-exclusive Mario Kart playable character into one of the console games. -- It's Meester Tweester! 07:53, June 23, 2023 (EDT)

What fans think doesn’t matter here. Nintendo treats Tour on equal footing with the non-arcade Mario Karts, and distinguishing the system it is played on would invite more useless statements such as “Rosalina is the first Mario Kart Wii newcomer to be playable on a handheld Mario Kart” etc. etc. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 08:05, June 23, 2023 (EDT)

Italics?

The Booster Course Pass was denied italics on the wiki shortly after its reveal for the pretty flimsy reason that "since it's always referred to as "THE pass", it's treated more like a thing with a name like the Fighters Pass as opposed to purely a title", which I never thought was that convincing but everyone went along with it anyway. However, I've noticed that Nintendo doesn't seem to see it the same way, as it's consistently written as Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass in the patch notes (it's actually been this way since Wave 1 but I never took notice until now). So should we start italicizing it on the wiki? I imagine we could have a bot change all instances of "Booster Course Pass" to have italics if that's what we decide to enforce. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 17:38, July 12, 2023 (EDT)

Agreed. Other customer support pages from across Nintendo's English-language websites also italicise the title in full. Seems like "Booster Course Pass" is written in default typeface only when the same is done with the "Mario Kart 8 Deluxe" part of the title. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 18:08, July 12, 2023 (EDT)

Update: Then again, Play Nintendo formats the DLC's title like the wiki does ("Mario Kart 8 Deluxe" in italics, "– Booster Course Pass" in default font), but I have no idea how much weight this source has compared to the others. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 17:18, August 2, 2023 (EDT)

It strangely doesn't italicize Mario Kart Tour or the other instance of Mario Kart 8 Deluxe in the same sentence, so I feel like it shouldn't outweigh the other official websites. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 06:25, August 16, 2023 (EDT)

Italicize the Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass

This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit any of the sections in the proposal. If you wish to discuss the article, do so in a new header below the proposal.

use italics for the full title 7-0
See above - to summarize, the Booster Course Pass, despite being the title of a work, doesn't have italics on this wiki for some reason, despite the fact that more often than not, Nintendo's official websites do use italics for it. So, I think we should change it on the wiki to match Nintendo's official stance. Since I'm not sure how contentious this is, I've made this into a proposal.

Proposer: Hewer (talk)
Deadline: September 15, 2023, 23:59 GMT

Support

1. Hewer (talk) Per proposal and above discussion.
2. Tails777 (talk) Per proposal. While I'm not sure if my supporting reason would hold up (as I don't know if similar situations have happened and I'm kinda too lazy to look into it), the game's title is in the full name, which to me, kinda supports the idea of putting the whole thing in italics.
3. Killer Moth (talk) Per all.
4. MegaBowser64 (talk) Personally I though it looked better without italics but whatevs. ¯\_( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)_/¯
5. Mushroom Head (talk) Per all. Nintendo seems to prefer using italics for the whole title, so we should do that as well.
6. ToxicOJ (talk) Per all.
7. BMfan08 (talk) Late vote, but might as well throw my hat in the ring. Per all.

Comments

This is not entirely true. I've seen Nintendo use both often enough, and it's not clear which way is preferred. Axis (talk) 01:29, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

Uses of both

Compilation of uses of both, excluding times when Nintendo didn't italicize it at all.

Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass

1. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass Wave 3 Brings Merry Mountain Mayhem with Eight Additional Courses on Dec. 7
2. Wave 3 is here!
3. Wave 4 is here!
4. Thinkin’ pink with Birdo

Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass

1. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass FAQ
2. Unable to Access Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass Content
3. How to Access Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass Content
4. How to Update Mario Kart 8 Deluxe
5. Mario Kart 8 Deluxe – Booster Course Pass Wave 2 Approaches the Starting Line on Aug. 4
6. Wave 3 is here!
7. New courses are here!
8. Wave 5 is here!
9. Summer fun with Nintendo
10. Co-op fun for family game night
11. More courses, more action!

Axis (talk) 02:27, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

I'd say it's pretty clear from this which way is preferred. What I said in the proposal still holds true: more often than not, Nintendo's official websites do use italics for it. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 05:40, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

I compiled these links after I wrote that comment. Axis (talk) 06:57, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

At first glance, those Play Nintendo articles don't seem consistent in terms of title formatting, so I kind of foresee some contention on referencing these examples. To hopefully dispel any doubts, I'll note that they show a clear pattern that hinges on whether the title is part of a hyperlink or not:

• Pikmin 4 co-op tips: the italicised instance of "Pikmin 4" is the one in the lead paragraph, which hosts a link; the rest across the article's body use the site's default typeface.
• Fun family games starring Mario!: all game titles across the article are both linked and italicised. I'm excluding the instance of "Super Mario 3D World" because in that context it refers to the in-game campaign of Super Mario 3D World + Bowser's Fury rather than the work itself.
• Sweet victory with Kirby: "Kirby's Dream Buffet" is only italicised in the linked instance, but not in the article itself nor in the age rating notice at the bottom.
• Winter break game guide!: all works mentioned here, including the Booster Course Pass, are linked and consequently italicised.

These are just a couple of examples, but they were picked purely at random. Also note that this just seems to apply to game titles; not all hyperlink text is italicised, as seen in the second and fourth examples, where "the official home of Super Mario" and "tips and tricks" links don't change format.
So I guess I should ask, for the BCP specifically, what do we choose to reference from these examples? The hyperlinks or the plain instances? -- KOOPA CON CARNE 06:26, September 2, 2023 (EDT)
EDIT: Although there does seem to be one plain, italicised instance of Just Dance 2022 in the "Co-op fun for family game night" article provided by Axis. So far, though, hyperlinked instances still don't break any presupposed pattern. -- KOOPA CON CARNE 06:32, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

It would be a good idea to mention both of these cases, regardless of the outcome of this proposal. Axis (talk) 07:00, September 2, 2023 (EDT)

Not sure if it's too late for this, but I feel the scope of this proposal probably could be expanded to include the titles of the Mario + Rabbids DLCs as we haven't been italicizing those either, yet we have with things like Minion Quest: The Search for Bowser and Bowser's Fury. Nightwicked Bowser 21:12, September 4, 2023 (EDT)

Although I agree (and for some reason thought we already did italicise Donkey Kong Adventure), I feel like it should probably be its own proposal as it doesn't feel quite relevant enough to be lumped in with this proposal on the Booster Course Pass's talk page. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 11:15, September 5, 2023 (EDT)

Pauline?

Pauline was a heavyweight in Tour, so it seems odd that she would be a medium-weight here, and I don't see where it specifically says one way or another. It's sort of hard to tell in the video what size her kart is, but can someone cite why she's listed as a medium driver? 73.171.36.107 11:16, September 14, 2023 (EDT)

Can someone please add to the trivia section or somewhere in the article that every cup in the Booster Course Pass starts with a Tour city track?

I would add it myself but I cannot unfortunately and with all the tracks confirmed I feel it’s okay that add that the article now. So I hope someone can please add that when they have the time 35.137.237.68 5:30 November 7 2023 (EDT)

Trivia Error

The trivia section says Wii Rainbow Road still uses the same preview image as 3DS Rainbow Road on the desktop version of the North American website. This issue has since been fixed and the trivia section should be changed accordingly. --Nintenboi1 (talk) 13:15, November 24, 2023 (EST)