User talk:LinkTheLefty/Archive 7

Toad Balloon
I changed the name back to capitalized form because it is a proper noun. -- Unshy Guy 21:12, April 3, 2019 (EDT)

Gravity wall
Hi, would you mind checking your Super Mario Galaxy 2 Prima guide and seeing if there's a frequently used name for the gravity-inducing walls? "Gravity field" was very common, but weren't there other names that were used that aren't overly descriptive?

P.S.: If you're wondering, the Super Mario Odyssey Prima guide isn't feasible enough, since the walls' only mention used an overly descriptive name. 15:49, April 5, 2019 (EDT)
 * I think I'll go with checking the Super Mario Galaxy Prima guide before I carry out the move. 18:49, April 7, 2019 (EDT)
 * I think it's best if you check for names of the articles you mentioned as well. I should point out that page 219 of the Super Mario Galaxy 2 Prima guide generically calls the Gravity Arrow "the switch", but that's the only mention I can find. I also left a message here that might be worth checking out as well. 19:27, April 7, 2019 (EDT)

Mini-Ninja
I'm not sure about using "Mini(-)Ninja" as the main name for sections of Ninji outside Hotel Mario's, since "Ninji" was an in-game and instruction book name for SMB2, which outranks a magazine name. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:30, April 5, 2019 (EDT)

Koopas without a shell
This seems like the "Small vehicle with surfboard" situation to me, but anyways, I'd suggest "Koopas without shells" for plural, similar to how Shy Guys on Pogo Sticks are singularized to "Shy Guy on a Pogo Stick." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:15, April 5, 2019 (EDT)

"Wet Bones"
Seriously, this is like the case told to you for the Big Koopa Troopa/Turtle thing. Single-game PRIMA names don't trump in-game names, even for a single section. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 04:29, April 6, 2019 (EDT)
 * Wrong. PRIMA names do not trump prior in-game names, period. The rules aren't "If there's an alternate name from any source and no other source mentions them, use that." The other naming policy rules still apply. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 12:35, April 6, 2019 (EDT)
 * They're only "name changes" if they would have changed our article name at the time based on our current policy of that. Otherwise, it's just "PRIMA calling Crowbers 'Ravens,'" ie them being screwups, not a "name change." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:02, April 6, 2019 (EDT)
 * But with Fishbone/Fish Bone, the next English tranlation (and every single one afterwards) calls them as such, making "Wet Bones" seem even more like a screwup from someone who didn't know they existed prior than an attempt at a name change. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:17, April 6, 2019 (EDT)

More filenames and Prima names request
I have more question about filenames and Prima names. Also, forgot those... And finally, what are both Rammerheads internal filename? Do they share the same filename (in case they should stay merged), or both use different filenames (in case they can possibly be split). -- 13:33, April 29, 2019 (EDT)
 * You haven't been specific about the Spiny Hermit. You said that Spiny Hermit wasn't in the guide, but you didn't tell me wether it had generic mentions or not ever mentioned.
 * How are called those particular "Big Amps" in both Super Mario Galaxy and Super Mario Galaxy 2 Prima guides? I know that their internal filename is "BigBirikyu", but its Japanese name in New Super Mario Bros. U is "Deka Birikyu". Those Super Mario Galaxy Big Amps aren't called Big/Deka Birikyu, but rather "Biribiri Ball". This might imply that they were intended to be big variants of Amp, before being changed to generic electric balls.
 * What are the Platform Blocks called in the New Super Mario Bros. Nintendo Power guide? Also, what are both New Super Mario Bros and Super Mario 3D Land internal filenames, given that the former incarnation has the Stretch Block's Japanese name.
 * What does the Draglet as an internal filename? The article implies that it resembles Eeries.
 * What are the closest mentions of the Spiny Stretch Plant in the Prima guide?
 * Do both the New Super Mario Bros. Wii unused Big Buzzy Beetle and New Super Mario Bros. U internal filenames match?
 * What are both the normal Grrrol and the big Grrrol's internal filenames?
 * How are Mattermouths labelled in their internal filenames? There has been a proposal to stop calling them Dry Bones, and i'm interested if their internal filenames implies a relation to Dry Bones. -- 11:30, April 7, 2019 (EDT)
 * Do any Yoshi's Island DS guides mention the Sanbo Flower at any point?
 * Are Ocean Small Turtle mentioned in the Prima guide? If so, in which quote?
 * Are Tweesters mentioned in the Prima guide?
 * Apparently, Spoing and Sprangler were thought to be Scuttlebugs, or based of off them. Can you check out their internal filename, to see if they have a relation to Scuttlebug? -- 03:59, April 9, 2019 (EDT)
 * What's the Bowser Stunner's internal filename? Does it implies a relation to Amps? -- 03:59, April 23, 2019 (EDT)

Re:Monty Mania
I don't have the game either, and I'm not like the mole monarch or anything XD. On a technical level, Morty is derived from Indy, but as is Snailicorn from Bully, and there's been debate on that. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:10, April 8, 2019 (EDT)

[This]
How come you de-capitalized “Retainer” 184.181.102.188 02:33, April 23, 2019 (EDT)

"Snaky Mom"
It's more due to it having "Snaky" instead of the more accurate "snake" on there. It's like the Crowber entry, which literally translates it to "Black dude," to say nothing of "Bowser's Galactic Crack" or "Children on Crack in Time." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 06:48, April 24, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yes, and see, it makes it sound like some sort of bizarre adjective instead of a noun, which makes it seem an extremely baffling thing for an enemy to be called. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 07:14, April 24, 2019 (EDT)

Koopa Troopa's page
"Koopa" in reference to Troopas was, is, and always will be an attempt at shorthand. Given how often it goes back and forth between the two (with them generally being interchangeable in most games) I don't really think the "name priority per game" thing should be used there, as again, it's not a name change, it's a confusing shorthand form. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 12:15, April 24, 2019 (EDT)
 * Thing is "mushroom" and "star" are generic real-life terms anyway, so not necessarily intended as a shortening of "Super Mushroom" or "Super Star." "Koopa" in regards to Troopas is always a shortening, and it gets confusing with how many uses the word has anyways (not to mention leads some to the conclusion that Koopa Troopas are the most basic of all Koopas, which would often go into comparing apples and oranges). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:42, April 24, 2019 (EDT)
 * I know it's a common thing, but it's still an abridged form. Besides, they aren't calling Chargin' Chucks Troopas. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:34, April 29, 2019 (EDT)

Unchained Chomps
By who? It seems to just be yourself that suggests such. When a Chain Chomp breaks free from it's post (in any game style because it's not completely exclusive to SMB3) it still has a chain and is 100% identical to the shaken variant. The warped voice still says Chomp Chomp, but it also refers to Deep Cheeps and Blurps as "Cheep Cheep", so...

Also, it's not from the 3DS port, it's in the Wii U version. That is a source within the game referring to it as such. If it refers to a chomp that has broken free, then it refers to the shaken variant as well because they are one in the same.

"Treasure those moments where you can just sit and daydream, letting your mind wander as free as an Unchained Chomp" - Super Mario Maker tips notification

Black Dragon  21:56, April 25, 2019 (EDT)


 * I left the reply on my talk page as it's more ideal to keep the conversation in one place rather than to divide it up, FYI Black  Dragon  23:08, April 25, 2019 (EDT)

Darn this English translation conflation
I think I'm going about this the right way....? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:19, May 6, 2019 (EDT)

Am I, though? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:29, May 11, 2019 (EDT)
 * I dont think he's interested in replying. i actually told him about wiki but i probably should not have told some others about it, as i dont think most care about a "clone wiki" Results May Vary (talk) 00:05, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * Well he'll know about the JP names better than I will. Besides, I still need to figure out the situation with the little Gohmas between OoT, OoS, and TP. And I'm ensuring that it won't be a "clone" of the other one. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:09, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yeah i didnt want it to be a clone wiki or something. i'm just using that phrase because i assume many already think that, since it's like the 4th-5th zelda wiki. i dont want to constantly send new messages on someones talk page and annoy them--i just saying him & others here probably think it's a clone wiki (because of the gamepedia zelda wiki). I do think Gohma (boss) is a possible article title for the Queen Gohma in OoT Results May Vary (talk) 00:15, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * Okay, well i just didnt want to tell you about it if you werent interested (seeing as i told you about 1-2 weeks ago), and I thought i involuntarily dragged you into something. It's definitely ambitious to build up a zelda wiki from scratch (especially with alternatives), so there's also that. It's kind of a controversial decision on my end to start a "clone wiki", but something in me felt it had to be done Results May Vary (talk) 00:34, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * Thanks for letting me know--I didnt mean to sound condescending (if i came across that way). Like I said, Triforce Wiki is the hardest wiki task I've ever taken on, especially with like 3 other main wikis. It wouldnt surprise me if some didnt see the point or were uninterested Results May Vary (talk) 00:48, May 12, 2019 (EDT)

Oh right, and to think that's where I realized it was "Wall Master" for the first game and not "Wallmaster"....I remembered "Tartnuc" as well. Speaking of, Barcode Battler II actually did call it "Digtale," so that's probably a good idea. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:36, May 12, 2019 (EDT)

So, to wit, have you currently any idea on how Gohma Larva relates to Baby Gohma/Young Gohma in Japanese texts? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 02:56, May 12, 2019 (EDT)

I'm glad you guys have found a project to work together on, but this sort of business doesn't belong on the Mario Wiki. You can continue on the Triforce Wiki. 16:19, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * We can when LTL makes an account on there. Why do you think we're talking about it here? It's the only place I can get ahold of him. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:38, May 12, 2019 (EDT)


 * Regarding Triforce Wiki, I sometimes am not good at explaining, but here's my opinion: I think since ZD and Triforce both want to be independent wikis, it would be realistic to at least affiliate rather than shut them off completely (so then that can narrow it down to two main zelda wikis). However, I dont want Triforce Wiki to fall under ZD Wiki's manual of style, as me, you & other editors worry about the quality standards there. by integrating the content of both wikis, that would narrow it down to two wikis. since zd wiki doesnt tend to have the same kind of activity in the sense that triforce has, i think it would be better to have them be in charge of the walkthroughs and triforce in charge of the wiki aspect. I believe in a zelda wiki like triforce as much as you, doc, doomhiker & others. What's definite is them approaching Triforce is too soon, so that will have to wait. Basically I'm worried i made you suspicious of me, but hopefully my words make sense Results May Vary (talk) 19:41, July 19, 2019 (EDT)


 * Ah no worries, I was afraid of bringing this up because i didnt want people to misinterpret me as a sellout or something. I do have zelda dungeon linked in the sidebar, because i definitely like their walkthrough/content info, and i understand why they proposed the idea for a content/community merge. I messaged you here because i thought it was important to tell you, and you tend to be here more frequently. As for transparency, i'm definitely glad to be transparent. back when zelda wiki was sold to gamepedia, there was no transparency. GoldenChaos just sold it without telling the community, and I don't want history to repeat itself here. But yeah, this is definitely a better discussion for triforce -- i just wanted to urgently get the message across to you Results May Vary (talk) 23:29, July 19, 2019 (EDT)

Strollin' Stu
Out of curiosity, do you have a scan of that guide that call the Strollin' Stus "Goombas? [No doubting the information, I'd just like to feature it on the wiki's twitter account lol] --Glowsquid (talk) 19:57, May 11, 2019 (EDT)
 * Hell yeah. Thanks! --Glowsquid (talk) 14:13, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * I don't see why not. --Glowsquid (talk) 20:11, May 12, 2019 (EDT)

Electro Koopa color variation
Actually, they technically aren't. Blue is small, has two spikes, can come out of its shell, is fairly silent, and has pink hair. Red is large, has three spikes, makes squeaking noises, cannot leave its shell, and has a pair of pink horn-like protrusions on its head. They use different models, unlike actual color variations in the game (which have a single gray model with different shaders). See the Super Mario Sunshine section of The Models Resource here to see how actual color variations are handled. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:39, May 12, 2019 (EDT)
 * The green one literally is an enlarged red one with a different eye texture and color shader for the shell. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:44, May 13, 2019 (EDT)

EarthBound Beginnings
Even if Mother is the more well-known name, wouldn't it still make more sense to use the official English title? 02:03, May 14, 2019 (EDT)
 * WikiBound's way of doing things isn't really the same as ours, though. Case in point, splitting pages solely due to their English names, even when said English names are unofficial. As for EarthBound Beginnings not being used in-game, that's really just a side effect of Nintendo releasing the unaltered prototype ROM.


 * As for official sources always using the Japanese name, how many of those sources are post-EarthBound Beginnings? To my knowledge, the only post-localization source that mentions Beginnings is SSBU, and I'm pretty sure it doesn't say anything more specific than "EarthBound series". 10:12, May 14, 2019 (EDT)
 * Mother/EarthBound Beginnings is a good compromise, yeah. Unrelated, but I'm not sure why you linked this when reverting the Underchomp edit, since although it doesn't say EarthBound Beginnings anywhere, it also doesn't say Mother (except in Mother 3).


 * Also, I like your naming policy idea, though I think it'd be kinda confusing to prioritize SSB over everything else since you'd have weird, more literal translations like "New Year's Eve" (as opposed to "New Year's Eve Bomb") listed among the more commonly-used names from the Mother 3 fan translation. Also, how would you handle Tazmily Village being called (almost) a straight romanization of the Japanese name (Tazumili iirc) in Lucas's amiibo description? 10:49, May 14, 2019 (EDT)
 * That's a good point about the naming policy, however, I will point out that there's precedent for using new English names over old foreign ones (i.e. Nipper Dandelion).


 * As for the WikiBound stuff, I'm not sure if I'd agree that Pokey is outdated, seeing as how it's the only localization we got in an actual Mother game. Although the fan translation also uses it, the fan translation has a few inconsistencies caused by prioritizing Japanese names over existing localizations (i.e. Arachnid!!!/Arachnid!!!!). As for the New Year's Eve thing, although it's a more literal translation of the Japanese name, "New Year's Eve Bomb" is arguably the more well-known name, and it makes more sense. 12:57, May 14, 2019 (EDT)

Phantamanta
Unlike with Gooble, this has the added note of "what else could it refer to?" "Gooble" could be at least a couple entities, "Phantamanta" seems pretty specific. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:52, May 15, 2019 (EDT)

Internal filenames
Hi. Rather than you requesting that I look up filenames for you, would you mind if I told you how to do it yourself? --Hiccup (talk) 15:03, May 17, 2019 (EDT)

RE:Trample Switch
Sorry for responding so late. Here's what I could dig up from the Super Mario 3D World Prima eGuide:

P Switch ''Step on a P Switch to uncover secret Coins, reveal hidden trails, or move platforms into place. Most P Switch effects are temporary, so make sure you move quickly! Orange P Switches tend to come in pairs or more, and must all be activated at the same time.''

Trample Switch ''A larger variety of P Switch. Orange Trample Switches tend to come in pairs or more, and must all be activated at the same time.''

So yeah, not really that helpful at all... 16:57, May 24, 2019 (EDT)
 * The images are placed randomly with no cohesion, but it starts with the small P Switch, then the orange P Switch, then the larger blue P Switch. 13:50, June 26, 2019 (EDT)

YCW enemies
Also, do you think you could try looking up internal filenames for Yoshi's Crafted World enemies debuting in said game, for lack of a better way to look up their names? 16:59, May 24, 2019 (EDT)
 * Aditionally, is there any Prima guide, and/or Shogakugan guide for it? -- 15:01, June 1, 2019 (EDT)

Eely-Mouth Edit
Hey, thanks for changing my edit on Eely-Mouth's page. I felt my writing on the tears part was a bit redundant. I like your way of putting it better. :D Kan Kan Mikan~ (talk) 05:48, June 2, 2019 (EDT)

Missing console
I can't seem to find information on the unreleased Nintendo super visor console anywhere on the super Mario wiki. Lord Falafel (talk) 16:57, June 4, 2019 (EDT)

Dark Tortoise English description
I defer you to the English name. Calling what has already been called a tortoise in the name a tortoise in the bio would be redundant. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:36, June 5, 2019 (EDT)

RE:Splitting Chibi Yoshis
While if the colored Yoshi articles still existed then yes, the pages would be merged. However, we now have no page to merge the info to, as merging the info to the Yoshi species article would be clunky, meaning that they have to have their own pages as they are characters with personalities. And we should not not create a page just because SMK is hard-to-find, as regardless there is available info that needs to be documented. Who knows, maybe in the future the magna will be scanned and published online? 18:34, June 6, 2019 (EDT)

Too far
What have you done? Some of those titles weren't archived anywhere else on the wiki. All of the pitches were sent to Nintendo by companies that made video games or had experience with video games. I worked my butt off trying to get all of those titles on the list. My hand was aching the first days I edited games onto the list because the list was missing so many. I corrected so many mistakes that I and other people made and I kept on looking and looking for all the released and unreleased games. I tried so hard to give all the source websites and people credit, I wanted to expand every Mario and donkey kong fan's knowledge of how many games there were in those franchises and I had to look at an entire list of home computers and other sites and had to go through so many pages and so many games to make sure the list had no missing titles. And I didn't want to look like a loser in front of the wiki and let down so many avid fans of these franchises and you undid so much work. I took hours out of 20 plus days trying to make sure the list became more accurate than Wikipedia. What a waste. Lord Falafel (talk) 00:42, June 14, 2019 (EDT)

Citation
The cancelled super Mario bros port for the Apple IIGS has a good source: list of Apple IIGS games. It's in the unreleased games section Lord Falafel (talk) 15:00, June 14, 2019 (EDT)

Another page
Should we make a page called list of unofficial media? Lord Falafel (talk) 15:32, June 14, 2019 (EDT)

RE on your latest update on list of unreleased media
Yes, please do make that sort of page and please link it to me. Lord Falafel (talk) 18:58, June 14, 2019 (EDT)

Quick questions.
Hey! Could you look up at both Gobblegut and King Kaliente's internal filenames, along with their fiery and scorched variants respectively? There is an active talk page, about wether to split the scorched King Kaliente from King Kaliente, and a proposal failed. -- 07:18, June 16, 2019 (EDT)

"Killer Clown"
Just so you know something regarding this page move, the Japanese word "Bumawashi" roughly translates to "turn around" or "rotate" in English. 13:28, June 24, 2019 (EDT)

Mel
Do the tinfoil Mels have a separate filename from the Mels? Or the tinfoil, and unable to be eaten is purely aethistic, and they're the same thing? -- 06:54, June 25, 2019 (EDT)

YCW Boss filenames
Just out of curiosity, what were the filenames for the bosses in Yoshi's Crafted World? 11:44, June 25, 2019 (EDT)

Re: Chikako
As it turns out, it's called both Chikako AND Glitter in the VC manual, as you can see here: --
 * Yeah, to be honest, there probably isn't a lot of differences. Only a few enemies got new localized names, like Goombo, Bullet Biff, Bombshell Koopa, and Piranha Plant. As far as I can tell, the manual descriptions for the enemies and characters as well as the story description were pulled from the original manual, with a few wording adjustments here and there, presumably.--
 * A bit late here, but it’s the North American version. Dunno if the European manual has anything different, but you never know knowing how things are sometimes localized differently there.--

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms
Think that's good enough for the urban legends page? It's about a Mario song, after all.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:40, June 26, 2019 (EDT)
 * I'd still say it's related enough to the Mario franchise in this case, as it is wholly encompassed within the "Mario"-related section of that game. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:16, June 26, 2019 (EDT)

Mini Pig Poppo
Pretty sure one color can only be defeated with clapping and one only with stomping, but that's not mentioned on the new page...last playthrough of it I watched the player was very consistent with that, at any rate. 🤷‍♀️ Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 05:21, June 27, 2019 (EDT)

RE:Hogwash
Not that I know of, but I don't see why a source is needed. I think it's cumbersome to have every instance of "Hogwash" changed to "Hogwash the Flying Pig", especially if it's plural, just because the shortened version may not be explicitly represented in any official material. 09:45, June 28, 2019 (EDT)

Yoshi egg
Okay, I absolutely do not get why there absolutely NEEDS to be manual/guide references for the name "Yoshi's Egg" when the name is also in-game. The in-game name from Super Mario Maker 2 will do just fine; while not explicitly covered by the policy, there's nonetheless no need to change it back at all. 12:07, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * It's so that people know where the name originated from. -- 12:08, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * That wasn't my point. 12:09, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * That's exactly right though - in nearly three decades of its history throughout Mario games, it only showed up in-game very recently. References aren't needed when when they are in-game, true - but when it is an entirely different game that was released much, much later, can we still say it isn't needed? Removing existing references has always been discouraged except in a few cases like an upcoming release having come out. From what I understand, manual and guide references aren't usually needed if the content is mentioned is a matching product, and in this case, Super Mario Maker 2 absolutely does not correspond to manuals from 1992 and 2003. We could probably be a little clearer on this in policy, but really, the removal of such information is potentially misleading. LinkTheLefty (talk) 12:32, July 25, 2019 (EDT)

A quick question
Are Purple Bullet Bills named in guides other than the Prima? -- 12:29, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * If I recall correctly, they are referred to as "purple Bullet Bills" in other guides, but I'm not able to check right now. LinkTheLefty (talk) 12:32, July 25, 2019 (EDT)

Release dates
Hi, so while i'd love to add that picture as a source in the articles, I'm kind of afraid it would not look that good as a source image. it's from an ebay listing of an e3 1996 binder release detailing facts, company highlights, and other info Results May Vary (talk) 16:22, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yeah that's why i saved the listing photo to Wayback Machine, just in case the listing photos get removed Results May Vary (talk) 16:55, July 25, 2019 (EDT)
 * The listing is here. I havent taken a full look at it myself https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-64-SNES-NES-Virtual-Boy-Press-Kit-Store-Sign-Display-Binder-Folder/401799907991?hash=item5d8d240a97:g:hWoAAOSwOspdBeNc Results May Vary (talk) 17:06, July 25, 2019 (EDT)

Boo Buddy Swarm
It doesn't really matter whether or not the other Boo Buddies weren't named in that guide, that doesn't disqualify "Boo Buddy Swarm" from being a name. There was actually something suggesting that Kamikaze Koopa wasn't an actual name, since it was mentioned in the main text. Either way, Boo Buddy Swarm is a more name-like name than Boo Buddy (swarm). 07:19, August 1, 2019 (EDT)

Stamp file names
So what's the file name for the Boss Bass's one? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:19, August 30, 2019 (EDT)
 * I see no real reason Boss Bass couldn't be considered an early iteration of Big Cheep Cheep, particularly with the relation to Baby Cheeps. And we haven't seen a "Big Cheep Cheep" jumping in a platforming game since then, only stand-ins (Red Blurp, Spike Bass, Porcupuffer), and with Porcupuffer going the carnivore route in SMM2, I think this may be more clear-cut than we thought. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:46, August 30, 2019 (EDT)
 * Exactly, though I was unaware of the "Okina" bit. Giant-er Cheep Cheeps appear in the background of one of SC's courses, using a different sprite but the same design. Should the "Okina" bit be added to the foreign name box, then? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:28, August 31, 2019 (EDT)


 * So, regarding the above, do you think the Cheeps prominently appearing here should be considered Blurps in the same manner as the Mario Golf ones? The reason I didn't bring this up earlier is because they seemed too big, but size is relative, after all....worth noting is that the relative eye size is more similar to that of normal Cheeps in Story, if only marginally. Similarly, I'm toying with the idea of considering the MK64 Banshee Boardwalk one a Big Cheep Cheep, since like in SS a "normal"-sized one appears at the winner's circle (though this one may be a balloon), and it would also explain why they gave it the Boss Bass-esque design (reusing Baku's SM64DS model) in MKDS.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:51, September 17, 2019 (EDT)
 * Its size on the Star Hole art relative to Yoshi and Wario is rather distinctly large, but the eye size on it is more similar to YStory Cheep graphics than B.Blurp ones, though it also closely resembles the art specifically for Akapuku. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:25, September 18, 2019 (EDT)
 * Biggies are longer, yeah. They likely made the eyes on the model larger for normal Cheeps so they'd be more distinct (so they wouldn't be lost from compression), not the compression itself. There was a lot of resource reusing and adjusting for that game's base models anyways; notably, Bumpties, Pak E Derm, Gabons, Don Bongo, and probably some other things I'm forgetting have the exact same torso piece, just textured differently. In the interim, should we go ahead and move the Blurp page to Big Blurp so there's less confusion in trying to facilitate this? It seems to me that the site's use of simply "Blurp" was simply to cram it into their storybook verse style. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:20, September 18, 2019 (EDT)
 * Regarding SS though, it is called Cheep-Cheep Island, so how would that work with naming? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:04, September 19, 2019 (EDT)
 * Given they cared about the size of other objects (like the ship and the Magikoopa) I'd say they were intentionally big. I was more thinking that if we merged that to Blurp, the page title there may need changed too. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:10, September 19, 2019 (EDT)
 * Where else would we merge it, though? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:01, September 19, 2019 (EDT)
 * Big Cheep Cheep's currently in a weird situation, as due to Boss Bass and RB Blurps being counted as separate, the "first appearance" is listed as FSA. Tacking on more spinoffs to before that (particularly ones using the distinctive YStory design) could potentially make it even more awkward. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:26, September 19, 2019 (EDT)
 * I suppose that'd probably work the best for now. By the way, do you know the typical file names for the "current" Big Cheep Cheep? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:30, September 20, 2019 (EDT)
 * Not surprised on the NSMBW/U ones there. Reason I ask of course is because of Boss Bass in the NES Remix games. Anyways, I suppose the question regarding how the "Blurps" fit into this remains. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 03:02, September 20, 2019 (EDT)
 * Again, though, in SM64 only, Puku and Baku are roughly the same size. Baku's found in the "big enemy" area, but so is Fly Guy and Lakitu. Though it does differ in that it's unique to said area in that game. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 04:36, September 20, 2019 (EDT)
 * Cheep Cheep was really big in SM64. They never appear alongside each other, but both are slightly larger than Mario iirc. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:40, September 20, 2019 (EDT)
 * Perspective. The Cheep Chomp's closer to the camera than Mario, the Cheep Cheep's significantly further from it. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:08, September 20, 2019 (EDT)
 * Huh, coulda sworn they looked a lot closer, at least in the original....maybe that's what the Cheep article means when it says they "pose even less threat" in 64DS.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:05, September 21, 2019 (EDT)
 * OK, guess I was wrong. They just looked a lot bigger than that.....there's also the possibility that prior to release that "Puku" was meant to be a "Buku," explaining its appearance as well as how "Baku" puns off it, but that's getting speculative. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 09:33, September 23, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yeah, but at the same time, Porky's sudden voraciousness is what spearheaded me to start this discussion up again...DLC would make sense, given Pokey's conspicuous absence, although I do recall oddities involving how its stacking works in the fangame SMBX, so similar oddities may be present in official games too...(also it's sorta odd that I've given both names for the jerk kid from the Earthbound games in this message, but these things happen I suppose.) I agree that Baku's cameo is probably a self-aware gag about that, though. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:09, September 23, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yeah, I saw that. Only other thing I can think of is if a JP MKDS guide calls it anything. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:48, September 27, 2019 (EDT)
 * Found another thing: Game & Watch Gallery 2 features what seems to be a Boss Bass, though when not jumping it resembles a SMW Cheep Cheep. When jumping, its eyes get squinty and it looks like a skinny version of the SMB3 Boss Bass. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:52, October 11, 2019 (EDT)
 * Back to the Mario Golf "Mario's Star" thing, I checked a YouTube video, and upon further examination, the body of water around the fish-shaped island makes a fishbowl shape, indicating it's probably just Cheep Cheep (because that would be a very big bowl). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 04:20, October 31, 2019 (EDT)
 * I wouldn't say it's "off model" so much, it was the only model it had, in relation to a "Bub" that looked more like a Blurp. So far, the only person I see looking at Bass and Brtha as the same is Alex, who missd out on the original proposal and is currently preoccupied mentally and emotionally with the ZeldaWiki thing. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:27, November 3, 2019 (EST)
 * Another thing I'd be curious over is the Japanese version of the advice for Abandon Ship and Cheep Cheep Chase. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:06, November 5, 2019 (EST)

So why do you specifically translate Okina as "large?" Isn't it just a synonym? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:16, November 6, 2019 (EST)
 * Thing is, if none of the other huge side enemies (aside from Chuckya, which appears elsewhere and acts like the boss) have "special" names, why would they give one to this one, especially one that makes it seem less like Cheep Cheep and more like Blurp? I think the issue here is SM64DS's redesigning Bakubaku to look more like Kyodai Pukupuku, just like how Ukkiki was to look like Osaru-san, with the main difference being the monkeys were never really sorted out. What I wouldn't give for some SM64 design documents...but more importantly, Kyodai Pukupuku was only aggressive in the same situations that Pukupuku are aggressive in its own game, and passive when they are as well. Bakubaku's always aggressive no matter the location. Dai/Deka Pukupuku's normally only found underwater as Cheep's large counterpart for jumping is now Porcupuffer (briefly Spike Bass), who trades the "eating" gimmick for the less lethal "can't be jumped on or frozen effectively." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:52, November 7, 2019 (EST)

Re:SMM2 filenames
There's is a sound effect for se_ui_singingparts_BigRedYoshisEgg.bwav, which does sing "big red Yoshi's egg." The Angry Sun one is just called "sun." There are also ones for "redcannon" and "redPOWBlock," but that's about it. I haven't found the file with the Cheep Chomp yet. 23:18, September 4, 2019 (EDT)
 * The car is named se_ui_singingparts_KoopaTroopaCar.bwav, and the voice sings "Koopa Troopa Car." I looked in many files for the Cheep Chomp, but am still unable to find it. 12:11, September 6, 2019 (EDT)
 * Looking at the barslist files, the Toads are KinopioBuilder, KinopioBuilder1, KinopioBuilder2, up to KinopioBuilder5. Toad and Toadette as playable characters are Kinopio and Kinopico</tt>. I am not experienced with DS ripping. 10:39, September 20, 2019 (EDT)

Regarding the Yoshi's Story snake TPP
Hello. If you're seeing this, I've updated the proposal with another option and tried to neaten/clarify things a bit more, and I'm sending you and other voters this message in order to inform you of the changes, as courtesy dictates (and especially if you might want to change your vote). Thank you and good day. -- 00:04, September 10, 2019 (EDT)

Wiggler
While I sincerely doubt it, is there anything to this edit? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 04:31, September 10, 2019 (EDT)

P Panel
Hi, would you mind going through your hard copy of the Super Mario 3D World Prima guide to find page numbers for the names I found for P Panel, and also find the name in Shogakukan? Thanks! 11:07, September 10, 2019 (EDT)
 * I believe it was at the end of the Beep Block Skyway section, in the part with the third Green Star. If it's not there, check the Cakewalk Flip segment for the second Green Star or the Mystery House Marathon segment for the third Green Star. 20:44, September 11, 2019 (EDT)

Twitter
What do you mean it is not evidence? The like came from the designer himself. What can you tell what is evidence or not?

This was the case with these publications, but say it's never enough.
 * 3 themes in a music
 * Kremlings' past

ChristopherPAraujo (talk) 21:23, September 19, 2019 (EDT)

The Gregg I did that talk about the Kremlings and Lost World, but says it is not enough. Try you to write about it, because I have no more arguments. ChristopherPAraujo (talk) 22:28, September 19, 2019 (EDT)

Regarding the snakes
While that's something, I still find it dubious at best that they'd adopt the English name for exactly one other thing when SMA already used the original JP name. Not to mention the differences in color and lack of projectile ability, and the fact that another original enemy in the game was given a lazily-generic Japanese name despite looking familiar. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:35, September 27, 2019 (EDT)
 * Pokey's still Sanbo though (and its original color), and honestly, this comes off as a bit of a slippery slope-type thing to me to consider them definitely the same as opposed to "likely inspired by." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:45, September 27, 2019 (EDT)

Spiny Dream Course
Hi, the reason I didn't upload one for that is that the rip of TSR (which the KRR thing seems to be taken from) is really bad and old (and likely has the wrong colors). The fact that it uses white (which bleeds) as a background color is just the tip of the iceberg with it. Then there's the fact that they actually seem to shimmer in-game. I considered it, but ultimately found that with the current rips, it's pointless. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:14, October 1, 2019 (EDT)
 * It's likely a legacy upload from Shy Guy Kingdom, which is pretty much the Mesopotamia of spriting. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:51, October 1, 2019 (EDT)
 * Possibly. I ended up finding a slow-loading longplay for the sprite....I doubt that the shadow is actually part of the sprite, but I suppose it's our best bet. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 18:03, October 1, 2019 (EDT)

Alarm Clock
It's just a unique enemy that happens to be a goal. That's hardly a "boss." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:43, October 5, 2019 (EDT)
 * Giant Spear Man is a miniboss, as it fulfills more criteria. This is more like the faucet you mentioned; heck it's more of an object than an enemy, aside from having the "defeated enemy" visual effect, though iirc some other gimmicks have that too. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:32, October 7, 2019 (EDT)
 * Yes, and plenty of real clocks have themed faces. It does have personifying arms and legs, though. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:06, October 7, 2019 (EDT)

G&WG series characters
The Modern versions of Manhole, Fire, and Parachute do have many Toads, and Fire, Parachute, and Chef do have many Yoshis. But these games (except Chef) also have many Donkey Kong Jrs., which don't have a specific species (neither does Mario in Manhole). The Game & Watch Gallery series appearances of the Toads and Yoshis are on the characters' articles themselves, not their species' articles. I think it's better that way, and I believe the games meant for the characters themselves to appear since there are no different-colored ones. Chef starts with one Green Yoshi, which I believe is Yoshi himself. The Baby Yoshi that hatches is likely a different Yoshi. If you still disagree with all this, I'll ask an admin about it. Dwhitney (talk) 00:37, October 12, 2019 (EDT)

Are you gonna be around for the forseeable future?
I have a lot of discussions going, and since I'm busy with 6 different classes that are 3/4 over, I'd be more comfortable making proposals if you were around tbh. I'd also like you to weigh in on my discussion here to see if I'm looking at this the right way. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:29, November 3, 2019 (EST)
 * I've honestly considered proposing to merge the SMW boss with the normal Big Boo article, because what makes the SMW enemy any more worthy of the article than the SMW boss? For that matter, "Oyataka Teresa" was only the "Go on a Ghost Hunt" Big Boo if I'm understanding the wording correctly. For other ideas I have with merging, see the "current goals" section of my user page. Anyways, regarding ZeldaWiki, to make a long story short, RMV sold the Triforce Wiki IP to Porple because it turns out he doesn't like Zelda after all. That's all I'm going to say on that in public. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:27, November 3, 2019 (EST)
 * Porple says it's safe with him and he'll put Triforce Wiki back up sometime. Not quite sure what went down on the Zeldapedia front. Anyways, so potentially put SMW boss and SMS boss on the same proposal, you mean? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:06, November 3, 2019 (EST)
 * Regarding Gold Bowser Statue, "gold" enemies are the exception when it has to do with coins or points, and doesn't have a parenthesized identifier in Japanese. These are two inorganically-colored variants of the same thing. Additionally, this predates other "gold" enemies in that respect, with the first instance of that being the gold Goombas in SMRPG. Another Big Boo I'm curious about merging is the "Boo in a Box" one, as it is still distinctly larger than SMG's other Boos...I have more on that written on the Big Boo talk page. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 18:41, November 3, 2019 (EST)
 * Seems it's back up for now. Not quite sure what all went down, but things seem to have stabilized. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:53, November 4, 2019 (EST)
 * Just letting you know I brought back Triforce Wiki. The site host has had some server issues lately, so I've had to shift around some files and stuff to contribute less to slowdown (nothing Triforce Wiki related though). If Porple's ever ready, I could then share the next backup to him. I regret closing down the wiki hastily and originally planned on giving up on Zelda wikis entirely after this whole incident... And I tried a self-denial tactic, pretending to lose interest in the entire franchise. If any progress is made on Triforce Wiki, we can give the updated revisions and stuff to porple, should he ever launch a fork of triforce himself. Results May Vary (talk) 01:04, November 5, 2019 (EST)

Actually, going off that SMW Big Boo thing, a similar situation would be Prince Froggy and Frog Pirate....actually, come to think of it, the only real reason to not merge the "Biggu" SMW2 bosses that have "large enemy" counterparts with them is Smash listing Naval Piranha and Big Piranha separately....something it doesn't do with Fire and Lava Piranhas; this of course is disregarding how we handle Raphael the Raven, but that's still a different situation. The only other vaguely situation I can think of offhand is Kamek and Magikoopa, with Kamek being a very well-established recurring character alongside the species, unlike "the Big Boo" that appeared in two games following the current logic. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:08, November 16, 2019 (EST)

Goop
I'll leave the delete template up, but I would like a more detailed explanation as to why goop should have priority over graffiti. I don't entirely understand what you mean in the delete template. 12:10, November 5, 2019 (EST)
 * Never mind, still catching up on Recent Changes and saw the Graffiti talk page. 12:12, November 5, 2019 (EST)

Oyakata Teresa
From what I can tell, Boss Teresa is the species for SM64, while Oyakata Teresa is specifically the "master of the house," who in the English version is identified as the "titan of terror," Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:07, November 6, 2019 (EST)
 * Which King Boo? The OG LM one was fairly normal size for Boos, all later depictions were larger. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:36, November 6, 2019 (EST)
 * I think it was inconsistent in the first game too. When the Boos were escaping the trapdoor, he looked to be about the same size, though in the Secret Altar, he's a bit larger. Can't really tell for the actual fight. Also, the Boos that make up Boolossus are smaller than the game's normal Boos iirc. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:55, November 6, 2019 (EST)

Link's Awakening Names
I realized I made a mistake by originally giving up on the Zelda series, and hope you dont find I post some finds on your talk page as we go along. For one, I found out that Nintendo.com has a guide for The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening. Looks like CiaoCiao's original name was Mini Bow-Bow on the nintendo.com site. The Link's Awakening guide (1993) from Nintendo Power only generically refers to it as "pup". Results May Vary (talk) 15:05, November 8, 2019 (EST)
 * Yeah the situation is very confusing. I talked to porplemontage and he closed Zeldapedia.com due to drama and because it was distracting NIWA from moving forward with kicking out Zelda Wiki. I already felt so embarrassed that the Triforce Wiki has had to wiki hop a lot, and also when Zelda Dungeon proposed a merge... Actually the weird thing is now Zelda Dungeon is the most likely to take the spot as the new NIWA wiki (except with a rebranded name like Legend of Zelda Wiki). Do you understand why I was really frustrated and at first wanted to give up with the Zelda series entirely? Results May Vary (talk) 15:24, November 8, 2019 (EST)
 * I do too but I assumed you left entirely. Results May Vary (talk) 15:31, November 8, 2019 (EST)
 * To learn from mistakes, I'm thinking of ways to manage the wiki better, so I've been trying to open it a bit more and add a bit of community, such as a Discord server. Results May Vary (talk) 20:26, November 30, 2019 (EST)
 * I still limit talk here but i just wanted to let you know there are just over 230 articles on the wiki now. I had a go at the Deku Baba and Hookshot articles recently (Doc helped on the former, and i decided to feature it on the main page) Results May Vary (talk) 21:20, January 24, 2020 (EST)

Japanese Bob-omb
According to the Japanese Wikipedia, page 38 of the Japanese SMB3 manual actually implies that they are indeed the same as the DDP enemy from the get-go. Can you confirm or deny this? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:32, November 15, 2019 (EST)
 * As an additional note, the description you translated seems to specifically refer to the small, keyless ones that are used in artillery levels, since those are the ones that flash and explode without player intervention and tend to defeat other nearby ones while doing so. Which is notably really close to the DDP/SMB2 behavior, where they tend to explode a few seconds after showing up on-screen. Anyways, yes, the Japanese SMUSA manual is something I've searched far and wide for a .pdf of, to no success at all, since searching invariably brings up the English SMB2 or the Japanese SMB2 manual, depending on how you try to specify it. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:13, November 20, 2019 (EST)
 * That's a tad disappointing, but now I'm curious where the SMB2 Bob-omb artwork that was used in the "Perfect" Daijiten that would later be recolored for the SMA Shogakukan came from initially. The Ninji seems to be obscure SMW artwork judging by ESMB, but that one still befuddles me. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:27, November 21, 2019 (EST)

RE:Barrels and Jars
Based on the texture files, Bowser Barrel is "BarrelBomb", Snake jar is "PotSnake", Snake is "Snake", Flipper is "Flipper", and Bumper is "BoundPinball." 12:38, November 16, 2019 (EST)
 * Only other barrel file is Diddy Kong's banana barrel. 13:37, November 17, 2019 (EST)

Boo Buddy Swarm
I disagree with your proposed move here; I feel the "only 'Boo Buddy' is used in the description itself" thing is flimsy logic, as from what I can tell the attack being described isn't being done by the entire swarm, but individual Boos within the swarm, so saying "Boo Buddy Swarm" in that case wouldn't make sense. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 18:47, November 24, 2019 (EST)

Redirects
Good save there, I almost jokingly called you out for missing Jerome Wily XP Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:22, December 8, 2019 (EST)

....and to wit, before you reach that point, I think that "Julian Robotnik" and "Ovi Kintobor" would be going too far, since they're adaptation-specific. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:44, December 8, 2019 (EST)
 * To be fair, they're alternate interpretations the Archie writers (but never the Fleetway writers) justified as alt 'verses, while Nega's a sometimes-descendent from a universe without any other "shared" characters. Regardless, it's basically a larger-scale way of how we treat the Mario film interpretations as too separate to count as one. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:50, December 8, 2019 (EST)
 * I'm just still curious why the film's "Sniff-its" don't have their own article after their film info was removed....yeah they only appear like 3 seconds but thy'r named and based off a game concept... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:06, December 9, 2019 (EST)
 * I was referring to the garbagemen, who are called "Sniff-its" in at least one of the scripts. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:20, December 9, 2019 (EST)
 * I'd found the term on one of these. I think one may also indicate the more humanish police force is an analog to Koopa Troopas, though I may be remembering wrong. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:50, December 9, 2019 (EST)
 * OK, it was just the only definite one I'd known about. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 02:31, December 9, 2019 (EST)

Kyodai
So since Nintendo seems to translate "Kyodai" as "big" (Big Island, Boss Bass being Big Pukupuku), do you think we should too? After all, the distinction between "giant" and "big" can be hazy, and with all the other words thy use, they very well have just been trying to settle on a synonym (since "Biggu" is typically reserved for Yoshi entities). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:09, December 9, 2019 (EST)
 * Not necessarily bosses, since it applies to the Blarggs as well, but "Big Pakkun" is distinct from "Kyodai/Dai/Deka Pakkun Flower" as shown by the SSBU list (but not Fire Pakkun with the Fire Pakkun based on Big Pakkun). Regardless, I still think that Nintendo of JP preferring "big" even after all this time is worth noting, similar to how they seem to insist on translating the ALttP enemy as "Trooper" when "Soldier" would be more technically accurate. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:36, December 10, 2019 (EST)
 * Well the only "big" thing from there to not have "Biggu" in the name is Puchipuchi L, which already has a "Biggu" variant, and Big Boo, whose "boss" version actually has a totally different name (itself likely because "big" sounds smaller than "atomic" so they went with something completely different, though the later presence of "Biggu Teresa" in SMRPG and MPL has me curious). Not to mention Chomp Shark (which is why I firmly believe the SPP Big Chain Chomp is the same as Chomp Shark) and the "Super Big" ones from YIDS. That also throws another perspective on the Bakubaku issue, since Bakubaku acts like a larger Cheep Cheep there, but itself has a "Biggu" version. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:53, December 10, 2019 (EST)

We must also remember that "kyodai" has been recently localized as "Mega" very likely due to Mega Mushroom. Color Splash is actually an odd case that has "Kyodai Kuribo" aka Mega Goomba among the "deka" enemies who are all bosses. SmokedChili (talk) 04:45, December 12, 2019 (EST)

Cob Cucco
Are you sure the kobu isn't just こぶ (i.e. "lump") written in katakana? That'd make slightly more sense than a transliteration of "cob", imo. 08:49, December 10, 2019 (EST)
 * Those are less common definitions of "cob" though, I think something along the lines of Lump Cucco would be a more accurate translation. 00:07, December 11, 2019 (EST)
 * We also have another enemy using katakana for native Japanese words in its name. 19:56, December 11, 2019 (EST)

RE: Super Mario Encyclopedia lists
Sorry for the late reply, but feel free to add what I did, or modify it in any way. 07:12, December 15, 2019 (EST)

Crows, flames, and piscatory punks
So regarding what you were wanting to do with Nitpicker and Kuro, (as well as the vague plans for Fire) isn't that fairly similar situation to Cheep Cheep and "Piscatory Pete?" Actually, CC and PP seem more clear-cut, since unlike th crow, the "underwater Pukupuku for Yoshi's Island" got less distinct as time went on. I'd say leave Kuro alone, since the later appearance is where they deviated in name, more akin to the bouncy Bill in JP. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 03:14, December 29, 2019 (EST)
 * If memory serves, it's the only enemy to appear both underwater and not-quite-underwater, so a separate section for underwater makes sense. I mainly bring this up due to the amount of type splits the fellow SNES Kamigami no Triforce guide had for its enemy types. Anyways, on the subject of Spark and Zelda, should we consider the Zelda Sparks the same as the Mario Sparks, since they have the same name and behavior? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 14:47, December 29, 2019 (EST)

RE: Fireball identifier
The main fireball page is the projectile. "Fireball (Mario Bros.)" needed a rename anyway. 04:11, December 31, 2019 (EST)

The Super Mario Land 2 proposal
I had no idea your naming proposal for Super Mario Land 2 stuff was going on, otherwise I would've said this there and probably opposed it. Even if the naming Nintendo Power uses is generic in most cases, it is still an official name. Things like the various Ants I understand, Nintendo Power was no help there. But then we have things like "spook head", "satellite", and other names that are distinguishable. I get consistency is a reason, but we have returning and instruction manual names mixed in as well, so the consistency is incredibly odd anyway. 13:12, January 15, 2020 (EST)
 * I mean, I don't like generic names much, either; if there's a better descriptive then we should use it. That said, we work with what we got. If you and the voting community agrees that Japanese names are better in this instance, that's fine (I'm not just going to say "no" and enforce a decision that wasn't agreed on). I guess I'm just giving a late vote here :P Either way, marked redirects have been deleted. 13:54, January 15, 2020 (EST)

Balloons
Just so I understand and learn more to adapt you & doc's style, why did you remove the link to Balloons on the DK Barrel Blast page? Results May Vary (talk) 15:20, January 23, 2020 (EST)
 * I thought of them being separate articles because they serve an entirely different purpose in the Barrel Blast games, even having a question mark on them, despite having the same name. I doubt the developers thought of the extra lives mechanic when adding the balloons (or perhaps they did, but i think the use is more comparable to a DK Barrel). Results May Vary (talk) 15:35, January 23, 2020 (EST)
 * Yeah actually I was thinking of that just now too. Maybe I thought the balloons should be on the same pages because, unlike the life balloons, the balloons from DKBB only make one appearance. As far as I can remember, they are similar, like very similar, one pertaining to the Kongs and the other to Kremlings. So to me, it would feel redundant if the pages were separate Results May Vary (talk) 15:58, January 23, 2020 (EST)

Fly Heyho
Question. In what levels do Fly Heyho appear? Do they have anything to do with the large paper airplanes that create shadows in Solar Zoom? I was hoping to get an image of one. 18:06, January 23, 2020 (EST)

Yoshi's Story and bigness (or lack thereof)
As we know, the "Blurps" in YS are inconsistently given a generic "Pukupuku" identifier in Japan, despite being the "big" version of the enemy. That got me thinking, the "Blargg" and "Chomp" enemies in the game are almost dead ringers for Gargantua Blargg and Chomp Shark (their big counterparts), so I was thinking perhaps they are intended as them, just without the "big" as there's not a small version of them in the game to compare with (though admittedly in the case of Blargg some later games have G. Blargg but not a small type). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:30, February 28, 2020 (EST)

About Pink Fuzzy...
I still feel the comparison to the Pokey Mummy/Poison Pokey is worth thinking over, I'd like to hear your thoughts on that. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:42, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * Ehn, the difference in exact color shades between the Pokeys are no more pronounced than those of any other entities between the two games, though in-game Pokey Mummy often looks blue due to the lighting. On a related note, does Killer Pakkun have the "normal" Pakkun files? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:53, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * All right, so on other subjects in that game to consider, how about the big and small Bloopers? I know given the varying contexts they're potentially in totally different parts of the memory, but if they can be found that'd be nice. Additionally, I'm wondering if these can point to which Wizzerd is the real "base" type. All that being said, I don't think late-development implementation changes should affect how we group things. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:26, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * There were not any. Funny, I actually saw Scrooge mention the unused Blooper Babies earlier on Discord.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:27, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * As for the possibility of splitting Cleft, I was thinking maybe have that as one option, another option to re-merge Pale Piranha back to Piranha Plant, and the obligatory "do nothing" option, due to the fact that since last time they've been split, we've had the SSBU rant not mention them specifically in any language... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:19, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * None whatsoever. Another more apropos example is Dark Puff with Ruff Puff, though admittedly both of these enemies have the excuse of being late-game in the predecessor. Not sure if we should push the Frost Piranha issue just yet, but it's probably more viable than Lava Piranha or Petit Piranha, despite the enemies they're based however loosely off coming before, and other "combination" enemies existing. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:12, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * Half of me wonders if that might somehow relate to Vanna T...anyways, if the PM64 file names (if any) are ever found, that may help if we try to revisit Fresh Juice. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:53, March 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * Son of a boulder, this had an inconsistent quality of localization too? There's so many things we could do about this. We could wholly merge Cleft to Moon Cleft while splitting Boggly Cleft, we could merge Cleft with SPM Moon Cleft, though then we'd have to decide which name to use...either way, WTF localizers? It's on a rocky mountain like the original, not the moon! If it were on Blobule this would have at least made sense. I played SPM before TTYD, so its name baffled me before I knew of the TTYD context. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:05, March 14, 2020 (EDT)
 * Gonna chime in to say I'd support merging the SPM Moon Cleft, at least. 20:46, March 14, 2020 (EDT)

Anyways, in light of the Cleft situation, we should probably make a Cleft proposal first and promise a follow-up proposal on Pale Piranha if it reaches certain results. The options I'd have are 1:Merge SPM Moon Cleft into Cleft, keeping the "Cleft" name (which itself is implied in SPM by Dark Cleft), 2: Doing the same thing but calling the result "Moon Cleft" with some identifier (with the actual Moon Cleft getting a TTYD identifier), 3: Merge Moon Cleft into Cleft outright and split "Boggly Woods" Cleft (this is from a design and file perspective), and 4: Do nothing. All except 3 winning would prompt a Pale Piranha proposal. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:18, March 15, 2020 (EDT)
 * Before you do anything, remember that outside of Boggly Woods situation, we also have TTYD Spike Top and Red Spike Top. That makes three enemies (if I've counted right) from previous games given a new appearance in TTYD while the base appearance is used for a new enemy. Since this seems like a unique phenomenon to TTYD, I'd support option 1 for Cleft handling. SmokedChili (talk) 03:32, March 16, 2020 (EDT)

Pink Fuzzy
About the localizations considering Flower Fuzzy/Pink Fuzzy to be the same thing, I wouldn't jump to conclusions about that just yet. I haven't gotten a chance to verify which foreign names are from TTYD and which are from SPM (except the Japanese and German ones, which were already marked), which is something I'll work on soon. 08:59, March 14, 2020 (EDT)
 * I'll look into that. 20:48, March 14, 2020 (EDT)

Update: The NOE French version of SPM uses "Cleftlunair" (i.e. Moon Cleft). 22:51, March 16, 2020 (EDT)

Goombella's Tattle in the Japanese version: 『ツキノシンエモン』よ <span class="explain" title="つき">月 に　すみついている　シネモンね さいだいHPは『6』で こうげき<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 は『5』 ぼうぎょ<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 は『5』よ あいかわらず　ぼうぎょ<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 が　たかいわね しかも　ほのおの　こうげきは　コイツには きかないわ でも　バクハツで　ひっくりかえすと ぼうきょ<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 が『0』に　なるから そこが　ねらいめよ

I'm not exactly fluent enough to read all of this, but it looks like it says something similar to the "basic Cleft living on the Moon" line, if I'm understanding this right. 07:38, March 17, 2020 (EDT)

And here's the Italian version: È un Teschiolito lunare! È un Teschiolito che vive sulla luna. I suoi PV massimi sono 6, la potenza è 5, la difesa è 5. Come i suoi simili, è forte in difesa ed è insensibile al fuoco. Se lo rovesci con una esplosione, la difesa scende a 0! And just like the Japanese and English versions, it also seems to allude to the Moon Cleft being a regular Cleft on the Moon. 08:07, March 17, 2020 (EDT)

European Spanish version: Es un Cleft Lunar... Vaya, también hay de estos en la Luna... PC Máximos: 6 Poder de ataque: 5 Poder de defensa: 5 Su poder de defensa es considerable... Y, además, son inmunes al fuego.

European French version: C'est un Cleftlunair. Un Cleft qui vit sur la Lune. PC Max: 6, Puissance: 5, Défense: 5. Toujours aussi tête de pioche. Et il est invulnérable au feu. Mais si tu le retournes avec une explosion, sa défense tombe à 0.

German version: Das ist ein Mond-Kirk. Mond-Kirks sind... Eben Kirks, die auf dem Mond leben! Max KP: 6, Angriffskraft: 5, Verteidigung: 5 Die haben ja auch so eine gute Verteidigung! Und Feur-Attacken wirken nicht. Aber ihre Verteidigung sinkt auf 0, wenn du sie mit Bom- ben umkippst.

Might be able to find some more languages after I get some sleep. If there's anything else you want me to check, let me know. 09:11, March 17, 2020 (EDT)

Alright, here's the Pale Piranha stuff.

Japanese: 『パックンフラワー』よ まいど　おなじみの　デンジャラスな かみつき<span class="explain" title="はな">花 ね <span class="explain" title="いろ">色 は　ふしぎの<span class="explain" title="もり">森 に　できおうして モノクロに　なったみたい せいめいの　ふしぎを　かんじるわ！ さいだいHPは『4』で こうげき<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 は『2』 ぼうぎょ<span class="explain" title="りょく">力 は『0』よ ジャンプで　ふみつはようと　すると かみつかれるから　ちゅういしてね

European Spanish: Es una Planta Piraña Gris. La misma flor peligrosa de siempre... Parece que ha modificado su coloración para camuflarse en el Bosque Maravilloso... PC Máximos: 4 Poder de ataque: 2 Poder de defensa: 0 Ni se te ocurra saltar sobre ellas, porque te morderán y te harán daño.

European French: C'est une Plante piranha. Une vieille connaissance aux crocs acérés. Elle s'est adaptée au monochrome des Bois insolites. C'est bizarre la nature! PC Max: 4, Puissance: 2, Défense: 0. Si tu sautes dessus, tu vas te faire mordre!

German: Das ist eine Piranha-Pflanze, eine Fleisch fressende Pflan- ze, die du gut kennst, oder? Ihre Farbe hat sie wohl der Umgebung angepasst... Ein Wunder der Natur! Max KP: 4, Angriffskraft: 2, Verteidigung: 0 Wenn du auf diese Pflanzen springst, beißen sie zu. Ver- meide also Sprungattacken.

Italian: È una Pianta Piranha! È il solito vecchio fiore che morde! Per mimetizzarsi nel bosco è diventata monocroma. La natura è davvero strana! I suoi PV massimi sono 4, la potenza è 2, la difesa è 0. Se pensi di saltarle sopra stai attento: può mordere!

19:08, March 17, 2020 (EDT)
 * OK, so aside from English and E.Spanish, this is simply called Piranha Plant, and E. Spanish still uses the "the same thing as usual, with color adaptation to the forest" explanation, meaning the "subspecies" bullcrap is unique to the English localization. And the log description itself is more akin to the "the same thing as usual, with color adaptation to the forest" explanation, meaning this is just English Goombella spitballing. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:12, March 17, 2020 (EDT)

Cataquaziness
I know you're in the middle of SMA4 guide stuff right now, but when you have time, could you look at this? (I wish there was a quicker platform to alert these things on...) Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:34, March 24, 2020 (EDT)

Mushroom Houses
Since "[color] Mushroom/Toad House" is official terminology for the generic establishment, should "World-e" be used as an identifier? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:10, March 24, 2020 (EDT)
 * So was that thing you added to the Coin page the same thing that appears sometimes in SMA2? I recall something like that appearing in the hidden coin area in Donut Plains 1....Also unlike Bramball, Cataquack has the JP name going for it. There's also my question over whether the one English guide was really using "Chuhana" to refer to red Cataquacks, as that's Plungelo's JP name. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:43, March 24, 2020 (EDT)
 * The Mushroom Coin is indeed the same object from SMA2. Glad to finally see a name for it. As for the Cataplunge....I'll admit the first time I watched a walkthrough of SMS via blurry YT video many years ago, I didn't realize they were different either XD Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:30, March 24, 2020 (EDT)

Oi
Quick thanks for dealing with the Wario Land articles. -- 11:46, April 4, 2020 (EDT)

Beetle Goom
The ones in said fight wear Buzzy shell-like helmets, so there's that to consider.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:13, April 5, 2020 (EDT)
 * Thing is, it looks more like a salamander than a beaver, and the website also compares the tadpoles to Elmo. The "beaver" thing was more likely because beavers are a well-known thing to the West, and while salamanders aren't exactly obscure, giant hellbender-type ones aren't in every pond or rotting log in temperate climates. As for Toge, I'm always too distracted by how much its stunned pose looks like a Chain Chomp, but I don't really think that "beetle" is what they were going for. More like a living burr since they're kinda near a forested/grassy area? As for Punch, pretty much, inconsistent hurt-you hitbox aside. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:30, April 5, 2020 (EDT)

Regarding Brier and Marucchi
Should we consider those derivatives/variants of Urchins since in the Balloon Trip demo that spawned YT&G, they were literally just floating Urchins that looked just like the SMW art? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:14, April 8, 2020 (EDT)

Sniff
Do you know if Yoshi's Story refers to the "sniff" ability as a noun? The manual doesn't appear to call it a noun unless it has "-ing" at the end in some cases. Dwhitney (talk) 17:06, April 14, 2020 (EDT)
 * I mean, it is a verb, it's just that "Sniff-Sniffing" looks awkward since the manual translated the Japanese word too literally. LinkTheLefty (talk) 22:35, April 14, 2020 (EDT)


 * "Sniff-Sniffing" might look awkward, but to me, so does "the sniff." If you mean for "sniff" to be a verb on the Sniff page, then wouldn't it be beneficial to say "Sniffing is"? Dwhitney (talk) 01:09, April 15, 2020 (EDT)
 * It is a move though. Most all of the move articles are formatted that way. That said, it seems there is one instance of "Sniff-Sniffing" (and "sniffing") on page 21 of the manual. LinkTheLefty (talk) 11:41, April 15, 2020 (EDT)

Fry Guy
So, it has an alternate form after you hit him 3 times, which i want merged, and i have been waiting for someone to respond for over a year now. Could -- 08:30, April 15, 2020 (EDT)

Re:Monkeys and Donkeys
Yeah, I knew about that (and while that's a possibility, it seems rather small as far as the game's bosses go, though I suppose if the arena were 25m-shaped, it'd be a non-issue...I'd assumed it was just a big enemy). Anyways, I knew about "Monkey Slide" (as it was in use back when it was allegedly its own course) but not Donkey Slide. Personally, though, I think there's a decent chance they were intended as different, and trying to connect an odd name for a location with something unused in a previous game isn't too convincing to me. Personally, I think it's more likely the DK reference would stem from the rolling Big Steelies acting like barrels, though on that note, perhaps a DK-like enemy and/or boss was intended for TTM in place of those? Maybe this needs more consideration.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 11:14, April 16, 2020 (EDT)

Update
Hi LTL, it's been a while, how are things? Just letting you know that I made a page on Marin. I also noticed you did research for Starfox and Kirby on Wikia -- do I have your permission to steal borrow the info for the respective NIWA wikis--WiKirby and Lylat Wiki (of course, I will reuse in my own words)? I've helped improve both NIWA wikis significantly. Also, I don't know how much you know about this franchise but me and tacopill (host of WiKirby, Fire Emblem, etc.) decided to undergo a Final Fantasy Wiki project, and I'm trying to work out a Mario Wiki-type standard for JRPG wikis (admittedly I don't like JRPGs that much). The fun part is that I'm trying something completely new here and branching out from my usual editing on platformer-based wikis. It's kind of like the old days, when people were figuring out how wikis work. :) Results May Vary (talk) 13:01, April 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * Also I can't stress and thank you enough for your name hierarchy. It has been an extremely huge inspiration for me. I've been trying to apply it on at least 10 different wikis (several of which I created) and try to evolve with that to see how it would play out on wikis of different subjects (like Banjo-Kazooie, Star Fox, even SpongeBob...). Currently, it's Final Fantasy (for example: Chocobo Farm). Results May Vary (talk) 13:14, April 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * Yeah we can do that -- make Essence the 300th article. Also, what does a "purist" take on the wiki mean, as admittedly I am new to Final Fantasy (only having played the first on GBA and the 7th one). Results May Vary (talk) 14:40, April 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * I had no idea there was demand for a new Final Fantasy Wiki for this long. I'd be totally up for if you and others decide to join Final Fantasy Wiki, and it would be greatly appreciated (you don't need my permission i'm just a representative & editor who suggested for the wiki's creation since SEIWA doesn't have Final Fantasy & I wanted to try out a square series for fun & to try and make as platformer-friendly as possible :P. tacopill is the real person in charge, and the wiki is open for edited). The Wikia feels confusing and difficult to navigate & they put etymology on several articles, even when it's not needed. For example etymology on Chocobo is on the Chocobo Racing article. Similarly, they also split pages (like jobs) into gallery pages. So to have (mostly) completed this nav template felt very satisfying: https://finalfantasywiki.com/wiki/Template:FF1 . I used the Nintendo Power guide & strategywiki for some help to get an idea on how to do the nav template, and it finally paid off. As for replacing old with newer images, I have seen this happen with Hyrule Warriors (Wii U) images being deleted in favor for Switch ones, or Mario Kart 8 (Wii U) with MK8 Deluxe on this wiki. Results May Vary (talk) 19:52, April 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * Here's my attempt on a page about Castle Cornelia. Results May Vary (talk) 16:12, April 26, 2020 (EDT)
 * I added the info on the NPC on the Light of glitches in Final Fantasy page. Results May Vary (talk) 20:40, April 26, 2020 (EDT)
 * Ah and by the way, tri force turned one today! I'm making an article for today & that helps affirm what the goal is Results May Vary (talk) 12:26, April 30, 2020 (EDT)
 * The article I made to coincide with the anniversary is Sheik. I felt it was a good choice because it reflects the wiki's goal well, especially since the character has a gender/pronoun-related controversy. Results May Vary (talk) 19:28, April 30, 2020 (EDT)

Cream the Rabbit
Actually, if memory serves me right, she was created specifically for the Sonic X show (to appeal to Japanese viewers since Sonic is treated as kind of a "meh" franchise over there), and then started appearing in games to promote that. Given she was planned for Heroes as far back as their original "King of Fighters"-type team setup idea-spitballing (so far back Shadow was still considered dead-and-off-limits), it's likely the case. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:14, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * I think she first appeared in Sonic Advance 2. Weedle McHairybug (talk) 19:35, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * Here is what I was thinking of; Yuji Naka said he originally created Cream and Cheese for Sonic Heroes, but they wound up appearing in Sonic Advance 2 and Sonic X first (and Sonic Mega Collection, though it was advertising Sonic Advance 2). LinkTheLefty (talk) 19:36, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * Ah. This woulda been during the phase they wanted a "ladies' team" (again like KoF), and needed a third one I suppose. I recall a tweet about the early phases with the much different cast/team structure.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:40, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * Oh, this is probably what you're thinking of: Cream was still a part of that early roster with Amy and Rouge, but Shadow is missing, Gamma was in place of Omega, and there were more rebooted retro revivals. I wonder how that would've changed the course of the next few games. LinkTheLefty (talk) 21:09, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * Yah, that's it. Gamma, Big, and Chaos in a "Sonic Adventure" team, a team consisting of what Archie Comics would later have as "Team Hooligan," and Mighty, Ray, and Metal as, I don't know, direct-Sonic-playerclone team? Also makes me wonder what the plot for that would have been, maybe Mecha Sonic instead? Guess that's all water under the bridge regardless.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:14, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * ...Team Mecha/Witchcart/Kukku as the villains. In all seriousness, with the Sonic hacking community the way it is, it's not impossible for a PC mod to return to this idea. LinkTheLefty (talk) 21:38, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
 * Well, given Team Sonic Racing, SEGA themselves seem to be warming back up to Heroes (and R!), so.... also that would've be awesome XD Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:43, April 20, 2020 (EDT)

SMRPG things
(Leaving the title vague in case I need to talk about an especially large amount during the overhaul) Hey, so are the Japanese translations on the pages Smithy's four bureaucratic subordinates (Clerk, Manager, Director, and Factory Chief) even remotely accurate? Because I can't find a way to make them translate to that, though given my limited knowledge, I'm probably doing something wrong (and also wonder if they may be transcribed wrong...) 16:06, April 21, 2020 (EDT)
 * All right, another thing I'm curious about are the references to Kinklinks in Orb User's psychopath and the Chomp Shell description. Seemed to me Chain Chomps would make more sense there (and honestly Woolsey came off as being a littlee proud of coming up with "Kinklink" to me). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:50, April 26, 2020 (EDT)

Saw you were working on Yoshi's Story stuff
So you'll probably get to this yourself, but I was wondering what the kanji next to the tiny "normal" Fly Guys was. Kanji are kinda my Achilles' Heel... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:40, April 29, 2020 (EDT)

"Never float in midair"
The ones spawned by "purple" switches would like to have a word with you. Not to mention the ones on the elevator ride in Hazy Maze Cave. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:39, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * You didn't address the Hazy Maze Cave ones. And I'm pretty sure I remember instances of constant ones acting as short bridges. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 17:56, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * On the contrary, I believe that the original "crate" shouldn't be considered a "true" crate at all in that case. Are you familiar with how Mario Party had the "normal" block/box size consistent with its own Crazed Crate (which being called "Whomp Block" in-game, should be merged there anyway? While Brick is the closest functional counterpart to the original "large" block, the Black Bricks and Ice also share some base properties, and as such, I consider all four SM64 objects to be divergent of the two-sized SM64 blocks. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:03, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * I know that it's a naming error, but it's still an in-game name (and it's a block, not a crate). Regardless, I feel "Block (Super Mario 64)" as a singular object should only cover the cork-textured entity. If anything, if we keep the smaller one on crate (which it visually is no more than the larger one is a brick block), we should merge the larger one to Brick Block for consistency and note the cork texture as an attribute that was retroactively removed (outside artwork), like with crate. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:40, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * Pardon, the reason I brought it there is this is a wiki with many active members. Additionally, if that is what you say on naming "errors" (when this is more like an SML translation error anyways), what about "Wet Bones?" Also yes, source priority does factor into that policy. Regardless, the logical conclusion to what you just said would be to merge to Block wholesale, since that's for treating the whole of block types. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 13:04, May 23, 2020 (EDT)
 * My SML comparison was for Whomp Block XD. Anyways, I still think that if the article's gonna stay, it should cover both sizes, with the "from below" thing for the remake's replacement just being a result of the rough early 3D nature of the game not calling for it; the ! Blocks made for horrible platforms anyways, so it seems they were giving "floating blocks as platforms" a break. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:48, May 23, 2020 (EDT)

Triforce
you can still edit Triforce for the time being. I'll keep it to zeldawiki.info for the time being and let you know if ever i change it. Results May Vary (talk) 10:43, June 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * I do have some pretty major, long overdue edits planned regarding a certain Dark Horse, so if there is no danger of data loss I'll get to it soon. LinkTheLefty (talk) 11:51, June 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * There won't be any major data loss. I'm not planning any domain name change for now because it's the main domain registered in my account, and moving it could cause complications with the other wikis (like spongebobwiki.org) because they are subdomains. Results May Vary (talk) 12:19, June 13, 2020 (EDT)
 * Basically, you can edit like usual as you were on Triforce Wiki because I scrapped plans to change the domain name (and will let you know if ever I get back to it). Results May Vary (talk) 13:26, June 14, 2020 (EDT)

Tilt Lift
Hi, do you know of any source regarding New Super Mario Bros. Wii that uses the name "Tilt Lift" anywhere? I'm just wondering because the article, in its current state, is just a blanket "catch-all" for tilt-controlled platforms in the New Super Mario Bros. sub-series, which I'm fairly certain doesn't warrant an article. That's also on top of the fact that I just created the article Remote-Control Platform a few hours ago. If you can't find anything, I'm likely going to tag that article for deletion. 12:10, June 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * Never mind, I found the name in the New Super Mario Bros. Wii instruction booklet. 18:13, June 16, 2020 (EDT)

Screwtop Shroom
Hi, I recently created an article on those purple mushroom platforms with screws that debut in New Super Mario Bros. Wii, though do they have any confirmed names anywhere? Just asking. (P.S.: Feel free to add in Japanese names to the other articles I've created while you have the chance.) 12:22, June 25, 2020 (EDT)

"Limited" raft
Hi, another thing: what should we call the wooden rafts in NSMBW/NSMBU that stop when five or more objects are weighing it down? It's called "Limited Lift" on page 242 of the NSMBU Prima guide, but that's the only time they're referred to by that name ("raft" on pages 192 and 193, and "lift" on page 246), and the "Limited Lift" name is applied to something else on page 199 of the same guide. That said, the name of the latter is likewise different everywhere else ("Red-Hot Elevator" on pages 247 and 248). So what do you think? 19:02, June 30, 2020 (EDT)
 * Thanks. One more thing: which challenges/levels do "Pendulum Platform" and "Turning Floor" appear in? 10:56, July 1, 2020 (EDT)

RE: Casing and identifiers / Screwtop Shroom
Yes, like with Red Diamond.

Since "Spin Kinoko Lift" is closer to English and we generally prioritise English over Japanese, I'm fine with this name being used. 22:50, July 1, 2020 (EDT)

Remote-Control objects
Hi, just one more thing I'd like to ask about, this time concerning just New Super Mario Bros. Wii: would you mind finding internal filenames for the remote-control fence in that bonus area in, as well as an internal filename for those remote-control track platforms with activation blocks that are the gimmick of World 7-4? Thanks! 22:23, July 7, 2020 (EDT)

Filenames
Hello, I'm curious whether the filenames that you are currently adding to those stamp images are official (generated by Nintendo themselves in some capacity). In my uploads, I only mention the original filename if this is the case. Also, do the Miiverse directories lead to an official account on that website? 15:48, July 11, 2020 (EDT)

RE: Nintendo Power priority
Nintendo Power is second on the list above any other guides, so that source takes priority. e.g. If a subject went by an in-game name in an early game, but hasn't been named in-game since, but was given a different name in a later guide, the in-game name would still take priority. 00:41, July 16, 2020 (EDT)


 * I brought this up in admin chat and we've changed up MW:Naming, hopefully that clears things up. I'll move "paddle wheel" back. 23:18, July 17, 2020 (EDT)

Big Buzzy Beetle internal name in Color Splash
Going back to Color Splash, I tried to find out the Japanese name for its incarnation of Big Buzzy Beetle but got nothing. Can you check out what's its filename? Also can you cross-reference other Big enemies with their filenames? This is because while most Big enemies use deka, Mega Goomba instead uses kyodai, and I want to see if its filename reflects that. SmokedChili (talk) 05:53, July 21, 2020 (EDT)

July 2020 updates
Hey LTL, been a little while. I thought I'd give you some updates. So you know how I've been saying that you've been an inspiration to me when it comes to naming hierarchy? I think you probably know this but for me personally, I've been trying to have a go at that with more things and wider variety of subjects. This includes Rare's games (Banjo, Ghoulies, Conker, etc.), Crash Bandicoot, Spyro, and more. Me & Mario Wiki users want to see the style unfold everywhere -- it's like magic. 2020 has thus far been an amazing year for wiki editing -- a great escape from the awful riots and chaos happening in the real world.

As said before, Final Fantasy Wiki is my chance to try and accommodate Mario & Kirby fans (e.g. https://finalfantasywiki.com/wiki/Cliffhanger is a lot like a Kirby sub-game, Chocobo Tales in general); there's some Fire Emblem fans within the community, and the community in general has been growing overall. I'm the main one who set up the structure (despite this i'm not admin -- i'm just doing this for SEIWA). There are over 200 articles now, several of which are sadly stubs (especially with all the FF installments). Basically, I wanted to see if I can take an RPG series and accommodate for people whose favorite games are platformers, such as myself. I made articles for every Warrior of Light (excluding their upgraded form) lately, and the bestiary navigation -- I've been trying to make it feel like a Pokedex, hopefully to attract Pokemon fans. There's untapped potential with the franchise to interest a wider audience, especially the Chocobo games, Mario crossover in Hoops/Sports Mix, and so forth. I think platformer fans trying an independent Final Fantasy Wiki is probably a first in the world of wikis. It can be fun to experiment with different style than what you're used to.

So I generally find a home in the smaller gaming franchise wikis. With help from Scrooge200, leading a few other wiki projects, the style has expanded to television shows and even children's books. I co-founded a SpongeBob Wiki, which has nearly 300 articles already from 4 months of work of others who are from the FANDOM wiki. My vision for SpongeBob Wiki is to do how Mario handles game & TV appearances, but the priorities switch. People usually associate Mario with being a gaming franchise, yet it's got merchandise, a television show, and manga. SpongeBob is a television show to have perhaps the most video games, and it's Nickelodeon's flagship. Battle for Bikini Bottom has quite a following. You can see that I put television-screenshot as the first license.

There's also an independent Arthur Wiki run by Scrooge200 (I helped him get the community's permission to fork it from FANDOM). That one is more complicated because it started as a book series, it still is, but people see it equally as much as a television show. There's yet to be a franchise page to explain this intricacy. Scrooge also runs a Diary of a Wimpy Kid wiki, which was also forked from Fandom. It's a case where it's a children's book series that has had a few movies and some flash games. The creator of Wimpy Kid also created Poptropica, a popular flash game for younger people (I last played it in 2009, in elementary school).

Scrooge has a friend who was helped off Fandom too and now runs a Hanna-Barbera Wiki. It's not Mario Wiki style, but I have pitched in some support. I have made some templates, for example the episode template. It's deliberately meant to resemble the infoboxes used on Wikipedia back in 2005 or infoboxes that were formerly used on Pokémon FANDOM. This reflects the old-school nature of cartoons. This is one example showing how I often like to take forgotten concepts, templates, and so forth and redistribute as I see fit.

So yeah, originally I only wanted to do this talent for Rare wikis, but somehow, wikis have made me open to more things. Star Fox Adventures, which was made by Rare, was one of the main reasons I was interested in making Triforce Wiki actually. My friends are glad that I expanded beyond Rare and used the "Rareware talent" on various wikis. I'm honestly glad that I left NIWA in general, because it felt kind of restrictive of my creative freedom (mainly because of the existence of Triforce). I am seriously considering starting an alliance to keep track of wikis run by the Mario Wiki community (aside from Mario/Kirby, which are within NIWA)) to unite them as a network. It will be nothing more than a link exchange & will have actual affiliates (although Mario and WiKirby are already close) rather than forced linking to other wikis. I don't know of any core Mario Wiki member who, for example, supports Zelda Gamepedia or StrategyWiki. This just shows that NIWA is an organization that operates too much like a government body, making it dishonest of which websites are actual affiliates and which are not. Results May Vary (talk) 13:54, July 21, 2020 (EDT)


 * Good point -- the idea of a new alliance (and if it happens, I guarantee it would not be a ripoff of NIWA) might raise some eyebrows around here, as long as the NIWA wikis stay out of it. I've already tried to stand up for the Mario Wiki format everywhere; several people were annoyed at me constantly pointing to the Mario Wiki format, thinking that I'm close-minded. Although with perseverance, most are gravitating toward the Mario Wiki format, even on wikis that I only pitched in support for. Zelda Gamepedia is the only Fandom-owned NIWA wiki, although Bulbapedia is also a brand owned by a corporation (Havamedia.com). Then there's Metroid Wiki, which is basically beyond repair that I think the whole project has to be redone. There's some others I have issues with (although StrategyWiki isn't necessarily "bad" as much as unfitting for a NIWA wiki, seeing as I'd have expected only Nintendo franchises in the alliance), but here's not the best place to discuss it. I like the ideas you have in mind for Final Fantasy Wiki by the way! Results May Vary (talk) 23:45, July 23, 2020 (EDT)

"giant Bob-Omb"
Is that the official capitalization? 21:52, July 28, 2020 (EDT)
 * It is in Paper Mario: Color Splash. LinkTheLefty (talk) 21:53, July 28, 2020 (EDT)

Egg Pawn
Hello, I just wanted to ask you about something- when you moved the Egg Pawn page to Eggpawn back in December, did you have a source for the updated name? As far as I'm aware, the series has consistently referred to them as Egg Pawns, and this morning I got around to completing the main story of the 2020 Story Mode, and I found several occasions where they were referred to specifically as "Egg Pawns", with the space and capitalisation on the "P" (From here until the the third page of minigame instructions and here until the fourth page of minigame instructions, it's the same video but different time stamps (3:21:54 and 3:32:42 if those don't work)). As far as I'm aware, 2020 is the most recent appearance of Egg Pawns in general, and definitely for Mario-specific appearances, so I'd think that should be the term we should use? I didn't know if there was someplace else in the game that referred to them with the other name, so I wanted to check in with you first before I considered moving it back. BBQ Turtle (talk) 07:05, August 6, 2020 (EDT)
 * OK, thank you for the clarification! I'll get to moving it back in a bit in that case. It does raise an interesting point about crossover elements being renamed in their original series that doesn't seem to be covered on Naming though, I'm wondering if it's something worth bringing up on the talk page. BBQ Turtle (talk) 12:36, August 6, 2020 (EDT)

Wild Sting
Well there's the JP name, which in 99% of cases are direct transliterations from the English names.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:07, August 9, 2020 (EDT)
 * Well, Boss Clambo. They do share the same base model and artwork (and looks and acts more like the original than the enemy ones in that game), so I can see where that comes from. Does it name the enemy variety? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:19, August 9, 2020 (EDT)
 * I just meant in general. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:23, August 9, 2020 (EDT)
 * So it's "Clambo" for both, then? Also, it say anything about the invincible rigging Slippas? Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:39, August 9, 2020 (EDT)

Internal/interlanguage names, round 2
And now for some requests for official names for objects largely from New Super Mario Bros. 2.


 * Mushroom platforms debuting in New Super Mario Bros. World 5-4 and also appear in New Super Mario Bros. 2 World 5-4. They're like these types of arrow lifts, except that they eventually stop at a specific location. They're just called "blue platforms" and "pink platforms" in the NSMB2 Prima guide.
 * The platform in that moves to the right only when the player stands on it. It's just called a "raft" in the Prima guide.
 * The airship that appears in World 5-A. It's just called an "airship" in the Prima guide.
 * The specific type of fence in that moves on a track and alters its elevation whenever the player hits it.  It's just called a "fence" in the Prima guide.
 * The skeletal raft in World 6-2. It's never mentioned in the Prima guide.
 * The platforms in World 6-B that alternate between ascending and descending whenever the player lands on them. It's just called a "platform" in the Prima guide.
 * Specific floor platforms appearing in the New Super Mario Bros. U levels Screwtop Tower and Shifting-Floor Cave based off of the floor platforms from World 2-2 of New Super Mario Bros., which are in turn based off of the floors from Mario Bros. If bumped from below, they rupture items and/or enemies directly above where they were bumped. They're never mentioned in the NSMBU Prima guide.

Thanks in advance! 21:19, August 10, 2020 (EDT)
 * BTW, I did find "web" being used consistently for the spiderweb Chain-Links in the NSMB2 Prima guide. Thanks for everything you provided me so far, though. 22:46, August 13, 2020 (EDT)

Heads up
So uh, I've had like a zillion questions for you on that other wiki, so just wanting to make sure you're aware and all. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 23:03, August 11, 2020 (EDT)
 * ...Did I really bookmark an earlier revision of my talk page and not notice after all this time? I'm really sorry about that, I'll get back to you tomorrow. LinkTheLefty (talk) 23:15, August 11, 2020 (EDT)

RE: Recent reverts
While you're going on about how to cover both sources neutrally, I'm going on about how to cover the internal data neutrally. I'm not against covering it, in fact I would've accepted the file name as the last resort, I just have the problem with taking it on the same level as supplementary material and a game's own coverage. Cases like YNI green Cheep Cheep being labeled as Deep Cheep run at the risk of conflating the finished product with outdated, unused data which isn't supposed to be seen officially in the first place. Hence why "their files are based on Deep Cheeps"; the file name is essentially unofficial data which contradicts the game's representation and the guide. Same goes for Blurps, really. Their files show the normal ones were supposed to be the mini variety to Akapuku and Aopuku, but the guide we know didn't follow this (and gave relatively unusual names for the two giants), just as normal Piranha Plants are normal instead of mini in SMG. SmokedChili (talk) 03:48, August 15, 2020 (EDT)
 * Like I don't get that Deep Cheep's file data was changed for YNI - that still doesn't mean it's Deep Cheep because Deep Cheep's files are used for it, it means a separate type of green Cheep Cheep was made based on the files of Deep Cheep, which means there's red and green Cheep Cheeps with behavioral differences after a 27-year gap. If the players, in this case Japanese, were to "naturally assume" they are Deep Cheeps, then I should have found at least a single Japanese link saying so through googling. Instead I found nothing within context of Search Pukupukus being in YNI, while what a few jackpot said anything about green Pukupukus or Pukupukus in general. And even if the guides aren't from Nintendo, there's no stopping them from promoting them like the Super Mario Maker site doing so for a guidebook published by Kadokawa. So don't go downplaying the Japanese guides for not being "within the game's representation". SmokedChili (talk) 12:59, August 15, 2020 (EDT)
 * If I must consider being critical of cited sources, what's stopping me from doing the same with internal data? Unlike guides and other publications where human error must be considered, internal data is an entirely different type of source in that it serves as the building blocks where code names may or may not reflect the finished product, which is why the developmental shift and consistency must be considered for it. Fine, maybe my choice of words isn't exactly impartial, but what I said means the two can't be covered impartially, so a different viewpoint - hidden info from before the release and public info after the release - must be adapted over every source being equal. Bringing back up those other YNI enemies, I don't even know what's the file name for white Pokeys, but I actually agreed with the the successful Big Kyutan proposal, although that could be also argued as a size relativity case. Slave Basa and the rest of Fang code names get me though because at least in case of Count Fang its code name doesn't match with its actual name. SmokedChili (talk) 09:04, August 16, 2020 (EDT)
 * But how many of those placeholder names are going to match the names shown by the finished product itself vs. the guides, and what about developers changing their minds on what they've been working with and making something else out of it? Again with the Fangs, if the game missed naming Slave Basa, what reason would a guide have for naming it after a "Basabasa" instead of calling it a "Pasapasa"? Now that's one name, but repeat that with all the enemies in such conditions, and if the guide has more names matching (by proxy) with the game than its internal files, then the guide is pretty reliable source over the internal files. Some reference from Nintendo is also definitely needed because the writers can't just write whatever, and if said reference makes no mention of Deep Cheeps, then that's it. No Deep Cheeps even if the files exist, no matter the reason like modern influences. SmokedChili (talk) 17:06, August 17, 2020 (EDT)
 * Don't preach to me about arguing on exceptions when that's exactly what you're doing with guides and putting placeholder names on pedestal; at least I can acknowledge the pros and cons of both sources. Your counterargument relies on a big "if" about modern influences on a sub-series which at the same time doesn't have to follow said influences from main series, and assuming the developers thought of Deep Cheep as Deep Cheep to the end. Your point about Swoop is also bad as Swoops themselves have had nothing to do with Yoshi series and one type of Fang suddenly being directly named after Basabasa and the file name would be a huge misconnect from the rest of Pasapasas no matter how you'd cut it. SmokedChili (talk) 15:21, August 18, 2020 (EDT)

Personally, I feel that it was likely never intended to be Deep Cheep; they likely copied their files straight from NSMB2 and edited from there since they already existed. If they were intended to be Deep Cheeps initially, that merely shows that if anything, Piscatory Pete should be merged to Cheep Cheep as it would most likely function as the yellow version of that. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:53, August 18, 2020 (EDT)
 * It's less about whether Deep Cheeps should have full coverage for Yoshi's New Island and more of a "hey, the current wording goes a bit too far, can we please dial it back a bit?" I would've been okay with that if this conversation made headway. LinkTheLefty (talk) 16:02, August 18, 2020 (EDT)
 * My personal feeling is that both it and the Maker info can be placed in an "other appearances and references" section on DC's page, as they both seem to be officially considered simply green Cheep Cheeps, with the Maker games cameoing Blurp and Deep Cheep's designs for the green versions (which the games themselves still simply call "Cheep Cheeps"). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:12, August 18, 2020 (EDT)
 * I'm open to that. It sounds similar to the "partial coverage" option I was thinking of. That depends if SmokedChili will agree to it though. LinkTheLefty (talk) 16:18, August 18, 2020 (EDT)