Talk:Super Mushroom

Super Mario 64
Do Super Mushroom appear in the original Super Mario 64, and do their turn Mario "Mega"? I only have DS, so I kind of dunno. Gofer

Hello? Gofer

Nope. I haven't even seen them in DS.

I've seen them in the DS version, and yes, they do make Mario larger than most other games depict. However, I wouldn't consider it 'mega'. And no, they don't appear in the original. ~ 14:38, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

There needs to be much more about the classic super mushroom. There's two sentences about it, and then it moves on to game specifics. There should be more about it's role in the platformers. old ones (Super Mario Bros. series, Super Mario World) and new ones (New Super Mario Bros.). And this picture should be in it, since it really a Super Mushroom, not just a plain mushroom.

Who got rid of the super mario 64 ds section for super mushroom???

Redirect to Mushroom?
I think this page should redirect to Mushroom.
 * It was officially named. Plus, the Mushroom article is for types of mushrooms, ex: Poison Mushroom, 1-Up Mushroom, Boo Mushroom, etc...

Added some images. 15:45, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Super Mushroom vs. A. muscaria
From the article: "The Super Mushroom is inspired from the poisonous Fly Agaric toadstool (Amanita Muscaria)." Is there a reliable source that states that the Super Mushroom was inspired by the appearance of A. muscaria rather than the resemblance being a coincidence? Someone on this discussion over at Wikipedia wants to know. --Tepples 18:08, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Eat vs. Absorb
Let's just confirm now, I called nintendo, asked tons of questions, Mario TOUCHES them, It's been confirmed, one of the represenitives, Thomas, said so. Pgj1997 13:41, 24 September 2011 (EDT)

New Super Mario Bros. 2?
Isn't New Super Mario Bros. 2 the same as New. Super Mario Bros. Wii? In this page it says they are differentRoller Coaster Wiki 05:37, 9 June 2012 (EDT)

New Super Mario Bros. 2 and New Super Mario Bros. Wii are separate games.


 * If they were the same game, then why would we have the one on the 3DS? That wouldn't make any sense. 15:48, 3 November 2012 (EDT)

SMB2 Mistake ?
I think that the Super Mario Bros. 2 subsection shouldn't be in the Super Mushroom article but in the Mushroom article. Indeed, it doesn't change Mario into Super Mario but add him some HP. In every case, we can't let the SMB2 subsection in the both articles.


 * I agree.--Thejfh1999 (talk) 15:52, 2 November 2012 (EDT)
 * I also agree. Yes, there is a problem with that. 15:46, 3

November 2012 (EDT) I disagree because saying that is like saying the Super Mushrooms of Mario and Luigi:Super Star saga are not super mushrooms because they add HP as appose to changing Mario into Super Mario. John Roberts
 * There are no Super Mushrooms in M&L:SS. They are types of Mushrooms because they add HP. If they are called Super Mushrooms it is only because it is a better mushroom than the normal mushroom (in the game). They may have the same name, but because of the fact that their utility are not the same, they are not the same items. According to you, we should create the page "Ultra Mushroom" ? No, because it is a Mushroom. This is the reason why there are two different pages : Mushroom and Super Mushroom Banon (talk)

Well, we could A.just assume the mushroom can do both (speculation, not preferred) or B. Have a proposal. Kelton2: Your neighborhood wiki helper. (talk) 08:08, 5 November 2012 (EST)
 * Why not, but if we choose A, we should merge the two articles, and I don't think it should be done, but maybe ? And that wasn't my first point, I just wanted to remove the SMB 2 subsection in the Super Mushroom article, because all of the others subsections in this article talk about a mushroom who change Small Mario into Super Mario. Banon (talk)

Rewrite Super Mushroom
I think we should rewrite some sections on the page of the Super Mushroom and remove some unnecessary information. If you see it in the section on Super ary 64 DS there is a piece that speaks of the 1-Up Mushroom, while in other sections (especially in the sections about New Super Mario Bros. and its sequel we talk about most of the fungi in general that the super mushroom itself) -

Uh, why don't you just add tags to the article then? You don't have to create proposals for this stuff. 17:26, 27 June 2013 (EDT)
 * Yeah, this isn't what Proposals are for, and it wasn't formatted correctly anyway (wrong deadline, no template), so I just deleted it (i.e. removed the TPP dressings, but left the actual comments). - 20:00, 27 June 2013 (EDT)

Super Mario 64 DS?
Is the "Mushroom" from Super Mario 64 DS really supposed to be a Super Mushroom? Its internal object name is SCALEUP_KINOKO, which might suggest that it wasn't supposed to be a Super Mushroom from the start. I know it looks like a Super Mushroom, but in Mario Pinball Land, released around the same time, the mushroom that otherwise looks like a Super Mushroom is called the Mega Mushroom. I'm thinking it was really supposed to be a Mega Mushroom, but this fact was lost since the Mega Mushroom's characteristics weren't solidified until New Super Mario Bros. LinkTheLefty (talk) 15:00, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * Page 29. Says "Super Kinoko." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:57, May 22, 2020 (EDT)
 * That still doesn't explain why the developers didn't just call it a "SUPER_KINOKO" to begin with and how it gives Mega Mushroom's giant form, but very well. LinkTheLefty (talk) 10:16, May 23, 2020 (EDT)

Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) and the old Mario Party Golden Mushroom?
So something I honestly must ask is why the Super Mushrooms from the RPG games are a separate page from this, given they have the same name in both English and Japanese. It's not like we consider those games' basic Mushrooms to be the same as these instead; rather, we treat them as the same as the item from Super Mario Bros. 2, the Mario Kart games, and a whole bunch of other things. The different purpose isn't solid reasoning either, not only due to the aforementioned Mushroom page, but Super Mushroom's contemporary, Fire Flower, also has a vastly different function between games across genres, particularly the RPGs. As for the color in the PM games, so? It was orange with red spots originally, and again bringing up Fire Flower, it didn't get its current design until the Bro Flower in Partners in Time, not being used for anything specifically called "Fire Flower" until New Super Mario Bros. in 2006, 21 years after its initial introduction.

This brings me to another split "Super Mushroom" (or "Super Kinoko"), the yellow-colored "Golden Mushroom" in Mario Party 2, 3, 5, 6, and 7. While this split makes more sense on the surface level, its capsule/orb in the GCN games called it a Super Mushroom in English too, showing that it'd be better suited here than sharing a page with what is already two fairly distinct items anyway. Furthermore, games much later would add an actual Golden Mushroom based on the Mario Kart ones with a completely different function from these ones in the earlier MP games.

Note that on the subject of Golden Mushroom, I am not counting the MK64 one in this as that is clearly a localization inconsistency (it's "Powerful Kinoko" in Japanese, which is a shorter version of its name in most later MK games), but the MP one and the RPG item really ought to just be merged here to stop needlessly obfuscating this. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:41, June 9, 2021 (EDT)
 * I'm on board with merging the RPG healing item, not sure about the MP Goldens. 16:04, June 10, 2021 (EDT)
 * I think it should be noted that the MP Goldens (which look like normal yellow-capped tan-stemmed mushrooms in later appearances) have a role analogous to the RPG item in that they function as a step up from the normal mushroom item. Contrast, say, the Mario Kart "Powerful" Golden Mushroom, which is a huge boost over the normal mushroom. (I also forgot to mention the SMRPG "Mid Mushroom" item is green-capped, adding yet another color.) Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 01:42, June 15, 2021 (EDT)

I am just giving my opinon but I think it shold be in the gold mushroom page.
 * Mario Party 5, 6, and 7 call it a Super Mushroom even in the English version, though. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:52, June 15, 2021 (EDT)

A thought that just occured to me: how do the "Gold Mushrooms" from Rakin' 'em In factor into this? The Golden Mushroom article currently doesn't even mention the minigame. 02:28, June 17, 2021 (EDT)
 * The minigame descriptions seem completely different between English and Japanese, so I can't say for certain (though my gut instinct is to keep them with the usable item from the same game). Perhaps LTL or Mister Wu could have some insight on this... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:53, June 17, 2021 (EDT)

I'd be on board with a merge of the articles. Would this require a TPP or something like that? Somethingone (talk) 21:01, June 17, 2021 (EDT)
 * As long as there's anything less than absolute consensus, yes, a change on this scale would indeed. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:16, June 17, 2021 (EDT)

I, personally, am not seeing a good reason to merge them. A healer Super Mush and a Gold Mush in general are completeley different things with completeley different functions which appear in completely different games, so I don't think we need to. Broque (talk) 11:22, July 12, 2021 (EDT)
 * Ahem. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:26, July 12, 2021 (EDT)

"Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) and the old Mario Party Golden Mushroom?"

- Doc von Schmeltwick (talk)

"So something I honestly must ask is why the Super Mushrooms from the RPG games are a separate page from this..."

- Doc von Schmeltwick (talk)

"This brings me to another split "Super Mushroom" (or "Super Kinoko"), the yellow-colored "Golden Mushroom" in Mario Party 2, 3, 5, 6, and 7..."

- Doc von Schmeltwick (talk)

Ahem. Broque (talk) 20:49, July 12, 2021 (EDT)
 * ...what? I was only saying your argument about function completely falls apart upon looking at how the Mushroom page is currently handled. Besides, how about the Fire Flower in the old PM games which is planted before launching its own attack? That seems like an even bigger difference to me since both SMB and PM Super Mushes increase hit points. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 20:59, July 12, 2021 (EDT)

Well, a healing Super Mush will recover your HP. Do a Gold Mush or a Super Mario Super Mush do that? No. In the old Mario Party games, a Gold Mush could be considered a Triple Dice Block to modern partiers. Can either Super Mush do that? No. And a Super Mario Super Mush will allow you to take another hit and break Brick Blocks. Can a healing Super Mush or a Gold Mush do that? Nooooooo. Super Mario Super Mush, healing Super Mush, old MP Gold Mush. Completely different things, completely different functions, completely different games. You are saying the latter two should be merged with the former, and due to the statement in the previous sentence, I am not seeing how that is making any sense. Broque (talk) 21:22, July 12, 2021 (EDT)
 * In the old games, it increases Mario's hit points from one to two. You haven't addressed the Fire Flower thing, and all "distinctions" you are bringing up are completely arbitrary and based entirely on the gameplay type. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 21:33, July 12, 2021 (EDT)
 * Broque, not to sound rude, but rather than ask if the items themselves do that, ask if the games have those things. Do you have HP in Mario Party or the Mario Platformers? Do you roll dice in the RPGS and the Platformers? Do you break Brick Blocks in the RPGS and Mario Party? Somethingone (talk) 16:52, July 13, 2021 (EDT)
 * You might as well say that Blue Coins from Super Mario Sunshine should be split because that's the only game where they're a finite collectible instead of being worth 1 or 5 regular coins, or Warp Pipe Orbs from Mario Party 7 should be split for having a different function from the previous games. Or that Shine Sprites in Thousand-Year Door should be split because they aren't used to power up partners in any other game. Difference in function alone, especially between games in different genres, does not warrant a split. Especially when you don't even get your facts right: Super Mushrooms do restore health, both in Super Mario and in other games such as Yoshi's Safari and Luigi's Mansion 3DS. 18:22, July 13, 2021 (EDT)

Even after the proposals, the above-mentioned Gold Mushrooms from Rakin' 'em In are still an issue. Where do we put them? 20:04, August 12, 2021 (EDT)
 * Unless conflicting evidence arrives, I'd say have them on Super Mushroom. I would have added them when I merged last night, but I forgot the minigame's name. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 00:32, August 13, 2021 (EDT)
 * Update: turns out it's its own thing too, きんいろキノコ Kin'iro Kinoko, as seen here. This means it is separate from the usable Super Mushrooms in the same game. I would also separate it from Gold Mushroom myself since that's been so homogenous across its appearances, so I'd perhaps split it too, though finding an identifier could be troublesome. The only real alternative I could think of would be to move the "Golden Mushroom (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga)" simply to "Golden Mushroom" (moving the current to "Golden Mushroom (disambiguation)") and merge it there, which is honestly probably the better option. As a side note, I'd keep the ones from MP4's Bowser Wrestling on Super Mushroom due to their functionality. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 02:17, August 15, 2021 (EDT)

Merge Super Mushroom (healing item) here
See above. This is clearly the same subject in a different genre, which occasional color variation to differentiate it from the occasional "basic" mushroom. And considering Super Mushroom wasn't even red until Super Mario World, I don't think that's that big of a deal. I have seen some support for merging "normal" Mushroom here instead, though that comes off as arbitrarily picking-and-choosing in defiance of official terminology, which is a slippery slope I want to avoid.

I am not including the Mario Party Golden Mushroom in this proposal, as Golden Mushroom is currently under its own proposal.

Proposer: Deadline: August 6, 2021, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per.
 * 2) Per proposal.
 * 3) I was skeptical about it at first because of it being the second-in-line of mushroom healing items in RPGs, but I guess it will be consistent with how we handle the main Mushroom page.
 * 4) The same item but with a different effect to match a different genre (just like the main Mushroom page, but I digress). Per proposal except for its penultimate sentence.
 * 5) Per proposal.

Oppose

 * 1) The Super Mushroom in question here is also a blue capped Mushroom that also appears in the Paper Mario series as a stronger variation of the normal Mushroom and goes by a different overall name. I'm beginning to see the whole complicity with all these different types of Mushrooms; as the Super Mushroom of this page talks about it's role as a "get bigger" item while the overall Mushroom page talks about how it's a boosting item in Mario Kart, an extra dice block in Mario Party and a healing item in the RPGs. That being said, I still don't believe this is the place to merge this particular Super Mushroom with. Heck, I'd sooner split the RPG use of Mushroom from the standard Mushroom page, though that's a different topic, as that page is covering a lot of different uses overall. At the base of things, I feel this page is fine, as it's covering the Super Mushroom's role as a healing item exclusively while the standard Super Mushroom page talks about the item as a power-up.
 * 2) Per Tails777.

Comments
The link to the Golden Mushroom proposal is broken BTW Somethingone (talk) 11:21, July 23, 2021 (EDT)
 * I fixed it. 13:55, July 23, 2021 (EDT)

@Oppose Super Mushroom also restores health in Yoshi's Safari and Luigi's Mansion (3DS) but is considered the "usual" type. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:02, August 5, 2021 (EDT)