MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/7



"Bad Jokes and other deleted Nonsense" -style archive
MAKE ARCHIVE 13-9

The English Wikipedia had an archive called "Bad Jokes and Other Deleted Nonsense", where contributors can archive vandalism or plain bad writing that they consider to be humorous. The French and German Wikipedias still posses such a page, and it's quite possible that other Wikipedias posses such a page, as well. I think we should have a similar page. anything that ranges from Bad Writing to Humorous and non-harmful vandalism should go on there, although only articles stuff should be included. No User-talk things.

What are the gains from creating such a page? Well... This will stop the frequent recreation of deleted nonsense (Such as Mario (Species) and "Snufit Ball") since those pages will be redirected to the Bad Jokes archives and archived in all their glory. And as many users have noted in the votes comments, it would show new user what to not write. This may seem like Troll feeding, but if anything, Trolls are feeds by overreacting to their attacks (For example: Creating the Patroller ranking just to fight them), recording a few vandal edits isn't that big of a feeding in comparison.

Anyone should be able to edit the archive page, and there shouldn’t be any edits war about what to add/remove. Of course, common sense should play a part here. The Mario page being littered with obscenities can't really be considred funny, the Pirate Goomba article stating the obvious can be considered funny. Use your brain!

{{scroll box|content= Proposer: {{User:Blitzwing/sig}}(The idea comes from this message of {{user|Cobold}} Deadline: March 21, 2008, 20:00

Support

 * 1) Blablabla Me proposer Blablabla Me gaves reasons above Blablabla I need a sandwich.
 * 2) - We have so much pages about rules etc., time to show how not to write articles.
 * 3) - Per above. :D
 * 4) http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/3473/linkswordmi2.gif Yes, per all. Not only would it help some new people who don't know what to write but we can definatly store Snufit Ball in there. That will make the Snufit Ball fans stop all this arguing. Or at least, I hope.
 * 5) per all
 * 6) Walkazo - Per all.
 * 7) – you convinced me, as long as it's clearly stated for a newbie that this is NOT what to do.
 * 8) Pokemonfan7002 I agree.
 * 9) Per all.
 * 10)  Per All
 * 11) Well, Blitzwing's a patroller, too, soif there really is a spike in spam, he and I will be right alongside cleaning up the mess.  We can always remove it...
 * 1)  Per All
 * 2) Well, Blitzwing's a patroller, too, soif there really is a spike in spam, he and I will be right alongside cleaning up the mess.  We can always remove it...

Oppose

 * 1) - If the point is to help to stop people from recreating deleted articles, it would make more sense to just block creation of said articles than to create another page that's just going to end up being huge and difficult to load.
 * 2) - DO NOT FEED THE FREAKIN' TROLLS! We don't need MORE vandalism to come from this. Any User with common sense knows that they shouldn't vandalize, even if they are new; the whole thing seems pointless.
 * 3) - Honestly, I think this is WORSE than that Pie proposal. Why would we give spammers their own page! They feed on people being aware of them!
 * 4) Per PY and DP
 * 5) MarioGalaxy2433g5 {Talk} - This wiki will become an encyclopedia of sillyness
 * 6) Per Stumpers and DP, we have too much user fanon as is.
 * 7) Per ALL! HyperToad ESPICALLY PY.
 * 8) Tykyle It'll only serve to patronize people who are honestly trying and to give the trolls even more attention.
 * 1) Tykyle It'll only serve to patronize people who are honestly trying and to give the trolls even more attention.

Comments
Ghost Jam, I don't think the point is to stop people from making deleted articles, it's just to put vandalism/dumb writing that you found funny on a page people can view. I would have thought that at least you would understand that it's just for fun. <_< N/O
 * Plus, it could help n00bies to learn how not to write. :P

I don't know. At first I thought this sounded silly and unprofessional, but we are a Mario wiki, meaning we don't have to be serious about everything. It would teach new guys how not to write, and it might stop nonsense articles. I'm not sure whether to vote yet, though. whoops, forgot to sign again.

* ahem*, have you guys heard the term "Do not feed the trolls"? If we make a page full of vandalized articles, that will only inspire MORE trolls to come which will lead to MORE vandalism. Trolls vandalize as a means of becomming popular on the Wiki; this page is only going to further their goals.
 * Hmmm, good point. But isn't most of the stuff just going to be bad User writing? Like the Pirate Goomba thing. I'm no expert, but aren't most Troll edits piles of... er, excraments? Like Willy on Wheels moving everything to _____ on wheels. That's not funny, that's idiotic. - Walkazo

Pokemon DP: If anything, we feed the Trolls by overreacting to their attacks, such as creating a completely new ranking just to fight them, in comparison, having a few humorous vandal edits recorded on a page is rather minor. And beside, why a vandal would vandalize the wiki to "becomes popular"? That's broken logic.

As Walkazo said, the Bad Jokes archive will be mainly filled with bad writing (Ex:The Orange Yoshi article stating that people confuses Brown Yoshi and Orange Yoshi, although the occasional humorous vandalism (Such as the Mama Luigi article) can go in there. --Blitzwing 11:19, 16 March 2008 (EDT)

How about just bad writing, not vandalism? Becuase this would be cool, just it is a good point an archive of vandalism encourages vandalism. So just bad jokes and bad writing go in the archive. 14:45, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Well... Bad Jokes and Funny Vandalism = Pretty much the same thing. Unless that by "Bad Jokes", you mean things like the infamous "Pie for "everyone" proposal. Note that not every vandal edits will be recorded on the page. Things like "Mario (species)" should be archived, things like "Mario is a (insert swear word here)" shouldn't. --Blitzwing 17:06, 16 March 2008 (E ber

Hmmm... people on the opposing side have a good point. But it might help us a bit and... it would be funny. 17:42, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

Isn't that basely like the Sandbox?? Princess Grapes Butterfly 17:56, 17 March 2008 (EDT)
 * No. You can write whatever you want in the Sandbox. In the Bad Jokes archive, you archives edits that were on article, you can't go there and write random crap. --Blitzwing 18:06, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

Ohhhhhhhhhh, i understand now. Princess Grapes Butterfly 19:31, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

Bad Writing... It seems like you are just insulting the User who wrote the article. Counts as a form of flaming... Does it not?
 * Although this might help n00bs with what not to do, they might be encouraged to spam so they can get their "greatness" archived.
 * Maybe whoever wants to archive a sample of bad writing should contact the person who wrote it and get permission first; some will say no, but others might like the opportunity to laugh at their own mistakes/be a "class clown" for the Wiki. - Walkazo

Argh... torn between two sides. The people on the opposing side have such a good point about this would be saying vandalism is cool. And yet having the archive would be so fun. Vandalism is annoying, but it's also funny; on the other hand... ARGH! I just can't decide! 19:58, 19 March 2008 (EDT) }}

Template:Koopas
SPLIT TEMPLATE 6-0

For those of you who don't know this template, it (presumably) consists of a list of every Koopa species and every character in those species. Most groups of Koopas have smaller templates doing the same thing (i.e. Template:Koopa Paratroopa or Template:Spinies); however, unlike the Koopas Template these lists are small and easy to use. The Koopas Template is used primarily for articles that do not fit into one of the other Koopa groups (i.e. Bowser), most of which are Koopa Troopas and their kin (i.e. Koopatrol). I propose we slim down this bulky template so that it only consists of these "misfit" Koopas; and to cut down on even more of the clutter, I propose we make the much-needed Koopa Troopas Template. Prototype versions of both these templates can be seen here.

{{scroll box|content= Proposer: Walkazo

Deadline: March 21, 2008, 20:00

Two Smaller Templates

 * 1) Walkazo - Being the Proposer, my opinions are stated above.
 * 2) Makes sense. Per Walkazo. As long as you're not planning to make a "Dragon Koopa" template. (kidding)
 * 3) Tahts a big template. Per the azo that Walks. Or Walkazo, if you're boring. :P JK
 * 4) Huge Templates makes things hard to distinguish because they are overcrowded. I think we should also split the Yoshi Enemies template, that one is freakin' HUMONGOUS.
 * 5) Too many Koopas. It overfills the old template, so making a second is better, so it doesn't overfill the first one. Heck, a lot of other templates go this way. (Like Blitz said).
 * 1) Too many Koopas. It overfills the old template, so making a second is better, so it doesn't overfill the first one. Heck, a lot of other templates go this way. (Like Blitz said).

Comments
We can't use yours, it breaks the page up. <_< I suggest you try fixing that before you try to get it used.
 * It doesn't on my computer, but I use hexadecimal workarounds and they go screwy a lot so I'll look into that. - Walkazo

Concerning Blitzwing's comment, there are many ways to deal with the Yoshi Enemies Template than splitting it, such as organizing it so all the enemies are divided into sections based on the Enemy Classes, sorta like how I made this species-only Koopa Template I made in my spare time (if it doesn't work again blame my ancient computer). - Walkazo
 * Hmm... That's a good template. Still very large, but much easier to find stuff. That should be what the YI one should be like, cuz that one is really crowded.

}}

Use of the Term "Clone"
DON'T USE THE TERM "CLONE" 12-1

With the release of Super Smash Bros. Brawl, several users have been arguing and editing back and forth regarding the inclusion of the blanket, fan-made term "clone" in the character articles. The opposition argues that it is a fan term of no solid definition. Its use encourages assumptions on the part of both the readers and editors rather than granting support to in-depth discriptions of fighting styles. The support argues that it is legitimate, pervasive term understood by all and applicable as long as characters share special moves.

{{scroll box|content= Proposer: {{User:Stumpers/sig}} Deadline: March 25, 2008, 17:00

Remove "Clone" From Articles

 * 18:55, 18 March 2008 (EDT) The use of a fan term on a Wiki that prides itself on using only official sources is questionable. Additionally, there is no set definition that all fans agree on.  One can see this by looking at the SSB Wikia, our Wiki, and the Smash Wiki... but that's been merged wtih SSB Wikia now.  If you click the links, you'll see that some sources (us!) only consider it to be a clone if the character is exactly the same while others (them) consider a character to be a clone if they are neaerly identical.  Therefore, the use of the term brings misinformation, as what the writer intends by using it is not going to be what the reader interprets it as.  Also, no character has ever been "exactly the same" -- so our definition is wrong to begin with.
 * 1) Yeah, per Stumpers. "Clone" is not a good term, unless it has been officially stated by Nintendo or The makers of the game.
 * 2) Its not official, its meaning is debatable, it just shortens the articles. Its worthless.
 * 3) Per everyone.
 * 4) HyperToad Per Stumpers. Not only is it a fan-made term, but Wolf ang Luigi and a few others' status as "clones" are debatable.
 * 5) Per everyone. Heck, I was the first user to point out that Clone is unofficial.
 * 6) Booster -- Purely a fan-made term. Get rid of it.
 * 7) Walkazo - Per all.
 * 8) Princess Grapes Butterfly Per Stumpers I agree with him.
 * 9) – Per all, it's not big deal, fan terms often sneak their way in.
 * 10) Per everyone.
 * 1) Per everyone.

Include "Clone"

 * 1) Trogga - It's much easier to say "Y is a clone of X" than "Y has a similar moveset to X's".

Comments
I'm not sure on which side to take on this one just yet. There is a debate about whether it is a genuine fan-term or not. Some say that Sakurai said something of the sort, specifically describing the characters that were very similar. Hard to say, though.

One of the most confusing clone acts is with Mario and Fox. According to fan base, they each have 2 clones. These are Dr. Mario, Luigi, Falco, and Wolf. They are all diffrent, but people consider them to be clones. The answer? They're not clones! They're distinctly diffrent, so they shouldn't be labeled "clones".
 * Sorry, but wolf is not a clone.

Hey, Stumpers, you spelled "legitimate" wrong. I corrected it. ;)
 * Thanks. I expanded on my vote (didn't touch the proposal!), btw, so make sure you're still "per Stumpers"!  22:46, 18 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Looks good. I'm even more "Per Stumpers" now! :P
 * All right! 00:17, 20 March 2008 (EDT)

Trogga: I'd hope you'd go more in-depth about what was the same and what was different regardless. 21:22, 24 March 2008 (EDT) }}

Food
DON'T MERGE 7-1

Awhile ago, I believe made a proposal regarding the notabilty of the article: Cheese. Although I agreed with him on some points, my opinion went to keeping the article. Anyway, while giving my opinions, I suggested a List of Real World Foods in the Mario Series article, which, as long as it would be, would probably help this wiki. Chesse, for example could easily be merged into a list, just like any Pokemon could be on the Pokemon article.

{{scroll box|content= Proposer: HyperToad Deadline: March 26, 2008, 17:00

Merge Them

 * 1) HyperToad My reasons given above.

Keep Them

 * So this proposal would merge all "Real World food" into one article, regardless of its importance in the Marioverse? I'm against that; you have to decide about each article separately.
 * 1) Definately not. Then, Peach, Banana, Melon, etc, etc, etc would also be merged. Can you give us a list beyond "cheese" that you're thinking of?
 * 2) - I don't think it makes sense making a general decision like that just to eradicate the cheese article. There is much different food in the Paper Mario series and in Super Mario Sunshine which has its right to their own article, just because cheese is controversial, it doesn't mean that we should get rid of something else.
 * 3) Booster - Not a good idea. Many Real World foods serve as actual items with their own legit pages. Besides Cheese, what foods are you thinking of?
 * 4) - Per Booster.
 * 5) Princess Grapes Butterfly Per all
 * 1) Princess Grapes Butterfly Per all

Comments
HyperToad, please explain your proposal. As Stumpers said, according to your current explanation, we'd also need to remove articles like Watermelon, which makes no sense at all. 07:07, 20 March 2008 (EDT)

Hmm... The opposers have a point... Someone convince me one way or the other.
 * Ok, I'll try! I think the thing with the lists was that all the articles were stubs.  Now, compare that with Cheese, Banana, Peach (item).  18:20, 20 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Maybe there could be "list of minor real world foods in the marioverse.
 * Maybe, but then you get into how you define minor, etc. The reason I'm okay with all of the "implied" pages is that the subject in question is never seen, so it's a clear boundry.  What definition would you like to use?  18:46, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

Okay, I suppose a Bananna has usefulness. To tell the truth, I knew there were others out there (foods), but I couldn't think of any. Pretty stupid to make a proposal then, huh? Anyway, I think articles just as Melons, despite having a role in the Marioverse, could still be merged. We don't give sperate pages for Ashley and Red, (not trying to argue about that) despite the fact that they are inportant character, just not enough for two articles. In addition, I agree with Blitzwing consearing inplied characters. HyperToad
 * But we do have enough to say about Melons. There's no point in merging it. (Perhaps we could merge all those differently-colored Watermelons, but this is not the place to discuss that, I think. (And HyperToad, please check your links, "Bananna" leads to nowhere.)) 07:56, 22 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The thing is, there might be a few foods that belong in a list, but we can't make the list because of all the important ones. I'm not sure what the best solution is.
 * HyperToad, this definately wasn't a dumb proposal. The only dumb proposals are, IMO, those that are used for a political motive (ie, when the proposer thinks his/her side isn't legit from the get-go) rather than for the betterment of the Wiki.  So don't be hard on yourself.  22:45, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Nah, of course it's not dumb. Just in case you think that's what I was trying to say. 06:47, 26 March 2008 (EDT)

}}

Comic Subpages
NO COMIC SIGN-UP USER SUB-PAGES ALLOWED 11-0

Lately, many Users have had a habit of creating sprite comics based on the sprites of other Users. While this, itself, is OK on its own, many Users have also created subpages to have people sign up for these comics. To quote Blitzwing, "I think we should get rid of all those 'SIGN-UP ON MY COMIC!!!!1!' subpages on Mariowiki, that kind of thing just doesn't have a place on an encyclopedia." Therefore, I propose the elimination of these subpages.

{{scroll box|content= Proposer: {{User:ChaosNinji/sig}} Deadline: March 26, 2008, 17:00

Delete Comic Sign Up Subpages

 * 1)  I'm the proposer.
 * 2)  Delete 'em. At least have a type of link to Userpedia to sign up. The sign-ups are kinda annoying going through pages, and so on.
 * 3) The Mario wiki part of this shouldn't be used for that stuff. It should stay on Userpedia.
 * 4) This is the MarioWiki, a place for Mario info, not sprite comics based on websites based on video games based on plumbers.
 * 5) – comic signup should go on the talk page of the comic subpage
 * 6) - Per Wayoshi, and only him. Generally, user page content shouldn't have restrictions.
 * 7) - I misunderstood the proposal :P. Per Wayoshi. I thought it was saying to delete comic subpages themselves.
 * 8) Per Wayoshi.
 * 9) GreenKoopa - Comments or questions? · [[Image:Koopa.gif]] Keeping the comic pages is a stretch; the signups being destroyed is a given. Theres a place for wiki fandom; Its a maaaagical place called:USERPEDIA.
 * 1) GreenKoopa - Comments or questions? · [[Image:Koopa.gif]] Keeping the comic pages is a stretch; the signups being destroyed is a given. Theres a place for wiki fandom; Its a maaaagical place called:USERPEDIA.
 * 1) GreenKoopa - Comments or questions? · [[Image:Koopa.gif]] Keeping the comic pages is a stretch; the signups being destroyed is a given. Theres a place for wiki fandom; Its a maaaagical place called:USERPEDIA.

Comments
Well, comics are a great part in the MarioWiki. It's fun to create, sign up, and read. I mean, where else would people ask to sign up for their comic? What's the downside of comic subpages?
 * Userpedia and the forums can easily be used for the same purposes. Comics make the Wiki look unprofessional, and, as Blitz said, they just don't belong.
 * They make the wiki look unproffesional? Couldn't the same thing be said for user pages? I mean, is that really a good reason to get rid of them? And "They Just Don't Belong" is a nonsensical reason.
 * The ``wiki`` part should only be an encyclopedia, not a social network! IT's bad enough that most of the users only do User talk-page edits and don't contribute to the encyclopedia, we don't need to allow these guys even more ways of wasting our database space. Userpage are OK - They are made to makes yourself know and gives info about you and your contribution on the wiki, Comic sub-page are just... pointless.  --Blitzwing 20:44, 19 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Blitz, there is no possible way to stop users editing user talk pages. Besides, we have plenty of database space. It's not like "Oh no! Only 14 more pages left!" or anything. Also, Comic pages are to express your creativity in a humorous way, and to have fun with it. I think they are important enough to stay on the wiki. This isn't Wikipedia. It's a wiki about games. It doesn't have to be super-proffesional. But that's just my opinion.
 * Garlic Man has a good point, but I guess having a section in your talk page would also be fine.
 * Isn't that what Userpedia is for?
 * Yep. --Blitzwing 17:52, 20 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Um, not everyone knows about usepedia. I learned about it a day or to ago. It's not in the welcome template or anything.

Geez, Blitz, never thought you'd go THAT far in trying to keep us from having fun. Anyway, will COMICS THEMSELVES have to go? Like my MW Alliance page?
 * Uh, I didn't make the proposal complain to Ninji.

--Blitzwing 21:01, 20 March 2008 (EDT)
 * We're just talkin' about taking the comic stuff off of Mario Wiki, not Userpedia. It should be there anyway. Oh, I've got a question. Could we have a way of telling members about Userpedia?
 * Well, Userpedia is unofficial and unaffiliated to Mariowiki. Maybe it could be linked in the rules for Userspace/user sub-page/whatever. --Blitzwing 21:11, 20 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Userpedia is unaffiliated to the Mariowiki? I thought all long it was... I guess I was wrong :P. Anyway, doesn't this mean we have to get rid of the comics on userpages too?
 * Yes, because that is what Userpedia is for. NOT Mario Wiki.
 * Uh, no. --Blitzwing 13:03, 21 March 2008 (EDT)
 * All this about userpedia! How did all you find out that there is a userpedia? I stumbled upon it by going to InfectedShroom's comic, and I don't really understand what it's about. So if there's no way for users to find out about userpedia, you can't just say "That's what userpedia is for. And Green Koopa's sarcasm "Its a maaaagical place called:USERPEDIA" as if it's so obvious that it exists. But it really isn't. 18:47, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Generally, you may have on your user page what you want. Wayoshi's solution seems the best - Comic sign up pages should be on the talk pages of the actual comic subpages, not somewhere else. - 13:05, 21 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Sorry, everyone! I totally misunderstood the proposal! I thought it was saying that saying there should be no more comic subpages. So, yes, now that I understand, it's sorta pointless to have a seperate page just to sign up, yes.

I wonder if all supporters are voting for the same thing. What will happen when the proposal passes? - 14:41, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

We need to make this more clear. I'm guessing this means:


 * All comics still on wiki = deleted.
 * All comic sign-ups on wiki = deleted.

I'm not voting; it's already a landslide. Sorry for yelling atcha, Blitz. ._.
 * Well, then it's definitely not what I, Wayoshi and Garlic Man put our votes on the support side for. - 08:17, 22 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Isn't the wording quite clear? "Therefore, I propose the elimination of these subpages." Thus, no deletion of comics, no deletion of comic sign-ups in general, only elimination of sign-up subpages. 08:24, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

We add them here so that MW exclusive user can sign up on them. HyperToad It helps them be bigger.

When you have a quote in a quote, you use ' instead of ". I fixed it for you.

OK, this proposal is for the removal of ALL comics. ALL OF THEM. INCLUDING things like MW Alliance and Glitchman's series. ChaosNinji, please add a sub-category for keeping comics themselves.
 * What? Says who? Two days before deadline is a BIT late for such an essential decision anyway. 17:52, 24 March 2008 (EDT)

Kay, fine. After this goes through I'm making a proposal to keep COMICS THEMSELVES on the Wiki.
 * We ARE keeping the comic sub-pages. We just want to get rid of comic sign-up sub-pages, since they can stay on the talk page of the comic.

}}