MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/6



Abbreviation Pages
NO SUCH PAGES 5-4

I feel this should be added for begginers. I am proposing that abreviations commonly used in this Wiki should have their own page. It took me 2 months to find out what NPC means. If this does not happen, then I propose instead that we change all abreviations not used in games to be changed to what they really mean.

{{scroll box|content = Proposer: {{User:Jaffffey/sig}} Deadline: January 24, 2008, 17:00

Support

 * 1) Orangeyoshi I agree, because I'm new! I want to be able to learn things like that.
 * 2) But only as redirects to their entries on the glossary, 'k?
 * 3) Walkazo - Per Stumpers.
 * 4) Per the one who Stumps.

Oppose

 * 1) This is Super Mario Wiki, not Abbreviation Wiki. There may be people who do not know what "NPC" means, but we cannot explain everything (which we would have to do if we made articles on abbreviations). And where's the problem in searching Wikipedia for NPC? It does not take 2 months, it takes 2 seconds. Er, per Cobold. (I didn't know about that Glossary page, which is indeed a good place for explaining these abbreviations.)
 * 2) - That's exactly what the Glossary is for.
 * 3) - Per Cobold.
 * 4) Per Cobold
 * 5) Per Cobold

Comments
Don't forget to vote on your owm proposal! Anyway, abreviations are annoying but I disagree with your secondary suggestion to cut them out if this translation-page proposal doesn't fly. One major problem people might have will be "canon vs. fanon" slang, but the page could always be divided into those respective sections... I dunno, I have to think about this one. - Walkazo

What's about a List of Abreviations used on the Mariowiki? Ah, didn't see the Glossary. --Blitzwing 17:14, 17 January 2008 (EST)

Orangeyoshi That would work too! I just want someplace to learn the abbreveations. By the way, what does NPC mean?
 * Non Player Character, Characters that appear in a game, but that you can't play as. Those are mainly enemies or generic towns-people in the RPG games. --Blitzwing 18:19, 17 January 2008 (EST)

Can't we do what Stumpers suggested and redirect abrieviations to their glossary entries? 16:16, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * Would be possible if they had entries in the glossary in the first place, which is currently not the case. - 16:17, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * Cobold: I can help there. So, what abbreviations are we talking about?  Just list 'em out and then I can take care of 'em all at once.  18:19, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * Well, NPC for starters. I guess RPG is we wanna be thorough. What other abbreviations do we use a lot (besides things like SMB for Super Mario Bros. 'cuz those can simply be redirected to the actual game pages)? - Walkazo
 * They should be in the glossary as well, but I would redirect 'em to the actual game page, because the glossary will just say, "An achronym for Super Mario Bros., usually the game rather than the movie." 21:31, 18 January 2008 (EST)

Orangeyoshi 16:56, 20 January 2008 (EST) Cobold is right. "NPC" isn't in the glossary. I wouldn't know what it means unless Blitzwing told me.

STUMPERS' LIST OF ABREVIATIONS TO ADD: NPC, RPG, Bros.(everyone: feel free to add more!)

Orangeyoshi 20:53, 23 January 2008 (EST) Wait, I thought Time Q, Walkazo and I figured out that "per" wasn't wiki slang. Should it be in the glossary? It still could be... but I don't think we need it.
 * Ok. I removed it... per Orangeyoshi.  16:18, 24 January 2008 (EST)

Ya just said it again! Or did you do that on purpose? Orangeyoshi 19:56, 24 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yup, I was messing with you ;D 20:07, 24 January 2008 (EST)

}}

Merge of the same stages/courses into one article and split the the different ones
NO MERGE 9-4

I propose to merge the various courses from the spin-off series that have their own articles. This also goes for those who have appeared in main games before, and only have changed layouts, with (almost) identical names. One great example of this is Bowser's Castle from the main-games which has individual pages for the stages named Bowser('s) Castle in Mario Kart and even the Bowser Castle stadium in Mario Superstar Baseball while the Bowser Castle-stage for Itadaki Street DS is STILL in the main-game's article of Bowser's Castle.

I also propose to split the pages that have two or more entirely different stages in the same article, mostly the Super Smash Bros. stages, such as the article with the original's and Melee's Mushroom Kingdom, two ENTIRELY different stages. Well, you may think "But they have the same name and design!" No, they don't. All stages based on Super Mario Bros. would have that design and the Melee versions is called Mushroom: Kingdom, with "Mushroom" being the stage location and "Kingdom" the name.

(BTW, I is not neutral to English and this is the first time I propose so if anything is spelled wrong or wrong in any other way, feel free to edit this.)

{{scroll box|content = Proposer: KingMario

Deadline: January 26, 2008, 20:00

EDIT 20/01: Looks like i forgot the idea to add a category in which users can support one idea only.

Support

 * 1) Blitzwing Per KingMario.
 * 2) King Boo Per King Mario.
 * 3) RedFire Mario Per KingMario
 * 1) RedFire Mario Per KingMario

Oppose

 * 1) I like your second idea, not so much the first.  I wouldn't think you'd want to combine an article about a race track in a city and the city itself, would you?  Bowser's Castle is larger than most cities in the Mario series, so...  I wouldn't think that you'd want to combine these based on the fact that they have the same name.  Oh, and remember that we have articles on individual rooms in Luigi's Mansion?  We've already combined the clearly different racetracks, so at this point it'd be like making the article about the individual Toad a sub-portion of the article about his species.  Remember, we even split the Mr. E article (two minor subjects w/ same name = two articles). Merging is only applicable when you have minor subjects with different names, not major subjects with the same name.
 * 2) huntercrunch Per Stumpers.
 * 3) - Per Stumpers. Bowser's Castle isn't the same castle in most games, anyway. It is a place in Super Mario World, a flying building in Paper Mario and a Bowser-Statue-formed Battleship in Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga.
 * 4) Walkazo - Per Stumpers.
 * 5) Nay to the First, Yea to the second. Per Stupers, in other words.
 * 6) Per Stumpers.
 * 7) Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; They're totally different courses, so why merge? Also, per Stumpers.
 * 8) Per Stumpers
 * 1) Per Stumpers

Comments
Are you gonna vote, KM?
 * I'm split. No to the first, yes to the second. Where do I put my vote? O_o
 * If we're merging areas in the spin-off games with the main games, than shouldn't the same be done for Super Smash Bros. stages? Your argument about how they're different places is valid, however the same could be said for al the other spin-off places (i.e. MSB's Bowser Castle stadium is certainly not the same as the Castle he actually lives in). Also, the individual stages of most games (except more obscure games like the Japanese-only Itadaki Street DS) already have articles and not all of them have corresponding main-game areas, so it's going to be difficult acting on this Proposal. Then there's the other option of cramming all these odd-ball stages together into lists of stages for each game, which would also have links to the main-game artciles for the stages that were merged in that fashion. It's a very big and daunting undertaking, but I still don't want to vote against it, since if it's done right it could be beneficial... Walkazo

InfectedShroom, you may want to put your vote in oppose so that the proposal doesn't go through? If you don't you might lose both of your arguments. 13:02, 21 January 2008 (EST)
 * I think we should split this proposal into two different ones, people's votes shouldn't be influenced by only offering one rating on two different issues. - 13:05, 21 January 2008 (EST)
 * Stumpers: You have a point. Thank you.

}}

Snifit or Snufit?
DON'T MERGE 9-3

Note: Message is edited from Talk:Snufit

So, um, according to TMK, these guys' Japanese names are exactly the same as a normal Snifit's. On top of that, i and u are right next to each other on most English keyboards. They look nearly identical (especially in the remake, which makes almost all enemies look more like their traditional forms), and, floating aside, act identical as well--and the originals could jump and hover for a short time anyway. And this very wiki says that they were "accidentally" referred to as Snifits in one of the MPs anyway.... Considering all that, can we really say that they're intended to be different enemies? I'd suggest a merge.

{{scroll box|content =Proposer: Dazuro and Knife Deadline: 26 January, 2008, 20:00

Keep as Snufit

 * 1) Walkazo - See comment below.
 * 2) - Per below.
 * 3) Tykyle - Per all
 * 4) Any name change deserves notation as a separate subject.
 * 5) Isn't there the Boo Guy article?
 * 6) Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; It's a sub species of Snifit, or at least it seems like it. While it might be a mistake that they were referred to as "Snufit", we still have no proof that it WAS a mistake.
 * 7) There completely different.
 * 1) Paper Jorge ( Talk&middot;Contributions)&middot; It's a sub species of Snifit, or at least it seems like it. While it might be a mistake that they were referred to as "Snufit", we still have no proof that it WAS a mistake.
 * 2) There completely different.

Merge to Snifit

 * 1) Dazuro - Per above. Per below.  Per common sense.  Per logic.  And, most importantly, per the designers' own designation!
 * 2) Blitzwing - The fact that they were refered to as Snifit in Mario Party kind ofp oint out to the fact that those things are infact Snifit. I think the proposer could be more polite and reasonable, thought.
 * 3) Per the above guys. HyperToad

Comments
They're different species, but I do see what you're getting at with your arguments on the talk page. I agree that it's strange how Koopa Troopas started out quardrupedial and are now totally different but retain the same name. If it were up to me, the 4-legged ones would be called Shellcreepers and only the anthropormorphic turtles would be Troopas, but it's not up to me, it's up to Nintendo, and they say they're all Koopa Troopas. It's the same case with the Paratroopas: they're just Koopa Troopas with wings, but they've been given different names so we have to say they're different species, and the same goes for Snifits and Snufits. Of course, I'd still want to list Paratroopas as their own species (or at least sub-species) anyway, since they look and act different from Koopa Troopas, which are the main criteria for determining species in biology (aside from genetics, which doesn't really apply here as this is the fictional Marioverse where DNA means squat and anything can happen, including a species getting its wings knocked off and magically turning into another species). Maybe Snifits and Snufits were meant to be the same thing, but they're not. They act and look different, just like the two kinds of Koopa Troopas, and just like Paratroopas and Troopas; but like the latter, they got seperate names. It doesn't matter if it was a typo, Nintendo has spoken and we're obligated to follow it. - Walkazo

I just want to point out that if this proposal pass, we should also perhap split the Super Mario World Goomba from the Goomba article since they act differently and haves a different name in the Japanese localisation, which is kinda the opposite of this "Snifit = Snufit?" deal. --Blitzwing 12:22, 20 January 2008 (EST)

Exactly. Whether NoA screwed up the localization or not, they were designed as the same characters (Snifit example) and different characters (Goomba example), and we should respect that. I mean, come on--Bloopers were known as Bloobers in a few games, but we aren't rushing to make new pages for those! You say it's up to Nintendo, Walkazo--well, Nintendo says they're the same. Just because NoA typoed doesn't change that fact. Dazuro 13:14, 20 January 2008 (EST)
 * Your Blooper example doesn't work: Blooper and Blooper look and act exactly the same way. Snufit and Snifit are obliviously different (If similar) creature, beside, we are an english-speaking wiki, I think it make sense to follow the American localisation. --Blitzwing 13:17, 20 January 2008 (EST)


 * Come on. The Japanese creators of a Japanese game say they're the same species. The American translators change one easily-typoed letter, be it by accident or otherwise, and redesign them even less drastically than others that remain the same species. They then proceed to call them by the "other species"'s name even in American publications. Where's the logic in saying they're different? There is not a single argument for keeping it Snufit that doesn't apply to dozens of other changes you never questioned. The American localization has screwed up in the past.  We don't follow those mistakes.  What makes this one different?  Dazuro 13:19, 20 January 2008 (EST)
 * The difference between this case and Pakkun Flower (which is a half-translated Piranha Plant), is that Snufits actually look different and have different abilities (flying). So as there is already an official name for this sub-species, we should use it. Because these are a sub-species, not regular Snifits. - 13:26, 20 January 2008 (EST)
 * NoJ says otherwise. Dazuro 15:19, 20 January 2008 (EST)
 * I was not referring to the name, but the appearance. Check again. - 08:10, 21 January 2008 (EST)
 * And your point is? NoJ says they're the same species.  NoJ designed them.  NoA may have said they're the same species with a minor typo, or they may have been foolish enough to try to make a new species out of something that's clearly not supposed to be so.  Either way, what's the point?  Every single creature in 64 that I can think of except the goombas changed in some major way from their previous selves.  "It isn't like the old snifits" is NOT a valid argument unless you're completely blind to all forms of common sense and pattern recognition.  There is not a single reason to say it's different--except for a ONE-KEY-OVER LETTER, which was later corrected anyway!  You people are being completely irrational! Dazuro 14:26, 21 January 2008 (EST)


 * Keep a cool head. Anyway, do they fix this typo in SM64DS? If not, then they were meant to be a separate species. If they did, then they are Snifits. Either way, I think their official name in SM64DS should be the deciding factor here. 15:49, 21 January 2008 (EST)


 * It should be noted that, even when they are called Snifits, the "Snufits" are a sub-species nethertheless. They just have features regular Snifits don't, or better the other way round, they are lacking Snifit bodies. They are a subspecies, it is just the question whether they have an official name. The Bloober <-> Blooper example doesn't really fit here because of that. - 16:09, 21 January 2008 (EST)


 * Cobold, you're entirely missing my point. Every enemy in SM64 has features they didn't before, so that is NOT a valid argument. Knife, are they ever even named ingame?  And I'd keep a cool head if these people would stop acting so ridiculously dense. -_- But hey, what do I know?  I'm only following the original creators' obvious-as-(censored)intentions, after all. Sheesh... Dazuro 19:39, 21 January 2008 (EST)

Okay, so having looked at SM64DS's revamped model (it has a TAIL!), it's clearly intended as a subspecies. This, however, does not prove anything. After all, was not Bubba turned into a different species (Big Bertha, IIRC?) for the DS one? Yet we still have the Bubba article for the original game's sake. So, while it seems that 64's Snifits were apparently retconned into Snufits, they were Snifits in the original game. Dazuro 19:49, 21 January 2008 (EST)
 * Well.. if you look at this image [[Image:Snufit.jpg]] they do look pretty different from normal Snifit, they don't even have feets! --Blitzwing 17:58, 22 January 2008 (EST)
 * Right, and any self-respecting biologist knows that an animal without feet is not the same as an animal with feet. I like your Goomba point too, SMW Goombas don't look like any other Goombas, but like bipedial/quadrupedial Koopa Troopas I thought that since they have the same name we're stuck saying they're the same species, however if they have different Japanese names I say we should split the article. Besides, we don't just have to go by names, we can still use common sence where we can. Like with the Koopalings: Ludwig Von Koopa and Kooky Von Koopa have different names, but we know they're about the same person and therefore we only have one article for them/him. And Dazuro, no swearing. - Walkazo}}