Talk:Wart

How was Wart Mentioned In Mario Superstar Baseball?FgFg 20:07, 4 January 2007 (EST)


 * Shy Guy's bio. Read the bio in the Shy Guy article. Paper Jorge

Oh Ok I get it Thanks.--Fg 20:11, 4 January 2007 (EST)

Wtf? Wart Jr? I doubt there is any proof...


 * I've always wondered about "Wart Jr." too. I don't think there is proof, and it seems like the connection is a pretty big stretch in the first place. I moved everything about Wart Jr. to the Trivia for now; it's worth mentioning, but nothing more, really. - 01:52, 17 May 2009 (EDT)

Bros in Arms
Many links and connections state that Wart is Bowser's brother. Is this true?. i think this is true. should i add this in the article? User:MarioMaster720 18.01.2010
 * No, this is speculation and was never confirmed in any game. They don't even belong to the same species. - 15:04, 15 January 2010 (EST)
 * He's more likely prince froggy's father

I would understand if Wart is a "Bowser", or Bowser's frog counterpart. Doesn't they look kind of alike? No, but seriously, are Wart Jr. and Prince Froggy are one of his children? I want a proof.--Prince Ludwig 03:33, 6 March 2011 (EST)

Relationship section
Is there any point to it? Even by the crass standards of the relationship sections, this is one is supremely pointless as Wart is simply a random boss who shows up at the end of one game, is beaten and never interacts with anyone in any meaningful way. Everything in there is useless and far-fetched nonsense. --Glowsquid 08:05, 4 May 2011 (EDT)
 * There doesn't have to be a proposal to remove it, right?
 * No, there doesn't have to be a proposal (if we had to vote for every little thing, we'd never get anything done). Anyway, I agree with Glowsquid: that entire section is pretty awful and should be removed. Relationship sections should only really be used for major characters interacting with other major characters on a regular basis in a significant way (none of which is the case here). - 14:46, 5 May 2011 (EDT)

Ally?
What game did Wart appear as an ally other than the LoZ game?

None

Affiliations
Since the page is protected can anyone add Birdo and Mouser into the Affiliations section of the infobox please?--Yoshidude99 03:38, 7 May 2011 (EDT)

Can anyone understands about Wart and Yoshis? Wart don't have much affilitions on Mousers. The Page is blocked anyway. Hey, like Bowser's relations with the Koopa Troop, I've also tried to add Wart's relationships with the 8 bits, but someone edited the page by removing Yoshis, my informations is lost again. It's about Wart and 8-bits, I'll say it again.--Prince Ludwig 07:32, 7 May 2011 (EDT)
 * The 8-bits aren't really characters, so they wouldn't go in the "Relationships with other characters" section. Red_Yoshi_TTYD.png‎‎ Yoshi  waker  OrangeYoshiTTYD.png 08:25, 7 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Let's keep Wart and the Yoshis. If any other articles allow speculations, despite it's not allowed, we can add infos that aren't more of an issue. I don't see why I'm much of a problem on this article, I can't see why I can't, why shouldn't I add it? It's really disgusting, guys kept on removing the infos, to drive me crazy.--Prince Ludwig 12:36, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * You are wrong. No other article allows speculation. If you could provide examples, I could remove the speculation. It's actually a problem on every article. So we were right to remove that section. Red_Yoshi_TTYD.png‎‎ Yoshi  waker  OrangeYoshiTTYD.png 12:39, 12 May 2011 (EDT)


 * According to users before I joined, BS Super Mario USA is a sequel to Super Mario Bros. 2, because there are Golden Statues of Mario as a thanks for saving Subcon. But it was just a remake of Super Mario Bros. 2. And who said that Mushroom World is the planet where Mario reside? These are speculation too, yet it's allowed to keep them.


 * If I would remove these speculations, that would also be wrong for you, that would be right to remove these speculations because it's not allowed. So, I'm not wrong, neither or you. Nobody are wrong or right. Suggestions are very similar to speculations. And I'd say that Wart knows about the Yoshis.--Prince Ludwig 13:08, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * I believe the info about BS Super Mario USA is unclear since it is only Japanese, so we are unsure of things such as storyline. And of course Mario lives in the Mushroom World; 1. He was born there 2. Most Mario games take place there. You are wrong, because you claimed speculation was allowed. And just because you say Wart knows the Yoshis doesn't mean the game does. Red_Yoshi_TTYD.png‎‎ Yoshi  waker  OrangeYoshiTTYD.png 13:35, 12 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Yeah, you were unsure, so you add that speculation that BS Super Mario USA is the sequel/psuedo sequel after Super Mario Bros. 2 or The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening. Well, duh Mario lives on Mushroom World, it's the greater location of Mushroom Kingdom. The term only existed in Super Mario Bros. 3, it was unclear that it was the planet of Mario. Yet, you clealy says it was the planet of Mario. As for Mushroom Universe, I've never heard about it. I may be wrong saying that speculations are allowed, everybody broke the rules for not adding speculations, there are a lot of speculations allowed in lots of articles without removing them. Please, no "just because this, doesn't mean that" excuses. I know them very well.--Prince Ludwig 13:52, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * Even if we did allow speculation, this information would be useless and really isn't a relationship at all, should Francis have a super long relationship page because he might have information on Princess Peach, Whacka, Petuni, Punio, Vivian, The Yoshi kid, a Bub-ulber, Pennington, NES, GameCube, SNES, a Game Boy, a Virtual Boy, A Tanooki Suit, and Magnus von Grapple?


 * Princess Peach and Toad aren't much of a threat to Wart, since he crossed path with Mario and Luigi the most. Adding them for simply telling that Wart hate them for interfaring with his plans along with Mario is a speculation to me...Wart and Yoshis aren't useless than Wart, Peach and Toad, because it is a much interesting speculation. We also expects Wart meeting Yoshi, hoping to see why Birdo goes to Mario's side. lol--Prince Ludwig 14:27, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * How is that interesting? It's completely useless information to me, and the entire relationship section is a load of crap anyways. Someone already suggested wiping it all out. And, please get it through your head speculation is not allowed, so if another article has speculation in it, then we'll do something about that too. Just because one article is against policy and the rules, doesn't mean you can go forth and add speculation to every article you see.

And get it through your head there are many speculations you are currently keeping. If it's that wrong that you say it is, it's up to you to erase all of these speculations. And somethings tell me you are not a big fan of Mario.--Prince Ludwig 14:48, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * Yes, I hate Mario. I totally do. Show me some of this speculation and I will burn it in a fire.
 * If you hate Mario, forget it. But I'll keep Wart and Yoshi. I said I, of course. If you really want to erase a speculation, start by Mushroom World, let's see if you will...--Prince Ludwig 14:58, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
 * If you want to keep speculation, make your own wiki where it is allowed. and he was being sarcastic. Red_Yoshi_TTYD.png‎‎ Yoshi  waker  OrangeYoshiTTYD.png 14:59, 12 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Mushroom World is in no way speculative at all...

15:04, 12 May 2011 (EDT)

The category has disappeared...Maybe I should restore it. Nah, I guess we should keep it like it, I think it's fair enough. At least, the guy would have kept Mario or Birdo. :( --Prince Ludwig 11:11, 14 May 2011 (EDT)

King Wart Mamu
Should Wart's full name be King Wart Mamu, since most of the chatacters' japanese name turned to be their family name? Like Bowser's name is Koopa.--Prince Ludwig 15:38, 17 May 2011 (EDT)
 * No, Mamu is the name given to Wart in Japan. It's not a surname. In Japan, Koopa is not a surname either; he is just King Koopa because his Japanese name is only Kuppa.

Wart based on Kaerus
I see...Even in enlish, Mamu is spelled "Mamou". Is Wart actually based on a fictional かえる kaeru? It means frog. But most of ficional frogs in video games are based on Japanese frogs. Because they have white belly.--Prince Ludwig 16:00, 17 May 2011 (EDT)

Remove The Zelda-series appearances of Wart from the article (and gallery)
First off this is a Mario wiki and we talk only about the Mario series and the info we include should talk only of the Mario series appearances, not other series like zelda - they have their own wiki you know. And also counts the pictures that show (artworks and screenshots). This kind of info can be added to the trivia section or taken to the Game References.

No
I don't think so. Wart's appearance in that game is rather official than a cameo. Mario series has link to other games. If it is a Mario wiki, Solid Snake wouldn't appear here. His appearance in Zelda series makes since in a different way. He wouldn't stay and reside in Subcon after being hated by the Subcons and the rest of the inhabitants after his invasion in the world. So Wart went to Koholint land. You said it's a Mario Wiki. It is linked to other series and it doesn't have any Zelda articles yet because Link didn't appear in a Main Mario Game.--Prince Ludwig 01:32, 30 May 2011 (EDT)
 * That's speculation, though. It is simply a cameo and nothing more. 01:37, 30 May 2011 (EDT)
 * No it isn't. That's not speculation. It would have words similar to "may". It's not a cameo appearance. It's cameo to you because of a Non-Mario Zelda game. BS Super Mario USA would have been speculation. Now it isn't because it would make sense that Wart returns to steal statues of his nemesis, Mario.--Prince Ludwig 01:46, 30 May 2011 (EDT)
 * "Make sense" is the part that shows it is speculation: unless you can say it is a 100% proven fact confirmed directly by Nintendo that he is there because he needed to escape from Subcon, then your point is moot and you are simply speculating that he moved there because of that. Also, from the way you worded your first post, it seems you don't even understand our wiki's coverage policy or anything of the sort. So, please, go read up and come back when you know what you are talking about (no offense intended; trying to debate what we cover when you do not know our coverage policy isn't too grand). 09:37, 30 May 2011 (EDT)
 * See? BS Super Mario USA is a speculative information. I was right. I said makes sense about he would come back for revenge by stealing the Mario statues. It was never a sequel or psuedo-sequel in the first place. So I'll remove it. And how would he escape Subcon? I said after his punishment, he went to Koholing Island. Read correctly before telling something I've never did and never wrote in the first place. Even I do or don't understand the Policy, you didn't totally understand what I wrote and you're keep on talking like I wrote it first before Coincollector came out of nowhere. What users removed aren't what I wrote or meant. And it wasn't a CAMEO appearance, I keep telling users that this game was linked to Mario and other games. Sorry, I'm mad of course.--Prince Ludwig 18:00, 30 May 2011 (EDT)

Shoot, didn't have you deal with this? At least I should understand that you didn't write this, but keeping the info makes you to get involved in these problems. Also, this a Legend of Zelda Game, is not a crossover or something of this kind like Super Smash Bros or Mario & Sonic. They are recurrent characters, not protagonists of the series. Your way to deduce Wart escaped from subcon is irrelevant and speculative so stop insisting, or else a block period will give you time to think of it. -- 18:47, 30 May 2011 (EDT)
 * Am I speaking chinese? Where did I wrote that Wart escaped Subcon? Where? I said, after getting defeated (I said punished, yeah I did), he went to Koholint Island. Yeah, I kept the infos, but most of the users were involved with the edits, and they said nothing until Coincollector came over. Link's Awakening is a Zelda Game, so what? It has Mario enemies and the have the antagonist of the Mario series, Wart. He also appeared there. You guys always act like other series shouldn't be involved, linked or connected to Mario because you don't want them to like they are inferior or something. Why do you guys always act when I'm peacefully editing the info kept for 4 years?


 * And can I ask you one thing. Should I really remove the speculative and unconfirmed infos from BS Super Mario USA?--Prince Ludwig 19:01, 30 May 2011 (EDT)

Because, for your first question, that's irrelevant for the article - even some of the info wast taken from the zeldawiki - how orginels, eh?. And two, that depends if there is no references that reaffirm the facts.


 * Tell me something. Are you actually saying that the article doesn't have to get infos of what he was doing in another world from Zelda? Are you sure it doesn't take place after the events of Super Mario Bros. 2? I'm waiting for your answer.--Prince Ludwig 19:19, 30 May 2011 (EDT)

No, because Wart never states that.


 * No? So it doesn't take place after that game, but it doesn't change the facts it doesn't have to have infos of what happened in Koholint Island. I did tried to write more and more infos. Well, of course Wart don't have to state that because he's in a new world without his army where he was doing nothing evil when he's still evil. If he states that he was evil, the world would have known that and Link would have fought him. If it wasn't after Super Mario Bros. 2, that appearance is still not much of a cameo. And you didn't have to remove all of that info and kept the ones that were really true.


 * Coincollector, I'm about to remove the infos that tells that BS Super Mario Bros. USA is the sequel/psuedo sequel after Super Mario Bros. 2 or Link's Awakening. Please tell me if it's wrong or not. If it does start the third war (I know you're aware of this), please try to notice I was trying to do what was right and good for the wiki if speculation is really that bad to keep in the Wikia.


 * "Wart somehow appeared in a dream world, Koholint Island. Wart resides in the pond beneath the Signpost Maze, with his two frogs. In this game, Link managed to meet the tyrannical frog, who introduces himself to the hero, then asks him to listen to his "unreleased cut" for 300 Rupees. By accepting it, he will teach Link the third and final song to play on his Ocarina (which opens the way to the last two dungeons), known as the Frog's Song of Soul. After learning the last song, Wart then tells Link that if he plays this song, he will make everything around him feel more alive. Afterwards, Wart can no longer be revisited again, as he and his Frog Choir are away on tour, according to the sign outside of the pond."


 * That is what you should have kept. You didn't have to remove all of them and tell that was a cameo.--Prince Ludwig 19:46, 30 May 2011 (EDT)

No, that's irrelevant. Be careful what you're gonna do now with the SMB USA.

Random interjection. First, I know that we aren't the Zelda Wiki, but I'd like to say that as far as we cover Zelda, we should be accurate with respect to the Zelda series. Now, any attempt to connect the two games in some sort of "Wart's timeline" is folly, given that within the Zelda series, the dream world is the dream of a character (actually a giant fish). So listing such theories as fact rather than as what it just is - speculation. Now, Zelda Wiki's only comment on Wart appearing in Mario and Zelda is in a trivia reference. It is my belief that they handled this situation correctly, and that we should do likewise.


 * You are currently explaining to us that Subcon, Koholint Island are only a dream. No, they aren't only a dream. It is just wrong. Birdo wouldn't appear again. Wart is a character too. Or rather, they do exist on Mario's world but possibly appeared in Subcon by sleeping, which is what I suggest. You know what a link is? The greater location of all dream worlds can allow other to travel from world to world. But that doesn't exist and speculative. However, it's possible but I don't know.


 * You guys keep on talking like Wart don't exist because he only (until now) reside in dream worlds. That's very wrong to think that. He also went to the Mushroom Kingdom in the Nintendo Comics too you know.--Prince Ludwig 20:27, 30 May 2011 (EDT)


 * I didn't say anything about Subcon. I do know, however, that Koholint Island is the dream of the Wind Fish and Wart appears there as a character that teaches Link a useful song. That's it. There's no comment to suggest that he has some sort of timeline or anything. My beef is with the attempt to put the two series into one timeline for the character. I don't see why it couldn't be some character that uses the same sprite put in there as a cameo, just like how Chain Chomps and Goombas appear as enemies in Link's Awakening. There doesn't have to be some connection between the two series on a timeline for the character. Otherwise, we are going to have to assume that Malon saw a picture of Bowser or saw him or something, and Bowser made it into Hyrule and we have to put that on Bowser's article. See my point? Cameo =/= link between two series on a character's timeline.


 * "I don't see why it couldn't be some character that uses the same sprite put in there as a cameo"? You can't see that is undoubtly Wart renamed in his japanese name Mamu? It's already settled that the game doesn't take place after Super Mario Bros. 2. It doesn't change the facts the character can have infos of what he was doing since then, despite it wasn't a Mario game. Donkey Kong have his Wiki, but still have infos here in a Mario Wiki. Which is what we call "unfair".


 * By the way, Coincollector, I finally found the proof that BS Super Mario USA takes place after the events of Super Mario Bros. 2. I've made a mistake then.--Prince Ludwig 20:49, 30 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Okay, well, all the Mario enemy cameos have their proper names in Link's Awakening, but we don't bother posting unconfirmed speculation on those articles. I guess the Wind Fish must have seen a picture of a Goomba somewhere, because it has to have some connection to the Mario universe someway... Even if it uses the same name, that doesn't mean it is the same character. The game doesn't "take place" in any relative position to SMB2, it takes place in a completely different universe. See Coverage if you want to complain about our coverage in general.

Even if it doesn't mean that it isn't him, that frog is undoubtly Wart. So are you saying like, just because that's a Goomba, doesn't mean that's a Goomba?--Prince Ludwig 21:12, 30 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Undoubtedly him? Where in any Nintendo-licensed media has this been given evidence? Even if it is him, that still doesn't mean he had to have a timeline for being in the Wind Fish's dream. As for the Goomba, that was sarcasm. It looks like a Goomba, attacks like a Goomba, dies like a Goomba, etc. It is a Goomba, but that doesn't mean that a Goomba named Geff walked through some magic portal to Hyrule and the Wind Fish saw him and had a dream about them. It's nothing more than a Goomba, who made a cameo in a Zelda game. Just the same as we treat all other cameos, it's an interesting tidbit that enhances the article, but should be covered in more detail on a different wiki.


 * Since Coincollector said that Link's Awakening doesn't take place after the events on Subcon, we don't know what the timeline is. It is not about the timeline, it's about what he did. Wart was renamed as Mamu, his japanese name since Dream Factory: Heart-Pounding Panic. His appearance isn't a cameo I keep telling that. Of course you know that.--Prince Ludwig 22:34, 30 May 2011 (EDT)

No matter how he did or has been traited, his role in the game is as minor as other supporting characters in that game so I don't want more info placed the article. In other words it's just a cameo and cannot be another thing. As for Bop1996's to put in the trivia, I'm not sure. If it were in that way, we need to trait the other cameos in the same way, but that goes to overuse the trivia section, so, that move is not recommendable. Again, I don't want conjectures or theories here, specially you Prince Ludwig. I'm getting tired of that.


 * It's not a cameo I keep telling you it's not. Even if it was, other characters also has that except for Link's Awakening, but these Mario enemies are "species" and Wart is a character so he could have more infos. If Wart made a cameo appearance, he wouldn't be really that important as it was written, even his artwork wouldn't be made. I wanted more infos in there. You first came over by removing the galleries of Wart in Link's Awakening, you guys now say it shouldn't contain more infos because it's a Mario Wiki only (remove Donkey Kong and Sonic series if they had their own wikia) and it's a cameo (it is not a cameo). The rest of the info were not speculative, yet you claimed that it wasn't after Super Mario Bros. 2, you should have removed the Super Mario Bros. 2 part then and kept it, I wouldn't invert your edit but talked to you.


 * I'm tired of being told that it's wrong to contain more infos of characters of what they were doing since it was not speculation. It wasn't much of a bigger issue and doesn't hurt. Donkey Kong and Sonic shouldn't be there, but they are related. Zelda is sometimes being linked to Mario, sometimes...--Prince Ludwig 04:21, 31 May 2011 (EDT)

My answer is still no, that info can be seen in the zeldawiki. And don't compare Sonic and Donkey Kong with this. Sonic has a different trait here and Donkey Kong has been part of our coverage before the other wikis joined.


 * Ugh, darn it. The "Sonic has a different trait here" is an excuse.--Prince Ludwig 10:26, 31 May 2011 (EDT)

No it isn't. With the time, Sonic has gained protagonism in the crossover games he has appeared, unlike Wart has got. -- 13:17, 31 May 2011 (EDT)


 * Well of course! Sonic is a protagonist and Wart is an antagonist. You'd said that you remove it because it was speculation, since you guys find out it was not, now it's a different reason. Because it's a Zelda game and it's a Mario Wiki.--Prince Ludwig 20:46, 31 May 2011 (EDT)
 * And we don't cover Zelda games so this is a perfectly valid reason.

A detailed example...
For Prince Ludwig, that he seems not to get the reasons of my edits, this will be thorough and detailed explanation whose purpose is to end your complains about Wart's cameo appearance:

The original info from past revisions says this...

Wart made another third appearance in the game The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening, this time as a supporting character instead of an antagonist of the game, although here he is only referred to by his Japanese name, Mamu. However, he is actually very helpful to the player in the game. The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening takes place after the events in the world of Subcon, as the sequel of Super Mario Bros. 2 for Wart.

After his punishment in the predecessor, Wart was exiled to another dream world, Koholint Island. Where he seemingly was doing nothing evil, Wart resides in the pond beneath the Signpost Maze, with his two frogs. In this game, Link managed to meet the tyrannical frog, who introduces himself to the hero, then asks him to listen to his "unreleased cut" for 300 Rupees. By accepting it, he will teach Link the third and final song to play on his Ocarina (which opens the way to the last two dungeons), known as the Frog's Song of Soul. After learning the last song, Wart then tells Link that if he plays this song, he will make everything around him feel more alive. Afterwards, Wart can no longer be revisited again, as he and his Frog Choir are away on tour, according to the sign outside of the pond.

As you can see, the text has some highligts to indicate some meanings to the statements in the text:
 * The text tagged in yellow means speculation, the mariowiki doesn't approves that kind of information. TLOZLA is not a sequel of SMb2, who the heck said that? even Wart never states that, so forget it, this junk and need to go.
 * The text tagged in red is official information, but it's like a walkthrough of another game, TLOZLA, as the wiki doesn´t cover TLOZ games here, this should go as well, this is junk for the wiki.
 * The text tagged in blue is redundance, not needed either, duh!

As you can see, there is visual reason that you can understand, more direct, more defined, made to avoid you complains that I'm changing the topic in this discussion. Additionally, this link shows what I'm talking of controling the info regarding to the Mariowiki's coverage. Last, although this does not support at all my other former reasons, Wart is a recurrent character in TLOZLA, he is not protagonist, and is not antagonist either, just a Mario character that he has made a CAMEO in the game like the others from the Mario series. Why cameo? you say (always) because he is only seen in a moment, where you talk with him to give you something. after he gave you that thing he is never seen.

With this, I conclude my reasons why we shouldn't keep this information, because I'm doing the correct, as other articles have because they follow the guidelines. as for you, Prince Ludwig, with this you now have to have understood clearly. If you admit it you were wrong undoing my edits (and I'm not counting that you wrote this, because I've realised that you didn't), I'll forget this discussion while you'll be in need to learn of our policies here to avoid this kind of nonsenses that are in fact quite easy to understand and quick to sort them out.