Talk:Toad

From the article: Toad also appeared in Super Mario 64/DS, giving Mario & company tips for findig secret stages, like the one in the mirror room and sometimes giving stars too.
 * Are the Toads in Super Mario 64 the Toad. I was under the impression that they were all generic Toads working in the castle. --Son of Suns 21:20, 21 June 2006 (EDT)
 * Especially since two toads appear at the end beside Peach, you have a point. -Wayoshi 21:26, 21 June 2006 (EDT)
 * And I think in the second floor hallway there are two Toads...if you move the camera, you can see both of them on the screen. --Son of Suns 21:34, 21 June 2006 (EDT)

Yes you can..... H K

I don't think that it should assume that one of the Toads is the Toad the article is about in the Super Mario 64/DS section. It sounds like a POV phrase to me. Toadette 4evur 20:40, 30 January 2008 (EST)

Soccer Look
Could someone that has Super Mario Strikers please put a picture up of Toad in it.
 * Only Toads (the species) appear in Super Mario Strikers, as sidekicks. Toad does not appear. Cobold 09:52, 10 February 2007 (EST)

Is Toad princess Peach's brother?
I thought Toad was peach's brother in the super mario bros super show. This could be truth, because in the multiplayer mode of mario party 5 a special group name appears if two players cooperate. Peach and Toad get the group name "ROYAL FAMILY"!!! and peach has a toad-like grandma in Mario RPG (snes). shocking???

.... When you pair-up Luigi and Yoshi in Mario Party 5, it calls them the Green Bros., that doesn't mean there family. Also, please use the forum for comments like that. -- Sir Grodus
 * I'm watching the show, but I haven't come across evidence for that yet. I think he's just her hired protector who became a close friend in that show.  He's very dedicated, though.  15:05, 29 December 2007 (EST)

Sir Grodus is right! "Royal Family" doesn't mean their brothers and sisters! They'd call it "Royal Family" 'cause Toad is protecting Princess Toadstool and also the Mushroom Kingdom! And Toad always comes with Peach when Peach decides if she can go with Mario and Luigi! Nothing means their brothers and sisters!!!--Smarty-jamjam 21:25, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

SMS
In Super Mario Sunshine, the instruction book labels the red-capped Toad as "Toad" shuold this be mentioned. - Ultimatetoad 18:05, 8 March 2007 (EST)

Hello? - Ultimatetoad 18:57, 8 March 2007 (EST)

Indeed it does. Maybe it is THE Toad, but I'm not 100% sure. 20:25, 9 March 2007 (EST)

Well, I almost am. The Toad looks like him, and is called him. I see no need for further evidence. - Ultimatetoad
 * The Toad labelled as "Toad" in the Sunshine Manual has a red mushroom cap and red clothing, while regularly Toad wears blue. The Toads in Sunshine behave really childish (talk to them in the first scene of the game), so I think it is a mistake in the manual. - Cobold

I always thought Toad WAS chiildish. - Ultimatetoad

Toad is the label for all the Toads. It doesn't mean it's the Toad. The manual even says in the story, "Mario, Peach, and an entourage of Toads have come to Isle Delfino". It doesn't say Toad came, Toads came. Also note that it labels the Pianta and the Noki "Pianta" and "Noki". It says in in the singular, even though there is more than one of each. The "Toad" label just means a Toad. -- Son of Suns
 * Alot of Toads are named Toad. Toadette 4evur 20:44, 30 January 2008 (EST)

I just noticed something. In the intro of Mario Superstar Baseball, the same red Toad congratulates Mario along with Peach, Daisy, and Yoshi on his victory against Wario. -- Klaus Kratchet

About the Pianta and Noki thing, in the manual's description of them it says "Isle Delfino Residents" in the plural form, but describes Toad as "Peach's attendant" in the singular form, so it isn't for the whole group, but that one Toad. I believe it is him. Like stated above, Toad has a red vest in Mario Superstar Baseball. --Toadster 04 22:01, 1 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Definately. Instruction booklets count as proof of course, so he was definately in Sunshine.  Baseball might be a bit of a stretch, but I would like to include at least a reference to that in the article...  23:01, 1 May 2008 (EDT)

Mushroom Retainer
According to the Mushroom Retainer article, SMRPG proves that Toad is one of the Mushroom Retainers. This would prove that he WAS in SMB and LL, If anyone has the game and can prove the articles statement, please tell me. I'm trying to end all these accursed continuity problems.Plllleeeeaseee tell me soon. - Ultimatetoad

hello? - Ultimatetoad

I always thought the Toad rescued before Princess Toadstool in Super Mario Bros. was Toad, but I dunno. The Toad first met in Luigi's Mansion is Toad, I'm practically sure of it. Yes, he is one of the eight Mushroom Retainers in Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars. -- Sir Grodus

The Mushroom retainers could change, meaning Toad got a different Toad's position. -- Son of Suns

Yes, but THAT seems even more far-fetched than saying he is a Mushroom Retainer. - Ultimatetoad


 * How so? Toad wasn't a character until Super Mario Bros. 2 (USA). -- Son of Suns

Hmmmm..... well, since there no proof, I'll put it in the generic appearences section. Also SoS, most continunuity problems are now solved; only Luigi's Mansion left. - Ultimatetoad

To say that he could have changed is very far fetched, and I know this discussion is old and probably not applicable, but I want to get this out in case the issue comes up again. We have no reason to believe that except what we may assume based on Earth positions of government. I know that some people do not view it as canon, but the Super Show gave Toad the role of the Princess's protector immeadiately following her rescue in Super Mario Bros. In other words, he would have been her protector before Bowser's invasion. Regardless of your opinion however, we can't say that just because Toad wasn't a character until SMB2 that he wouldn't be in SMB1. There are plenty of examples of retcon in the Mario series. 22:38, 30 January 2008 (EST)
 * Okay, it's an "alternate" canon source, as defined by some guy on the Wiki some time ago, but it's The Super Mario Bros. Super Show! episode "Trojan Koopa." After failing at saving Peach, Toad says, "Some Mushroom Retainer I turned out to be... I was so close! I couldn't save her..." So... he was a Mushroom Retainer then, during the events of Super Mario Bros. only if you consider the show and the games to be part of the same continuity.  Great...  22:02, 5 March 2008 (EST)

Images
I think there is enough Images, respond to support or oppose. YoshiFan

All right, four people in support,(including me), I'm removing the Template!

Support.--Luigifan14 18:33, 2 April 2007 (EDT)

Support -- Sir Grodus

Support. -- 00:06, 3 April 2007 (EDT)

Support. -- YoshiFan 15:27, 3 April 2007 (EDT)

Support--Smarty-jamjam 21:28, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

First Quote
I don't get why you oppose the SMB quote, Ultimatetoad. That's classic. 17:20, 29 March 2007 (EDT)


 * I think it's because Toad never said it. Generic Mushroom Retainers did. -- Son of Suns

Yeah... I like the quote....it's my sig..... but it's not Toad's. - Ultimatetoad

I kinda like the SMRPG quote. Why was it removed? - Cobold

Is Toad in Super Mario Sunshine?
I have the manual, and it says that the red toad is Peach's attendant. Klaus Kratchet


 * All the Toads are her attendants. See the previous SMS section. -- Son of Suns

Is Toad in Mario Pinball Land?
Since there are two pictures of him at the bottom, could somebody write about it in the biography section? I never played it or know anybody who has it.

Yeah, he's in it. He's in the movie at the beginning, and he runs the shops. But I'm not up to writing sections yet, and I don't have enough time these days.

SPM
Is it Toad in SPM or just a generic Toad? I just want to be clear on this.... - Ultimatetoad

Luigi refers to him as Toad, so yes. -- Sir Grodus

Cool. Now I am more willing to let one other section go if needed.... - Ultimatetoad

Follow Toad
I'm beggining to think this is just Toad, is he actually refered to as "Follow Toad" or anything else? I haven't played the game in a while. -- Sir Grodus

Well, I don't have the game, but It looks like it to me. Will someone who has the game please answer? - Ultimatetoad


 * I have the game, and I'm near-positive he's never named. Considering that he's so close to Toadette and everything, and that he looks just like Toad, I think it's meant to be assumed that he is plain ol' Toad. --YellowYoshi398 10:10, 2 April 2007 (EDT)

Sooo... merge? - Ultimatetoad


 * Yeah. He's pretty much definitely Toad.

I don't think he's THE Toad, just a generic Toad. Don't hate me if I'm wrong, but there's no source confirming that the Follow Toad is THE Toad. Considering his role is very similiar to the Toad in Mario Party 2, I'm not sure. If the Toad in MP2 was THE Toad, it may prove that this Toad is THE Toad. Don't know where the name Follow Toad popped up either. Confused


 * To my knowledge, it doesn't say "Follow Toad" anywhere in the game, so I added the conjecture template. I do think that since they're so similar in their actions and role in the game, this Toad could be THE Toad. 23:52, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

Sooooo.... a vote? - Ultimatetoad

I think it's Toad.

Support Merge

 * 1) -- Sir Grodus
 * 2)  I   am   Confused  16:33, 8 April 2007 (EDT)
 * 3) Ultimatetoad
 * 4) Klaus Kratchet
 * 5) Stumpers
 * 6) Booster
 * 7) User:Smarty-jamjam 21:36, 6 May 2009 (EDT)
 * 1) Klaus Kratchet
 * 2) Stumpers
 * 3) Booster
 * 4) User:Smarty-jamjam 21:36, 6 May 2009 (EDT)
 * 1) User:Smarty-jamjam 21:36, 6 May 2009 (EDT)

Comments
He's never reffered to as "Follow Toad", he looks like Toad, theres nothing contradicting the fact that he's probably just Toad, who has hosted previous Mario Parties. -- Sir Grodus

Oh, the way the article worded it, it made him sound like an important host.----

Like Toad.

Okay this vote is unopposed should someone merge it? Xzelion

OK, I did.

Toad's Relationships To Other Characters
Something interesting I've noticed is that the team names in Mario Party 6 are used as evidence for character relationships for other character pairings, but interestingly, mentions of such evidence for Toad's (and Yoshi's, coincidentally) relationships aren't mentioned. Is there some reason that I'm not getting for this exclusion, or is it just that no one has added it yet? Dinosaur bob 12:09, 14 May 2007 (EDT)

No ones added it yet..... I don't have Mario Party 6, or I would have... - Ultimatetoad

Hotel Mario
I've been thinking about adding Hotel Mario information in the biography section, but I'm not too sure if the Toad that appear in that game is THE Toad or simply a generic ones. What are your ideas, guys? Gofer

I don't know- never played the game! Mostly what I came in here to comment on was that I can't believe there was no mention of how Super Mario Bros. 2 portrays the shroom-dude as stronger than Mario or Luigi, judging by how quickly he can pull things out of the ground, before I just added it! 20:40, 1 July 2007 (EDT)

Yeah, I saw footage, thats not Toad, that not even a Mushroom Person, its just an oddly named 1-Up. -- Sir Grodus
 * Really? So, he msut still count since he he is named Toad in the "inclosed instruction book."... do it?

Gofer


 * I think in the interest of making things less confusing, we should stick with what's recognizable instead. We're not going to make a new page called "Skeleton Koopa," we'll just consider it Dry Bones. We have no idea what a Mini Ninji is, so let's list it in the Ninji section. Truth is, a lot of the things were misnamed in the enclosed instruction book... Banzai Bill should have been Bullet Bill. The only remotely new enemy character (outside of a Goomba and Koopa Troopa in wardrobe) is Pat the Bat, which basically functions like a Swooper anyway. There's an excellent in-depth Hotel Mario review here, before it became a YouTube icon: http://www.goodtimeretrocafe.com/cdi/hmario.html LinkTheLefty 23:11, 26 April 2010 (EDT)

The SM64 conundrum
Yes, I'm bringing this up again. In SM64DS, The Toads are a species (2 appear at once.) but in SM64, only one appears at one time. The instruction book says that Toad and Princess Peach were missing, but maybe he just meant he couldnt see Toad right away... like, when he moved to the left and searched along the wall, he found him? Thoughts? - Ultimatetoad

They're still a species in SM64, since two appear aside Princess Peach at the end. 16:19, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

Ummm.... so what should I put in that section? - Ultimatetoad

In both games Toads are species. However, the main Toad was the one found near the door to the castle (which is probably the first Toad you'll see). However, the main Toad's role in the game is somewhat unimportant since all he does is tell Mario of Peach's kidnapping (doesn't even give Mario a free Power Star like the other Toads). Although I'm not sure about this part, Toad MAY have been standing alongside Peach at the end. Hopefully, that covers your question. 14:04, 25 July 2007 (EDT)

O.k..... - Ultimatetoad

Is there any confirmation on this? There is no source here. Toadster_04

Toad is the first toad mario meets. It says so in the manuel of mario 64 ds as it says "According to Toad,...". I don't see it saying "a toad" so it can be said that it is toad. Also in the remake, Toad has more personality and knows the characters like being scared of wario and thinking he will leave them. User:Pichufan93

Magician?
So... is there any particular reason Toad is in the "Magicians" category? I can't remember him ever using anything that could be called "magic"--a whole lot of throwing stuff and giving out items, but no magic. The descriptions of his abilities in the article don't seem to mention magic either. So is there some obscure thing I'm missing, or should Toad be taken out of that category? Wario&#39;sFalconPAUNCH! 23:12, 16 September 2007 (EDT)
 * In the The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3, Toad used a Magic Wand. He was not very good at it, but he still managed to use the magic.
 * Oh, okay. Thanks for clearing that one up. Wario&#39;sFalconPAUNCH! 00:00, 17 September 2007 (EDT)

Apperance in Mario Galaxy
Prevoucly on the article it had said that toad was in galaxy but it has been taken down how ever one of the guards was toad I beileve and there should be a mention of him I dont know but this should be brought up Partytoad
 * People! Just because a Toad has red color doesn't mean it's the Toad in the article. The "Toad" the article is about appears in the intro, that's it. I think the section should be removed. Toadette 4evur 17:08, 29 January 2008 (EST)

So in this article you can't talk about other Toads? My bad. I just thought it would be interesting for other people to know that there are Toads in Super Mario Galaxy. I don't see why remove the article. Lules
 * Well, they're mentioned in the Toad (species) article for one. Toadette 4evur 21:34, 29 January 2008 (EST)

...
O.kay, Son of Sons, Pokemon DP, you have removed useful info. Sure, the whole Toad/Toadette thing is kind of iffy, but it's still obvious that they have SOME kind of relationship. It's..... how should I say this... important speculation. And DP, sure that list of where Toad may have been was speculative, I realize that now, but is it not still true that Toad's name may be confused with that of the species? Did you really have to remove the whole section? - Ultimatetoad

SMS official art
I know there's official art of Toad from Super Mario Sunshine, but it's not on this site. It's on www.themushroomkingdom.net. We should upload it.

I'm quite sure Toad isn't actually in Super Mario Sunshine and that its all just generic Toads. -- Sir Grodus 21:11, 10 February 2008 (EST)
 * I'd agree with you, except that I can't logically deny that Peach would want her longtime friend Toad to come with her. In terms of official confirmation, though, I got nada.  21:54, 10 February 2008 (EST)


 * I don't know. I think it's Toad, becuase he's listed in the game booklet as "Toad" and as "Peach's attendant". We should at least say in the article that there was a red Toad that might be Toad. Anyway, whether it's Toad or just some red Toad, there's game art of him right here. And the site should have all official art from the Mario series.
 * Hold up: the manual refers to him as Toad? That would cinch it.  I'll check it out and report back.  00:53, 1 March 2008 (EST)
 * Oh, here's a link. You'll find it on page 9. Click here for the whole manual.  For those who trust me, Peach, Toadsworth, and Toad are lined up with a discription next to each.  The Toad in CrystalYoshi's artwork is labeled Toad where Peach and Toadsworth are labeled their names.  In other words, it's presented as a name.  However, it should also be noted that Pianta and Noki are listed as such as well.  Really, you all need to look at the document.  00:57, 1 March 2008 (EST)
 * Well the picture is on the gamehiker wiki, right here. so maybe I'll uplaoad it sometime. If you don't want me to put it on this page, maybe I'll put it on the Toad (species) page.

Toad... as an item?
Is Toad supposed to be an item? If so, how? This entry will not be added into the list unless some explaination is discussed. ;)


 * I don't remember Toad as an item, unless Peach's B move in Melee counts. http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif
 * Hotel Mario. Typo in the manuel.  00:52, 1 March 2008 (EST)

Galaxy and Sunshine
How do we know the red toad in Galaxy and Sunshine isn't THE Toad? I got the impression that the whole reason they gave the Toads different colors was to distinguish the lesser toads from The Main Toad, sorta like how it was with Yoshi. - Buddy Chist


 * Well we have no proof they are THE Toad. So, until we're sure, we just leave that out. http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif

But the game Galaxy did give the red one a particular amount of focus and prominance that seems to imply that it's Toad. - Buddy Christ


 * Toad himself typically wears a blue vest. The Sunshine and Galaxy Red Toads wear red vests. Yes, the Red one is the Toad Brigade leader, but it doesn't prove that he's THE Toad. -- Booster


 * Being a leader and more focus means nothing at all. http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif
 * To be fair, you can't tell 100% for sure who's who. I don't think Nintendo makes a notable difference between character and species. The Toad with red cap in blue is simply othen used as a representative for all Toads. - 07:34, 1 March 2008 (EST)

Just mention in the "other appearances" section that toads appeared in those games that might be Toad, but it's not for sure. Actually, it would probably be best for us to count the notable toad in the blue vest as Toad, and others as just Toads. 10:23, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
 * In the beginning of Galaxy, it shows the Toad Brigade holding various stars and stuff, and the red Toad is wearing the blue shirt. It might be hinting towards him being the actual character Toad.  Plus, though this isn't really concrete evidence, back during Super Mario Sunshine, there were li'l kubrick figures and the Toad in red was packaged in the group, showing his importance despite the fact that he did nothing in Sunshine (along with the other Toads).  Either way, it would be good to at least mention the fact that this Toad could possibly be the one from the Toad Brigade in Galaxy.  UrsulaBoi 11:08, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Maybe mention in the other appearances section that it's unsure whether these Toads are Toad. 11:46, 24 April 2008 (EDT)

A Toad, Not The Toad
Many parts of this article talk about games which feature Toads(s) as if they were the actual Toad character. Obviously, any game with numerous Toad(s) isn't a game the actual Toad appears in. Therefore, all of this informaiton needs to be moved to the Toad (species) page. Fixitup

odd section
If you scroll down to the Mario Tennis. There is and two sentence that are to closes together is this Vandal.Princess Grapes Butterfly 13:54, 8 March 2008 (EST)

Wario
Why the heck do we have a relationship to Wario in here?? Its not needed!

Well Toad did fight against Wario in Wario's woods.

new quote,please?
umm, does anyone have a better quote? Super Luigi!!

Super Princess Peach Appearence
Well after seeing the intro, I saw that Mario, Luigi and one specific Toad that looks just like Toad being taken in by the hammer bros to Bowser. Should that info be added to Toad's page?

If you're sure it was one Toad, then by all means add it to the article.-- 19:04, 10 September 2009 (EDT)

Luigi's Mansion
In this game, I pretty sure that Toad appeared only and not other toads as he was sent by peach. Should it be added to the article?

A Toad, Not the Toad (Again)
A long time ago I commented on how much of the page contains information about Toad species and not Toad the character in terms of game appearances. Soon I WILL be moving anything deemed the Toad species unless someone expresses concern about what shouldn't be moved and why. FD09

For which parts are you speaking about. Most of the article besides the confusion with Toad appearences seem to be related to the character Toad. Things like the mario 64 part which I assume you're talking about are confirmed to be Toad from the instruction manuels. User:Pichufan93

Main Quote
There is somthing odd about the main quote.I mean, Toad didn't appear in Mario and Luigi:Bowser's inside story.So the main quote belongs to another Toad!Is it okay to change it?User:Mr bones

Yeah, it should be changed. Toad never appeared in that game. User:Pichufan93

Who changed the new main quote?User:mr bones

Mario Baseball conclusion
So should it be stated that Toad is infact in Mario baseball and Sluggers as seen by his bio, chemistry and importance in the opening movies? his bio states that he is peach's loyal subject who tries to protect her. It's possible that they made his vest red so that he wouldn't be with the same vest as Blue Toad. Yoshi is also stated as green yoshi in the baseball games at times as well I believe. So should it be added with the amount of hints there is? User:Pichufan93

Stats
Does anyone have his stats from Mario Party 3 when he was a partner for Princess Peach in duel mode? --Daisysbiggestfan 00:56, 12 January 2010 (EST)

Sure here's it:

Toad

Attack 1

Stamina 1

Salary 1

By the way, that's not THE Toad, but a Toad.-- 14:11, 12 January 2010 (EST)

Actually, that is Toad as from what I seen, the game refers the Toad as just Toad. He also looks just like his usual self in that game. That's why he is Peach's partner due to being Peach's assistant and he's the only toad there. User:Pichufan93

Super Mario Galaxy (series) Toad
That's the TOAD BRIGADE captain, not toad, toad has a blue vest, not red, that information should be deleted. I don't think it's just toad saying he's the captain and wearing a red vest. Who agrees with me?!

Super Mario Galaxy Bio

Collectible Card Bio: ''Toad is Princess Peach's closest confidant and sworn protector. Typically Toad is a happy character, as seen by the constant smile on his face. But now he has reason to be concerned. His beloved princess has been kidnapped by Bowser, and Toad will stop at nothing to help find her. Just when all is feared lost, Toad and his friends appear in their Mushroom-shaped ships and help guide Mario on his quest to save Princess Peach.''

Looks like it is indeed Toad. the bio is enough proofs.13:53, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

The captain is indeed Toad as since Sunshine, Toad has appeared in various games with a red vest (even confirmed in official guides for games like sunshine and even the spin-offs). His most standard look is with a blue vest though in games his coloration is changed for various reasons (such as distinguishing himself from the other Toads). He is also a major Toad in comparison to the other Toads in the game. His bio for galaxy is pretty much the only information that we have for the captain and even it confirms that he is Toad. He also got official artwork for galaxy 1 and was on the boxart of the second one as well. He is also one of the save icons that are represting galaxy characters (others include Mario, Luigi, Peach, Yoshi and Luma from galaxy 2 I believe which are all characters that are in the game and he is labelled as Toad [though named as the captain to distinguish himself as well as the fact that he calls himself the captain of the Toad Brigade]). It's similar to Yoshi as we and even Nintendo sees the yoshis in sunshine and galaxy 2 as Yoshi himself and the same goes for Toad as they are both generic characters. User:Propeller Toad

An Error
I just was reviewing, and isn't Toadsworth Princess Peach's long time protector and not Toad himself? Just saying. Feel free to give your ideas to this.

I'm not sure what part you are mentioning in particular but if you mean the intro then that is referring to the fact that Toad is a protector of the Mushroom Kingdom due to efforts such as helping mario to save the kingdom or even protecting it by himself in games like Wario's Woods. However in relation to Princess Peach, Toad originally was Peach's protector and her loyal servant who would take care of her (his roles being similar to Toadsworth's in the original games-eg. Mario RPG legend of the seven stars). Toadsworth only came in recently and replaced Toad's role in the newer games like in sunshine and the mario and luigi games. However in some of the new games such as the galaxy games, it is seen that the captain is Toad as he is going on to help his princess by helping Mario to recover the power stars. Even though Toadsworth is peach's steward now, Toad is still her loyal servant and does his best to protect her (thus being a long time protector).

User:Propeller Toad

Powers and Abilities
Nothing about NSMB Wii.
 * While two Toads are playable, Toad isn't technically one of them as Blue Toad and Yellow Toad have their own pages. The abilities of Toad from that game can be seen on those two pages. User:Pichufan93
 * Yellow and Blue are toads too, so every toad can be Mini, Propeller and Penguin.

Super Mario Bros.
The article claims that Toad was one of the Mushroom Retainers rescued in Super Mario Bros., but this is not stated in the game and no source is cited; is there any official word on this? He's confirmed to be a Mushroom Retainer in the Super Mario Bros. 2 manual, but that wouldn't have to mean he's one of those that appear in Super Mario Bros.; we don't know how many Mushroom Retainers there are. As far as I'm aware, Toad as a character wasn't invented until the western Super Mario Bros. 2, so unless there's some source retrospectively stating that he's meant to be one of the Toads in the original SMB, that section shouldn't be here.--vellidragon 14:31, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I suppose no, there are many other things that makes your mind confused. Like this Toad Brigade. They weren't even confirmed to be the same as the ones in SMS. So back to the subject, no, I don't think there is a single source confirming that. If there is, then the writer of that information should put it in references.07:23, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Source??????? Read manual for this wiki, it's not upcoming game.By the way, look at mushroom retainer and Toad, very familiar don't you think?

Retainer has 3 colors+black background because of NES's 8-bitness, while Toad from Wii has alot of colors with 3rd dimension. Both has white cap with red dots, both has white pants, rounded shoes (not brown because of 8-bit), that shirt (you know why not blue, right?).
 * It doesn't need to be an upcoming game. Anything that can't easily be cofnirmed from what's seen in the game or stated in its manual should be sourced, people can just go around putting nonsense speculation everywhere otherwise. Also, nobody doubts that Toad is a Toad, if that's what you're trying to show.--vellidragon 15:47, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

No, that doesn't mean they're the same. All the toads look similar. Specially red ones, just look at paper mario's many red toads!! And they all look like Toad himself.07:28, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

The Smash Bros. series has Toad's first appearance (in his trophies) labelled as Super Mario Bros. and when Super Mario Bros. 2 was made, it was stated within the instruction manuals that Toad was one of Peach's Mushroom Retainers from the original game. In Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars, Toad was one of the 6 mushroom retainers that appeared as well. Additionally, the mario cartoons (if you count it) has him referring to himself as a mushroom retainer as well. I believe the further evidence is that Toad still has the position of being Peach's loyal servants (considering the games after Super Mario Bros. had the retainers renamed as Peach's servants and guards). Toad has also been seen as a representation for all Toads, therefore he has been named to being one of the retainers in the original game as well as seen in the twenty fifth mario series anniversary products and booklets. In short, Toad's singular appearance was yes in Super Mario Bros. 2, however his this singular character was made directly off the design from the mushroom retainers making any one of them the Toad that made his appearance in Mario 2. User:Pichufan9309:37, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
 * It seems there's a bit of a misunderstanding here; I'm not doubting the fact that Toad is a Mushroom Retainer, I even pointed out that the Super Mario Bros. 2 confirms him to be one. The manual does not state that he's one of the Mushroom Retainers in Super Mario Bros., however; there may be any number of Mushroom Retainers in addition to those that are rescued in that game, which I also pointed out above. If his first appearance is indeed given as Super Mario Bros. in other official material though, that's proof enough I suppose. Someone should probable cite those in the respective section though to avoid further confusion (as I stated above, it's not clear from the game itself or its manual that Toad is supposed to be in it, so sourcing that information makes sense.)--vellidragon 15:47, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

This game marks the debut of the mushroom people (Toads). Therefore, considering how Toad is seen as the singular representation of the Toads, it makes sense that he made his debut in this game, though he was never considered to being a singular character in later games. Also look at remakes of Super Mario Bros., like Super Mario Bros. deluxe. This game has Toad as the singular representation for the mushroom retainers further proving this point. Mario RPG has also made references to his appearance and the Melee and Brawl trophies are big proofs as well (especially the melee one which talks mainly about Toad himself). I agree with Pichufan93 as it is true for the 25th Super Mario bros. anniversary, merchandise lists Toad being one of the characters making their debuts in this game. Also spin-offs state that his first appearance was in this game (Super Mario Kart, Mario kart 64 ect). Propeller Toad 19:46, 31 October 2010 (UTC)