Talk:Pokémon

This page receives my condolences for its sourcation citation. Kudos! H K  4  7 ,


 * Um, you do know condolences means apologies, right? =P Anyway, yeah, that's great.

And apology means explanation. I'm explaining my Congratulations. You know, this must be why people love me here. H K  4  7 ,

No comment. Just, leave it at that. *walks away in confusion*

I read a lot of Douglass Adams. <---That's an apology of how I live the way I live. H K  4  7 ,

Douglas Adams 'Rules!

You'll occasionally find me on the internet as HK-42. I'm that on the RareWiki. H K  4  7,   , LONG DARK TEATIME OF THE SOUL

Delete
I feel this page is not so related to the Mario series since they only appear in the SSB series. Radfox35 21:47, 12 November 2015 (EST)

S.M.M. Costume Mario sprites?
.S. Could you please include a section with the Pokémon Costume Mario sprites from Super Mario Maker? Radfox35 18:21, 20 November 2015 (EST)

Trivia
I thought it was the other way around-Pokemon was first and Mario was second. 18:03, 5 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Nope. Mario first, Pokemon second. Final Fantasy comes third :P Lol.

Table
Should there be a table for the Pokemon. Like the one we have on the Assist Trophy page. Issue is, we need the Images. Of course, the Brawl section won't be an issue. Just a suggestion.

Deoxys?
Is the Deoxys from SSBB in attack form, normal form, defense form, or speed form? I think it is one of the first two though. 15:25, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

Attack.


 * See also here. - 15:27, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

Thanks. Also, is it a good idea to organize the pokemon page like we (Cobold) did with the stages on the SSBB article? Finding images is no problem for me (I have an awesome source), but would it be a bad a idea to upload every single pokemon's image? 15:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)
 * We are up to do the same with Assist Trophies. It would be a lot of work and many images, but I think it can pass the Importance Policy. - 15:32, 27 July 2007 (EDT)
 * I suggested that as well. I think we should do the same here as we did to the Assist Trophy article. BTW, Knife, what is your source?

What source (serebii.net)? 21:32, 27 July 2007 (EDT)
 * What? I can never get pictures from Serebii.net. For some reason, I am unable to copy and paste, or do anything like that. How do you do it?
 * OK, we need to do a Table on the original SSB Pokemon, I think the playable ones should get a Table, and perhaps the Trophy Pokemon. What do you think?

SSB ones are a little harder to find. And I'm not sure if an image for each Pokemon trophy is good, since it's hard enough to find individual trophies. And also, I just press Print Screen on the top right of the keyboard to copy everything visible on the monitor. 19:26, 28 July 2007 (EDT)
 * What do you mean it is hard to find individual trophies?

A gallery of 30 Pokemon in SSBM – easy. A gallery of 400+ trophy – very very very hard. 00:26, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

400+ Trophy?

No, actually 290 trophies in SSBM, but you get my point. 16:56, 29 July 2007 (EDT)
 * I'll bet you I can find ALL 290+ Trophy pics.

Hmmm... can you really? If you could, that would really help. Maybe put it in a table format. 01:34, 30 July 2007 (EDT)

Top image suggestions
Here's some suggestions to replace that Pikachu picture in the article:

Suggestion 1 A gathering of Pokémon in Melee's gameplay.

Suggestion 2 A group of Pokémon in Melee's opening movie. — NES Boy 12:52, 3 September 2007 (EDT)

Gender issues
How do we know Pikachu and Pichu are male, and Jigglypuff is female? --Trogga 21:21, 8 October 2007 (EDT)
 * Because they are based on the Pikachu, Pichu and Jigglypuff from the Pokemon Anime. Pikachu and Pichu were Male in the Anime, and Jigglypuff was Female. Mewtwo was genderless.
 * I thought they were all usually called an "it" in the Anime (and other Nintendo source). --Trogga 23:17, 8 October 2007 (EDT)

Pikachu's and Jigglypuffs gender in the Anime is never confirmed.

Pikachu's is. If you've played the games (or at least Generation IV), you would know that a female Pikachu has an indent in its tail, which Ash's Pikachu does not have. And, I believe the Jigglypuff that was a recurring character that drew on people's faces after it put them to sleep (with Sing) was a female. I just showed some inner nerd.
 * The anime, and Ash's Pikachu therein, existed for over ten years before Gen IV came out and gender-differences (besides the Nidoran line) were introduced. Redstar 19:47, 17 December 2009 (EST)

Bonsly & Entei
Bulbapedia states Bonsly & Entei as Poké Ball Pokémon. Should I add them?

If they have a reliable source. - And pictures!

I heard of Bonsly, but not Entei. I trust the person who said Bonsly(Gimpyfish), he said he said it just walks around but you can pick it up and throw it for great damage and knockback, but you don't have to believe me though. - Pikatwo

Rayquaza
Should an article be made on Rayquaza? For those of you who don't know who Rayquaza is, he is the Dragon Pokémon that emerged from the lake and attacked Diddy Kong and Fox in the Subspace Emissary.

Brawl Starsomething
In the so far latest video for Brawl at ign, I see out of a pokeball either staryu or starmie. I can't tell which. 01:28, 24 December 2007 (EST)

It is Staryu, as Starmie only appears in the original.

links
The links for the Pokémon species at bulbapedia are wrong. At bulbapedia, they have a (Pokémon) at the end, such as Raichu's species page being at Raichu (Pokémon) and Porygon-Z being (Pokémon). I'd fix it but it causes problems with the template. Dry Bones A (talk | contribs) 17:53, 22 January 2010 (EST)
 * But they redirect or link to disambigs, so whats the problem?? -- 18:01, 22 January 2010 (EST)
 * The redirects may not be a problem but the disambiguations can be a problem. A redirect takes you to the page, while the disambig doesn't, instead showing a list of individual members of that species of Pokémon along with the species page. Dry Bones A (talk | contribs) 21:54, 27 January 2010 (EST)

Explosion or Selfdestruct?
I own a copy of Pokémon Diamond, and I've never seen a Pokémon use a move called Explosion. Instead there's a similar move called Selfdestruct which the user blows up damaging all other Pokémon and making itself faint. That's what Electrode does in SSB. So is it really called Explosion or Selfdestruct in the SSB games?

Bulbapedia Links
Hello

Just here to say that pokemon for Brawl don't have Bulbapedia Links. --Plumber690 20:55, May 30, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, so what? You're saying this so somebody else can do it? If you really think it needs doing, why not do it yourself?

It's a lot of hard work linking to other wikis. --Plumber690 21:32, May 30, 2011 (UTC)
 * Checking out Yoshiwaker's talk page (sorry Yoshiwaker if I'm being nosy), but why exactly does he need to reply? You noticed something wrong with an article, take the initiative and fix it yourself. That'd be like me making a section on talk pages about typoes when I could just do it myself. The amount of time you put into making all these comments you could have done it yourself by now. Now only that but your "it's too hard work" excuse is total bs, and it makes you sound totally lazy. If you want to help the wiki improve, learn how to do the hard stuff. Coding is difficult for me at times, but I still get over it and do it myself.

The trouble is that it takes a lot of work and it is hard linking to other wikis. I'm sure someone will do it eventually. --Plumber690 21:15, June 5, 2011 (UTC)

And that means you are lazy.


 * There. That wasn't so hard.

Articles for All
The assist trophy character proposal thing passed, so with that in full swing, I wanted to discuss if the Pokeball Pokemon deserve articles as well. The only major difference between the two is that Pokeballs cover only one series (as far as I can tell), so I'm for it. However, feedback is welcome. 17:05, 2 November 2014 (EST)

I personally agree with the idea that Poke Balls should get their own articles. 16:44, 7 November 2014 (EST)

I also agree as well, also, you should start a proposal about it though.
 * Considering the Assist Trophy proposal passed without much of a hitch, I feel like creating a proposal is just going to waste time.

A bit late, but I think you can attempt to create Pokeball Pokemon articles and cite your assist trophy proposal as a logical connection, and that crossovers get full coverage. Just be bold about things. 17:27, 18 November 2014 (EST)

List of Pokemon pages to merge
Because there are far, FAR too many to list on the template


 * Moving this list here as it should not be in mainspace. And if anyone wants to check them off after they're merged like the Lists of Power Moons anchors. 06:32, 22 June 2018 (EDT)


 * Abomasnow
 * Arceus
 * Articuno
 * Beedrill
 * Bellossom
 * Blastoise
 * Bonsly
 * Celebi
 * Chansey
 * Chespin
 * Chikorita
 * Clefairy
 * Cyndaquil
 * Darkrai
 * Dedenne
 * Deoxys
 * Eevee
 * Electrode
 * Entei
 * Fennekin
 * Fletchling
 * Gardevoir
 * Genesect
 * Giratina
 * Gogoat
 * Goldeen
 * Groudon
 * Gulpin
 * Hitmonlee
 * Ho-Oh
 * Inkay
 * Jirachi
 * Keldeo
 * Kyogre
 * Kyurem
 * Latias & Latios
 * Lugia
 * Lugia
 * Manaphy
 * Marill
 * Meloetta
 * Meowth
 * Metagross
 * Mew
 * Moltres
 * Munchlax
 * Onix
 * Oshawott
 * Palkia
 * Piplup
 * Porygon2
 * Raikou
 * Scizor
 * Snivy
 * Snorlax
 * Spewpa
 * Starmie
 * Staryu
 * Suicune
 * Swirlix
 * Togepi
 * Torchic
 * Unown
 * Venusaur
 * Victini
 * Weavile
 * Weezing
 * Wobbuffet
 * Xerneas
 * Zapdos
 * Zoroark

Issues
Does Articuno use Blizzard or Icy Wind in Melee? Not only do this page and our (current) page on it disagree, so do Bulbapedia and SmashWiki... - Reboot (talk) 01:20, 27 June 2018 (EDT)

Similar deal with Weezing - Poison Gas or Smog? - Reboot (talk) 02:08, 27 June 2018 (EDT)

Torchic - Ember or Fire Spin? - Reboot (talk) 03:32, 28 June 2018 (EDT)

Unmerge Pokémon, Assist Trophys, Enemies etc
I think the recent Smash Bros proposal is not good and we should unmerge everything. Wariopig (talk) 19:47, 22 June 2018 (EDT)Wariopig
 * Why post about that here? 19:49, 22 June 2018 (EDT)
 * Probably because these are next on the list. Anyways, I'm ambivalent on the matter of this specifically, it was the enemies I was against, mostly. Either way, 4 weeks between proposal's end and when next one can be made. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:50, 22 June 2018 (EDT)
 * I agree with Doc Wariopig (talk) 19:52, 22 June 2018 (EDT)Wariopig
 * Shoulda agreed with me when the proposal was made :\ Thing is, I supported parts of it, like merging in moves of non-Mario characters, but the folly of an omnibus proposal is that it wants way too much variation with what it does. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 19:54, 22 June 2018 (EDT)
 * We do have a forum post on this that goes into more detail if you wish to read that. 19:55, 22 June 2018 (EDT)
 * I think we should go ahead and merge the Pokémon. We're not Bulbapedia, so it wouldn't make sense for us to have all these Pokémon articles that don't relate at all to the Mario series. SeanWheeler (talk) 01:07, 24 June 2018 (EDT)
 * I do say that I have to agree with SeanWheeler here. It is not the Super Mario Wiki's job to have so many Pokémon articles. That's why Bulbapedia exists. It's one thing to have separate articles for the playable Pokémon fighters in Super Smash Bros., but it's another thing to have unnecessary Pokémon articles on a wiki that specifically covers any Mario-centric form of media. MarioManiac1981 (talk) 3:52, 3 August 2018 (EDT)

SSBU Poké Ball Pokémon
Can you add in all the new Poké Ball Pokémon from Super Smash Bros. Ultimate in the chart of all Poké Ball Pokémon and add in what they do when you summon them? --24.188.22.145 10:53, 24 December 2018 (EST)

Delete this article
There are a couple of Smash-related proposals active right now, and it reminded me that this article still exists. Why keep this? It is 100% non-Mario content.

It starts with a paragraph describing the mechanics of the Pokémon series, which is completely irrelevant. Most of the rest of this article's information can be divided into three categories:
 * Poké Ball Pokémon: Before the item merge, I would have said it belongs on the Poké Ball article. We can still move it to the Poké Ball section of the items list; it would make the article bigger, but not unacceptably so (around 150,000 bytes - far from the wiki's largest page). We also have a category that functions as a list.
 * Stage-specific Pokémon: Pokémon seen in Saffron City, Poké Floats, etc. They belong on the stage articles. The end.
 * Trophies and stickers: We decided that Mario-irrelevant trophies aren't necessary to cover, so this info isn't needed at all. As for stickers, there's an ongoing proposal about that, but even if we decide to keep them, the information will be on the sticker article, so there will still be no reason to have a separate list for specifically for Pokémon.

With all that weeded out, all that's left is a small list of playable Pokémon fighters, which we don't need.

Proposer: Deadline: April 28, 2023, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal.
 * 2) Has literally nothing to do with Mario. Only here because of our Smash coverage.
 * 3) Per proposal.
 * 4) Luigi '98.png Make this page faint!
 * 5) Per proposal.
 * 6) Per all.
 * 7) ShootingStar7X used Cut!
 * 8) Per all.
 * 9) Gotta delete 'em all!
 * 10) Per all. This article is very unnecessary.
 * 11) Unlike the Assist Trophies which do show off some Mario characters, no Pokémon is a Mario character. These are just a bunch of items that we have merged because Smash is an adjectiveless crossover (credits to Glowsquid on that term).
 * 12) Surprisingly I actually do support this one, even pre-merge I thought it was weird that the Poke Ball article was about an item that things come out of but then it didn't actually list any of those things. We don't really need a collective article for them, covering them where they're relevant to the game is fine. (Honestly I think a case can be made for splitting Poke Ball on length alone in the same vein as Assist Trophy. I know we're trying to minimize Smash articles but at the same time we have to acknowledge when list formatting might not be appropriate.)
 * 13) Per all. Everything on this page is either unrelated to Mario, or it can be covered on another already existing page.
 * 14) Finally, a reason to use Explosion that doesn't involve me fainting. And it's Super Effective! (per all)
 * 15) Per all.
 * 16) Gotta release them all!
 * 17) Per all.
 * 18) - Per all. If there were a Pokemon/Mario crossover outside of Smash Bros. (Nintendo Power joking about how to get Yoshi in Gen 1 aside, natch), maybe this'd have a more compelling reason to exist. Alas, no such thing exists, so until that day, we should probably relent as this article is very obviously a relic of a pre-SmashWiki era long gone by. (Seriously, we have more a compelling reason to cover the Puzzle & Dragons characters than we do Pokemon, and uh, we sure aren't doing that at the moment!)
 * 19) - Per all. One of the minor complaints I have about the wiki is that it tends to have a problem with bloat and going into too much detail about unrelated tangents, and the Pokémon article is a good example of this.
 * 20) Per all.
 * 21) Normally I would say no, but if the fighters would get merged with the Smash fighter lists, I would support. Then there's whether to treat Brawl/Ultimate Pokemon Trainer & 3DS/Wii U Charizard as separate characters or not, but that would require another proposal.

Comments
Should this not be redirected to Category:Pokémon series  (don't know how to link a category sorry) rather than outright deleted - i.e. like Fire Emblem, Earthbound, Metal Gear Solid? (though it's quite irregular how these categories work - some link to disambiguation pages, some link to Smash Bros fighters, Castlevania links to Dracula's Castle for some reason...) 13:16, April 18, 2023 (EDT)
 * Not even sure if we really need those category pages. They're just holdovers when we had all those special moves receiving their own pages and whatnot. 20:14, April 20, 2023 (EDT)
 * Not even sure if we really need those category pages. They're just holdovers when we had all those special moves receiving their own pages and whatnot. 20:14, April 20, 2023 (EDT)

Assuming redirects of specific Pokemon that lead into this article will also be deleted? Y'know, stuff like Fennekin, Gardevoir, etc.  ~Camwood777  (talk) 
 * There's probably little reason for them to exist, so I assume they'll be deleted too. 14:56, April 22, 2023 (EDT)
 * Those should be updated to point to wherever the information ends up going after this proposal. -- 16:12, April 22, 2023 (EDT)

Aftermath of proposal.
So now the proposal to delete the article has passed, the article is now a redirect to the Pokemon series category. But, there are a few things I am confused about. 1, Some of the redirects in the category redirect back to the category with a invalid section. 2, What will happen with Brawl/Ultimate Pokemon Trainer & 3DS/Wii U Charizard? 08:42, May 1, 2023 (CST)


 * I think we should just delete the category. They are all either redirects or are soon going to redirect to a stage list or disambiguations for moves that don't have a place on any list because we decided to omit the moves from the fighter lists. Other series categories that would need to be deleted for the same reasons include ARMS, EarthBound, Wii Fit and Xenoblade. SeanWheeler (talk) 03:03, May 3, 2023 (EDT)
 * Redirect to the Pokéball Smash items page. Bada-bing, bada-boom, skiddly-bop, problem solved. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 09:41, May 3, 2023 (EDT)
 * What will happen with Brawl/Ultimate Pokemon Trainer & 3DS/Wii U Charizard? 13:52, May 09, 2023 (CST)
 * They're alive and well on List of fighters debuting in Super Smash Bros. Brawl. 15:05, May 9, 2023 (EDT)
 * If my opinion on the state of these pages is to be considered, I do think they're alive, but well??? [[File:Fear SMRPG.png]] Well... I'm getting Conker (series) vibes where content related to these were given full coverage, later reduced to these list pages, and then they were deleted. 22:51, May 10, 2023 (EDT)
 * I don't know. I think we should really revise how this wiki covers crossovers. Not just Smash Bros. but the Mario & Sonic series and other games that are only part-Mario. SeanWheeler (talk) 23:00, May 11, 2023 (EDT)
 * We already don't give FULL coverage to crossovers. We give full coverage of Mario related stuff. Crossovers get trimmed accordingly. Smash has been trimmed a lot. This infinite loop needs to stop, or we won't be covering crossovers at all. We might end up just covering the Mario franchise if this keeps going. We might end up covering only one game, or stop being a Mario wiki all together. We would be a nothing wiki. 10:42, May 23, 2023 (CST)