Talk:Pokey

Re: Toothies
Sonce they're technically a subspecies of Pokey, shouldn't they get a mention on this page, or am I wrong? --Lord Grammaticus (talk) 04:36, 19 February 2013 (EST)

Split Green Pokey enemy from the Yellow one
SPLIT 1-6-2

Green Pokey needs to be separated from the yellow one. In Paper Mario: Sticker Star, it has different stat, it has a different color and cannot be jumped on that differentiates from the yellow one, I think this is enough to be able to have its own page. So, why not? If you want, I can add information on the new article for Super Mario Bros. 2 since the green one appears in, maybe they are a subspecies.

Proposer: Deadline: April 5, 2015, 23:59 GMT.

Support (With Super Mario Bros. 2)

 * 1) They look and act the same, and the green Pokeys of SMB2 also can be jumped on, unlike the yellow pokeys of modern games. The jumping property is the main differentiator, so yeah. And for spliting in general, per proposal.

Support (Without Super Mario Bros. 2)

 * 1) In the original games, it's the same enemy. But in Sticker Star, it's a case of RPG-ness, where they have different stats and whatnot, so only the Sticker Star version of the "Green Pokey" should be split.
 * 2) Per my proposal. Change my vote, per SuperYoshiBros.
 * 3) Per SuperYoshiBros.
 * 4) Per all! This is a good idea.
 * 5) Different stats and a stompable factor I feel meet separate article requirements. Per all.
 * 6) Different stats, yeah. Like Gritty Goomba (Gwarhar Lagoon) and Gritty Goomba (Teehee Valley) being separate, these two should be separate. But in Super Mario Bros. 2, tit's just a different design of the enemy.

Oppose

 * 1) Pokeys pretty much look different in every game they appear in, should every design be split? Besides, we don't have the different colored Koopas split, and they look and act differently, and give Yoshi different abilities in SMW. As I've said before, there's a difference between a variant and a species.
 * 2) I'm leaning towards overall oppose. As noted below, we've had instances of green Pokeys with traits of yellow ones, so I wouldn't be on board with the first option. In Sticker Star, the variants have the same names and are found in the same areas almost interchangeably, so my impression is that it's a cute tribute to its origins rather than a serious attempt at separating them. As Walkazo mentioned, splitting both probably wouldn't be a good idea in the long run, but I don't quite see the rationale of splitting one of them from only one section out of the main article... Maybe in the future if there are more reasons to reconsider it, but not as things stand right now.

Comments
Are we talking about splitting the Sticker Star enemies in their own articles, or entirely moving the green one away from the standard yellow Pokey? LinkTheLefty (talk) 19:31, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * If you want splitting the Sticker Star enemies in their own articles, you choose Support (Without Super Mario Bros. 2), if you want entirely moving the green one away from the standard yellow Pokey, choose Support (With Super Mario Bros. 2), if you don't want them separate at all, choose Oppose. I hope this will help you. -- 19:37, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * What about the SMBSS cartoon Pokey based on SMB2? And would still be used for the SMB2 section here (and the cartoon appearance as well if it's to be moved)? I feel like that'd be best for navigation and comprehensive coverage, seeing as the enemy originated as the green type... -  19:43, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * There's also the green (well, sort of) Pokey from Mario Clash, which has a nearly identical appearance as its SMB2 counterpart but also can't be jumped on, as well as the Pinball Land Pokey which is also green but has a more modern flower and thick spikes rather than plain body and bare head. Would those be considered the SMB2/SMBSS Pokey as well? I don't know - there's probably a desire to at least do something with Sticker Star due to the differing stats, but it seems better to leave SMB2 and other games out of it since it may otherwise be a bit convoluted... LinkTheLefty (talk) 20:10, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * I know the green one appear in others games, but I only put Super Mario Bros. 2 because this is their first appearance and to simplify that instead of naming all games they appear in.-- 21:00, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * Okay, so it looks like the idea of the second option is to split the green variety in particular from the Sticker Star section into its own article. Rather than leaving a "main" color in the article, why not alternatively place both the yellow and green Sticker Star Pokey into another article (or possibly two separate ones)? That way, preference is avoided towards a specific color as the "real" Pokey. LinkTheLefty (talk) 22:55, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
 * Splitting both would set a bad precedent for dealing with cross-genre appearances: next might come arguments to split the "bad" PM enemy Koopas from the non-sunglasses-wearing NPC Koopas, etc. Generally, it's best to keep things centralized unless there's a clear disjunct for some of the appearances (or if there's so much variation in names and depictions that it's easiest just to keep things separate). Another problem with Pokey is that the SMBSS appearance, while SMB2-based, is still unique, and some appearances swap out the head horns for a flower, so it's a slippery slope of how different is different enough to split over. Right now, the only thing beyond inter-appearance variable aesthetics is that the green and yellow Pokey appeared simultaneously in a single game, with different stats and slightly different abilities (one can be stomped one is resistant): to me, intra-appearance variation is a pretty big deal. However, the lack of separate names to go with the two major designs is a major knock against splitting: usually, we have at least one name to justify the case-by-case judgement-based splits, although there are some exceptions already (namely, the M&L:SS enemies, such as the current Gritty Goomba TPP), so it's not like splitting the green and yellow Pokeys would be an absolute paradigm-shift. And the more I think about it, the more I think it should definitely be all or nothing. - 13:33, 23 March 2015 (EDT)