MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/36

Make "List of Quotes by Character" Pages
MAKE CHARACTER QUOTE PAGES 12-0

I think we should make "List of Quotes by Character" pages (with "Character" being replaced by the name of a specific character). All the information will go onto a Writing Guideline eventually, but in the mantime, I'll just provide the main ideas here for reference...

These pages would only be for recurring characters, as oneshot characters already have complete quote lists on their parent games' pages. Discretion should also be used when determining what recurring characters should get quotes pages. If a character is major in one game, but only has a few lines in another game or two, there is no point giving them a quote page either: just give them a Quotes section with to the major appearance, as well as some choice quotes from that and all the quotes from the minor appearance. Similarly, if a character appears in many games, but they only have a couple lines in each one, just compile them into a small list that fits in a single Quotes section (like how no separate list pages are needed when there's only one or two glitches or beta elements). Character with quotes list pages should also get Quotes sections linking to the lists with, with a small sample of notable or characteristic (oft-repeated) quotes (in accordance with Empty Section Policy).

Each quote page will have a standardized header: " " (this will be added to Subpages Policy). The first section will be "General", and list quotes that appear in more than one appearance; if they only occur a couple times, the appearances can be listed (put these quotes at the bottom), but otherwise, just leave them. Try to put the most stereotypical quotes at the top (i.e. "Mama Mia" for Mario, "Help me, Mario!" for Peach, etc.), and remember that generic quotes are allowed here - just not things like screams ("ahhh"), nonsense and other stuff that sheds absolutely no light on the character ("hi", "okay", etc.); when in doubt, or when there's disagreement, take it to the talk page. After that section, go by genre/media type: Platformers first, since they usually have less quotes, and after that comes Sports, then Spinoffs (including all the random things), then the RPGs (since these are likely to be the big, hefty sections), then the "Non-game appearances", and finally, a Misc. section for commercials ("Mario, Mario, Mario ja nai!" - Peach, NSLU), websites, and other things like that.. Specific series may be given headers, and specific games too, if they produce a large amount of quotes (typically, games sections will be reserved for the RPGs; spinoffs and sports will at least get series headers often, I suspect); otherwise, just put what game each quote is from following the quote All sections should follow the "unsorted" quotes; use chronological order for everything at every level as much as possible. For the non-game appearances, sections can be given for the different shows, movies, publications, etc., or just list them "unsorted" like the games/series with few quotes.

Pretty sure that's everything. But again, the real proposal part's the first paragraph, so if that's all you read, you got the idea.

Proposer: (prompted by  and ) Deadline: August 18, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) - Per me. I've had this idea for years and have been mulling it over in earnest since this proposal happened...
 * 2) Per Walkazo.
 * 3) Seems like a pretty solid proposal. I'll support it! It's a good idea to have a separate page for that because putting a large list on the parent article clutters the place up and takes up too much space which can be bad for people with low bandwidth.
 * 4) Huh, I always thought why didn't we have a separate page of quotes for characters like Mario. That should've been a standard years ago.
 * 5) It's a pain in the ass to look for specific quotes by a certain character by looking in the games. This proposal solves this problem.
 * 6) I was thinking about this myself and I feel it would be better to find quotes if one wanted to find one for a specific character. Per all.
 * 7) - Per Walkazo.  - Exactly Per Walkazo, I thought about this idea when I saw all those construction templates on all quotes pages for many and many years. But she seems that she organized this idea more than me.
 * 8) 100% agree with this, makes it easier to find certain quotes if you don't remember the game, but remember the character.
 * 9) Per proposal.
 * 10) Per Yoshi876.
 * 11) – Per all, I'm sure a lot of people have had this idea in the past.
 * 12) Perfextly understandable, and advantegeous.

Comments
Excuse me, but what about quotes like those? -
 * They should stay in the article. As for Mario characters, you should add the quotes into their page.
 * Cool, should we make a Collab on the forum? -

Disallow Usage of "Per All"
ALLOW USAGE OF PER ALL 0-14

My proposal is simple. It is the disallow of "Per All" sentence in proposal. Instead The voter will need a few seconds to specify the the users.

Example:

1. Users should atleast have sometime reading the proposal before voting. 2. Per User1 3. Some Users may just want to vote, so they be called a participant in proposals.

Instead of: 4. Per All He would say: 4. Per User1 and User3 He doesn't need to say Per User2, because User2 opinion is the same as User1

Proposer: (banned) Deadline: August 20, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Oppose

 * 1) I don't see a good reason for it to be gotten rid of, and it'd be incredibly annoying if lots of users contribute to a proposal each with their own reasons for (dis)agreeing with something and you having to go, Per: User 1, 2, 3, 4 etc. if you agree with all of them.
 * 2) &mdash; Per all... uh, I mean, this is completely unnecessary. Per the user above.
 * 3) per all.
 * 4) If the per all thing is removed, then people who's reason for agreeing/disagreeing with something is already mentioned, those people either can't vote or need to come up with a whole new reason. Agreeing with someone else just makes it easier.
 * 5) This seems to be a needless hassle to be specific on who you're perring when you per all.
 * 6) This is Ridiculous.
 * 7) - Per all. Having to list individuals is tedious and unnecessary, especially if lots of users make points you agree with. "Per all" isn't a cop-out, it's a perfectly valid vote.
 * 8) – The current system is fine, per all.
 * 9) Per all.
 * 10) - Per all.
 * 11) This is preposterous. And additionally, how are you going to deal with users who will persist using "Per all"? Send a Warning? Possibly ban them?
 * 12) Per all. (ha ha)
 * 13) Per Yoshi876, Iggy Koopa Jr...ahhh! Per all!
 * 14) All I can say is...uh...what was that... Oh! Per all!

Comments
Most votes are 'Pers' after all. - @Tail777 They can say Per someone -
 * True, but agreeing with many people isn't a bad thing.
 * Alright, I got it now. I'll withdraw the proposal by tomorrow. Keeping it wouldn't hurt -

Semi-Protect templates
DON'T SEMI-PROTECT THE TEMPLATES 2-6

Recently I have noticed that anons have done stupid things in the templates. Take [|this, for example]. We don't want anons putting fake things in the templates. Or [|what about that?] We don't want them putting DS games in the Wii template either. It may not happen a lot, but it still happens and we don't want it.

Proposer: Deadline: August 21, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per my proposal. I still feel stupid I didn't do this earlier...
 * 2) Per proposal. It does happen and major templates that appear on many pages (such as templates listing games or Paper Mario templates, which appear on every item and recipe page) will change all those pages if the template gets vandalized.

Oppose

 * 1) - Per Megadardery in the comments. A couple bad edits is no reason for blanket protection of the templates: we're more likely to prevent good edits than bad edits from happening.
 * 2) Per Megadardery's comment.
 * 3) A vandal is not so enormous a problem.
 * 4) Template aren't usually targeted by vandals, so I don't think protection is needed.
 * 5) Most of the time the templates are used on so much pages that the mistakes could be quick noticed and reverted.
 * 6) – Per all.

Comments
I got this idea in my mind before, but it is unbelievable to protect all the templates. If we have to protect some, we would protect high usage/complicated templates, mostly like Formatting Templates, Media Templates and Internal Link Templates. However, Navigation Templates, and Infobox Templates should never be protected, because maybe anonymous user finds a problem and tries to fix it. Beside all that, it is still easy to revert any vandal edit, other than complicated templates, because a vandal may make an edit, and another user fix a code somewhere else in the template. So it become hard -but not impossible- to revert it. This is nothing like the last proposal of semi-protecting the Glitches pages, because a vandal may add unreal glitch, which doesn't become hard but almost impossible because we wouldn't know if it is real or not, that is the reason our admins protected them in the first place. -
 * I agree with Megadardery. The glitch lists were protected because they are often a target for vandalism and false info. It's true that anyone can add false information to templates as well, but it only happens once in a while (much less frequently than glitch pages), and are easy enough to revert. –

Make template
DON'T CREATE LICENCE NOR CATEGORY 7-10

Since there is really many 3D games.. and there is too much models on this wiki that is classed as a sprite. So I porpose we create a template for them. I'm not so good with copyrights, but here is an almost a copy from Proposer: Deadline: August 18, 2013, 23:59 GMT Extended: August 25, 2013, 23:59 GMT, September 1, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Create The License and the category

 * 1) They aren't sprites so a separate template for models seems like a good idea to me. Per proposal.
 * 2) If they're different, have different templates. Per proposal.
 * 3) Per all.
 * 4) Models aren't used very often, but it never hurts to have this template. I also disagree with YoshiKong. Creating this template will NOT be redundant and a waste of effort because these licensing templates also create a category for these images to go in. Lumping sprites and models in one category is messy, so this template can solve that problem too.
 * 5) I strongly agree with this. BTW, there is a clear-cut difference between pre-rendered sprites and 3d models.
 * 6) Per LGM
 * 7) Per proposal

Do not create the License nor the category

 * 1) – I have regarded this idea with distaste in the past, where it was first brought up as an idea on a wiki collaboration forum thread. The idea of acknowledging the two kinds within image galleries, I'm completely fine with, mainly because it's a notion which is only needing to be changed once per gallery page, to comply with our policy. However, the fact that y'all are hoping to introduce a copyright license which is already legally covered by, the only difference is a slight nameswap makes this template seem completely redundant, and a waste of effort to incorporate. And I don't agree that every user should be expected to correctly license every sprite/model which gets uploaded, and telling them off/continually correcting them would get excessively pedantic. It would be a lot more logical and save us all this unneeded hassle if we just modified our current sprite template to mention these fancy fashion models. And legally, we'd still be safe (which remember, is the whole point of driving licenses), not exactly keeping up with the latest rad words.
 * 2) Per YoshiKong, he has a valid point. The obvious differences between sprites and models are regardless if they can both be legally classified under the same license. Creating another license to acknowledge these differences is highly superfluous and modifying the existing licence to accompany both sprites and models is the more logical thing to do.
 * 3) - Per YoshiKong, the purpose of licenses is simply to be legally correct.
 * 4) Per all.
 * 5) Per all
 * 6) - I agree with YoshiKong and Tucayo.
 * 7) - Per all.
 * 8) Per all.
 * 9) Per YoshiKong.
 * 10) Per the above :P

Comments
What changes would you suggest to -
 * @YoshiKong: It's not the legal part I'm concerned about. Creating game-model also creates and automatically places a category that neatly places all game models into one page. We could manually add a game model category, but we still have this licensing thing that will lump models with sprites.
 * Or we could call the category "Sprites and Models" but that still requires a ton of work.
 * Yeah, Lot of unneeded work plus it would be still mess. A separate category plus a separate license is the best way to go (in my opinion) -

A writing guideline for Image Maps
WITHDRAWN BY PROPOSER


 * See here for the draft.

This writing guideline is meant to clear everything about Image Maps, when to create them, and basic rules. Everything of what are written in the draft are rules which are already known. A help page will be probably drafted, proposed and created as soon as possible. It will be created under the name Image Maps. Use the comments section below for comments and suggestions.

Proposer:  (lots of help from  appreciated) Deadline: September 13, 2013 23:59 GMT

Comments
"Image Maps are images where different parts of the image link to different pages[...]" Just rewrite that part to something like "Image Maps are images that include points that link to different pages" or something. Just remove the "where" part. It's better written like that. ^^'
 * While I don't like the part 'where', I don't think 'that include points that link to' is the best replacement
 * I don't think so either. I have trouble finding the precise term for things.
 * Would it also be a good idea to show a step-by-step process of creating the thing?
 * As I said: "A help page will be probably drafted, proposed and created as soon as possible." Once I have enough time, I will draft a help page

No APNG Files
REPLACE APNG FILES 12-1

My proposal is simple, getting rid of APNG files (animated PNG files) and replace them with GIF files.

Reasons:
 * The APNG does not show on all browsers (at least without a specific plugin).
 * The APNG editing is harder and request a special program to edit.
 * The APNGs takes more time loading than GIFs
 * Thumbnails of APNGs are not animated.
 * Replacing them with GIFs is easy, and won't loss quality.

Stuff that will get changed/deleted by the passing of this proposal: Proposer: Deadline: September 6, 2013 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal
 * 2) Per proposal
 * 3) Per proposal.
 * 4) Well if it doesn't work for all browsers... obviously yeah.
 * 5) Per proposal.
 * 6) Per all.
 * 7) Until we get the technology available to make non-indexed animated pictures without some sort of special plugin or program, I vote per proposal.
 * 8) Most of the time, they're unnecessary because the different colors required to make it an animated GIF is usually more than enough to make a good, animated sprite. I don't even know why we have these in the first place when a good old-fashioned GIF image would do.
 * 9) Per voter number 8 (LGM)
 * 10) - Per all.
 * 11) - Per all.
 * 12) Per all

Oppose

 * 1) I don't see anything wrong with them, i think they are helpful sometimes.

Comments
@Randombob-omb4761 Like what?

The Template Shuffle
REVISE THE COLOURS AND GROUPINGS

Last year I drafted the colour-coding system for the templates, and now that we've had time to see it in action, I have some revisions, which can be seen in this chart here. Red shows which templates are changing, and I have a list of all the specific changes and the reasons why below the chart, but I'll try to summarize it here:


 * 1) Make spinoffs yellow, sports light green, and Wario purple. Right now, the major character pages have massive blocks of purple and aqua with a few reds, blues and teals, making it look more like a bowl of Skittles than a Mario-themed navigation nexus. I blame myself for somehow forgetting that spinoffs are so numerous, but making them yellow (and the sports green) will make the template blocks a lot more Marioish in colour, plus it'll brighten them up. And purple still works for Wario, so no problem on that end of the swap.
 * 2) Combine SSB with the crossovers. With split up into the separate games, the unique colouration's not necessary anymore, and the suitably similar aqua colour's freed up by the sports recolour, so it works out great.
 * 3) Simplify the Alternate Media and G&W stuff. In hindsight, there's no need to grandfather in the old G&W design: better to just update the template and give it the regular console colours. Similarly, differentiating between the two umbrella media types is unnecessary, and the darker of the two shades is too similar to the Mario games to effectively stand apart anyway.
 * 4) Combine SML with the overall Mario series. Again, this was an unnecessary split, although letting it keep its subseries designation is a good idea, and the old, orange Alt Media header colour fits the bill.

The new chart also has a couple extra subheader colours and a couple tweaked background colours, but that's all pretty minor. What isn't minor is the other half of the proposal, which is the establishment of a colour scheme for all the ex-subpage templates. Quick drafts can be seen here (or just scroll up from the colour chart): as you can see, I'm using the fancy SMB sprite setup that was originally made for the SMB template, and which was too cool to just throw away when the colour-coding system was brought in. I meant to make the subpage template use this design all along, but ran out of time for the first draft of MW:NAV, and only got back around to it now. Anyway, the templates all have the same header and background colours, but I gave different templates different banner colours to jazz things up (all of the colours are based on the backgrounds of SMB: the sky blue default, the underground/castle black, and the underwater blue, plus the one glitchy red background).

I really think these colour changes are an improvement over the first draft, and I think the subpages will look good with these template designs. And I hope you guys agree!

Proposer: Deadline: September 9, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) - Per me. Plus, since the backgrounds are all preset in MediaWiki:Common.css, it'll make the transition easier, and either way, I'll be happy to make all the colour changes myself: I love this kinda template work!
 * 2) - I fully agree. The Super Mario Bros theme is unique and fitting, and it sets us apart from other wikis that don't have cool nav template designs. The color palette is well thought out and makes perfect sense. Awesome work, Per Walkazo.
 * 3) – Per all.
 * 4) - I agree with the proposal (a.k.a Per proposal) I love the new ex-subpage design.
 * 5) Per all.
 * 6) – Well thought out! Per all. (In my opinion, the header color of the exsubpage one don't combine with the banner and background, but, as I said before, it's just my opinion.)
 * 7) Per all
 * 8) Per the above... again...
 * 9) Per proposal, great idea.
 * 10) Per proposal.

Comments
What if we need a sub-header, and we didn't find a color in this table? as the smallest example: Dr. Mario template
 * Then try making one up yourself (save the template and everything)and ask me or another admin to approve it and add it to the chart. Just like with footer colours (which is explained in the last paragraph of this section of MW:NAV). Worst-case scenario is that we might use a slightly different colour instead, but either way, the subheader will get made. -

While going trough some templates, I found, I think it should be merged with game templates, but what about & ?
 * That question's rather tangential to the goals of this proposal... But yeah, Morphs should be merged with the YI/YIDS templates. But as I keep saying on the forums, the Galaxy templates are fine the way they are, with their unique names and designs and whatnot, and I still think we should leave them be. -


 * As you may see, Ultra Koopa changed the color to Mario series' color. Is this design what you meant with 'unique designs'?
 * I meant the old designs (which I've since restored, since there should be discussion before stripping them of their unique and perfectly functional design - which was purposefully left unchanged when the original colour-coding proposal took effect last year). -