MarioWiki:Proposals

List of talk page proposals

 * Either rename Duke, Lulu and Rockman to The Dino Riders or split the three characters into separate articles. (discuss) Deadline: September 18, 2016, 23:59 GMT
 * Move Fred (boss) to . (discuss) Deadline: September 24, 2016, 23:59 GMT

Writing guidelines
None at the moment.

New features
None at the moment.

Removals
None at the moment.

Allow certain implied sections to be split from the "List of implied ..." articles
(To absolutely clarify the term, something that is "implied" is an entity that has not made any physical appearances, but has been mentioned by another character or in a text; we generally also cover the implied subjects that are worth covering.)

A while back, a proposal was made about a bunch of articles that were mostly fluff mixed with speculation. To clean up the wiki while not having a lapse in our coverage, the various "List of implied" lists were created. These include characters, entertainment, events, items, locations, organizations, people, and species (the last two weren't created at the same time as the rest, but they're functionally the same). The proposal passed, and a good chunk of the articles were merged. However, the proposal did not call for every implied article to be merged, only those that had so little information that covering them could only be justified if it was in a list. Somewhere down the line, that got muddled, and literally every implied subject was merged into a list. Some were by proposal, others were instantly merged, and a notable number of the merges were put into place by a single user. A few years later, this same user wants to revise his work.

Normally, I'd just hash it out in a discussion and take action from there, but not only are there proposals that go against the first proposal, but the first proposal was also archived as "Merge all implied subject articles", so I'm not taking any chances. In any case, I agree fully with Glowsquid's original proposal, especially when it comes to some implied subjects having much more of an impact than others. To list a few examples, Scarlette from Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door is an instrumental character in Admiral Bobbery's backstory and the deciding factor for the majority of his actions prior to joining Mario, Toad Force V from Mario Party Advance is constantly referenced in several conversations and a lot of details about the show are brought up throughout the game, the Waffle Kingdom from Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door is where the majority of Luigi's off-screen adventure takes place, the Pixl Queen from Super Paper Mario caused a huge number of events that basically shaped the game's entire story, and so on and so forth - but no, they're implied, so merged them. Feel free to disagree with some of the specific examples that I've chosen, but the point is that there are plenty of subjects that would benefit greatly from having full-fledged articles. Beyond the fact that they're notable enough to deserve articles, they could have subsections, relevant images, tailored categories, and all of the benefits of a regular article that they're missing. Regardless of which subjects you believe deserve articles, at the very least I want everyone to agree on one fact: there are subjects that should be split.

Note: this proposal is not asking for every implied subject to receive its own article; at best, it will create a backdoor that allows certain implied subjects to receive articles after future discussion.

Proposer: Deadline: September 19, 2016, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per my proposal.
 * 2) - The proposal doesn't call for every article to be split, but rather it allows discussions to split some of the larger entries. This is the most reasonable solution.
 * 3) I’m in favor of this. I don’t think having an image of the character and the place is an absolute necessity for the creation of an article, because in some case it is technically not possible to have one. We have articles for many NPC characters from RPG games, even if they do absolutely nothing for the game's story. I even think in Scarlette’s case, she can have an article since she has an impact on Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door’s story even if she’s nowhere to be seen. If an article, need an image, but there is no image of the character in question (i. e. Scarlette) then what we can do, is to add images of something relates to Scarlette, like Admiral Bobbery, the letter and in-game screenshot of her story.
 * 4) Per all.
 * 5) Per all.

Oppose

 * 1) I think a split is warranted because the article is overly long, but the proposed idea is going about it in a sloppy manner. I think a better idea would be to split by series. Mixing Donkey Kong Country (series), Yoshi (series), and Paper Mario (series) for examples into one huge list of implied characters is just too much but splitting by each implied character is too little for an article.

Comments
One of the things that the articles needs is a picture. Since there is no actual proof of some subjects (for example: the Pixl Queen), it would be unwise to make a article for those subjects. Pictures that I found of the Pixl Queen seem fan made. I think it would be unwise to allow this to pass. The reason why I am not voting yet is because the proposal is still in the three day window where it can be changed. I think we should make a List of implied objects that have high importance to games. It would be empty at first except for a intro. Proposals of what objects should be placed there should be the only thing that will keep the right things there and the wrong things out. Obviously this is not a set-in-stone proposal, so I will look forward to feedback on what I am talking about. It doesn't even have to be part of this proposal. However, I think that it would be safe to add the Pixl Queen to the list I am thinking of. 22:04, September 12 2016 (EDT)
 * Saying that we need to see the subject for it to exist is frankly too harsh of a criteria. Scarlette, for example, was Bobbery's wife: several characters directly mention interacting with her, and she even creates an object (the Old Letter) that the player possesses. Why do we need an image of her to prove that she had an impact? 22:09, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

This is the reason why. Also, please change it to a proper box where it is not part of the category before this is archived. I can't figure it out. 23:00, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * The existence of a template does not mean that it should be plastered wherever there isn't an image. 23:07, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * It should be there when there is an image possible. An image that is not fan made. Am I right? 23:14, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * The key term there is "possible" - if no image of the character exists, it is not necessary to provide an image. For example, the Nintendo Adventure Books are a series of novels, which means a lot of text and very few images. Although Dr. Sporis Von Fungenstein and others like him are not displayed in an image, they still appear in the novel and interact with other characters. If you're that committed to including an image, the simplest solution would be to include a screenshot of a dialogue where they are mentioned, but again, it's not necessary. 23:22, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * OK. Maybe the have to have image part was not the best decision. But what about the list I said? What your thoughts on that? Do not answer this in terms of your proposal. This will make sure that it is not based by anything. 23:47, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * It's not a bad idea, but I don't think that its creation is relevant to this proposal, nor would its creation warrant modifying the proposal. 00:17, 13 September 2016 (EDT)
 * Believe or not, this article's talk page would benefit both sides. If this passes, the talk page would be the place to talk about which games should get their own article. Proposals can last two weeks as oppose to one on this page. I think the highest person (Steve) should be the person who ultimately decide whether or not this should be done if there is any great confusion. If this proposal fails, it would serve as talk page to its own article. Obviously, it would need a proposal if there are people who disagree. What are your thoughts? 00:39, 13 September 2016 (EDT)

@Wildgoosespeeder: I explicitly said that I do not want to split every implied subject. 22:09, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * If you were looking for discussion to decide how to split/merge without a proposal for each split/merge but rather one mega proposal that covers it all, then shorten the proposal. I thought you were looking to do split work. The backstory and examples you provided of implied character merges just makes things confusing. Just say that wiki members at the time merged a bunch of implied characters into one mega article and splitting is not on the table for everything but it could be for some parts of the article. At least with my vote, I gave some idea how to split because I like the idea of just listing every implied character. -- 22:20, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * That's not what this proposal is for. This is to set a precedent for allowing us to split implied subjects, as there have been proposals in the past that merged implied subjects. This is not for any specific character. I thought I made that clear, especially with the note at the bottom. 22:39, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * OK, I am very confused what you want with this proposal then. -- 22:40, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
 * This proposal is to overrule other proposals. 22:43, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

Miscellaneous
None at the moment