Talk:Sledge Bro

Misnaming again = Epic Fail. Anyway, I think that these guys need some more info about their cartoon appearances.

Also, if they wanted to call them "sumo bros", couldn't they have given them some karate gear or something to tell the difference from Sledge bros.? user:General guy Genius

Move Sledge Bro. to Sumo Bro. (Super Mario Bros. 3)
Proposer: Deadline: September 6, 2012 23:59 GMT

For the last 3 guides these have been called Sumo Bros. by Prima and regardless of your preference towards Prima they are still the official source for game guides of Nintendo games. Now the question is should we consider this a new name and to that I say yes (otherwise I wouldn't make this proposal) Think about it when Prima makes a naming mistake they usually don't make the same one multiple times in a row. But with these they have called them Sumo Bros. consistently in the last 3 game guides. I believe that this is enough evidence to say that they have been renamed Sumo Bro. because unlike other instances where a creature is renamed such as Fishbone being called Wet Bones this one is consistent.

EDIT: I now have reason to believe it was Nintendo Power guide for New Super Mario Bros. that first called them Sumo Bros. because at the time of that being added Prima guides were not considered official (at least not the ones before 2007) and New Super Mario Bros. was released in 2006 meaning that only the Nintendo Power guide would have been considered official at the time.

EDIT: 2 thank you Glowsquid for confirming the fact that Nintendo Power called them Sumo Bros. and keep in mind that was in 2006 when they were still being published by Nintendo of America.

Move

 * 1) Per my proposal.
 * 2) Per proposal. We can always mention that they are sometimes called Sledge Bros.
 * 3) Per proposal.
 * 4) This article states that NSMB2 itself calls them Sumo Bros. So no question, really.
 * 5) Per ToastUltimatum. In instances like these, we should keep to the latest version of names for characters.
 * 6) If it's the recent name.

Don't Move

 * 1) As such, Prima is known for their mistakes and they do make mistakes multiple times in a row, also Sumo Bros don't wield hammers. and their attacks, other than the stomp that stuns Mario are completely different. The Sledge Bro in the New Super Mario Bros. games was obviously based off of its appearance within SMB3. They are just to different to move, despite Prima having an official Nintendo Seal, its not perfect.
 * 2) It says right at the top of the page "sometimes incorrectly referred to as Sumo Bros. They are completely different from Sumo Bros.! Per mine and xXSuperXXNintendoXx's comments below.
 * 3) If anything, merge it with Sumo Bro.
 * 4) - "Sumo Bro. (SMB3)" indicates something that was called a "Sumo Bro." in SMB3, but there is no such creature, so that's not a good name at all. In fact, neither Sledge Bro. or Sumo Bro. can be given eloquent parentheses because they both appear more than once; fortunately we have two perfectly good distinct names that we can keep using, rather than being forced to mess around with shared titles. Why complicate things when there's a perfectly straightforward solution: the simpler and easier to use the wiki is, the better. And we don't even have to break policy to choose the logical route: even if a lot of the appearances don't call Sledge Bros. by name, Naming doesn't actually say the "most commonly used English name" is determined by the number of appearances - rather, it's the name used most by "our user and visitor demographics". As far as I know, that would still be "Sledge Bro."

Comments
Also i'm going to point out that Sumo Bro. is their most common name they've been called Sledge Bro. once (possibly twice if that's what the adventure books call them) Elite Hammer Bro. once (in the cartoons) and Sumo Bro. 3 times.

@xXSuperXXNintendoXx i'm not suggesting a merger between the two articles (because that would be insane) i'm suggestion that we move this article because even if Prima makes mistakes they are still the official source and they've called Sledge Bros. Sumo Bro. 3 times in a row and because Sumoo Bro. is the most common name.
 * Also (and this is just my humble opinion) I don't think we should call this a misidentification a more logical assumption is that they didn't know that Sledge Bros. were called Sledge Bros. because the name is used so little (like I said only two sources to my knowledge call them that) so they just called them Sumo Bros. because they are similar to sumo wrestlers.


 * That's one of the problems, even if Prima serves the official source for Nintendo's guides, does not signify by any means that all of their information is by any means canonical. However, I understand that it has been called Sumo Bro for the past 3 guides, but also Sledge Bros have first appeared in SMB3 which was released before SMW (which was the Sumo Bro's debut game). Sometimes it depends not on the name, but the actions of the enemy and which one its most similar to, I think we should keep it as is. (Sorry if I sound rude), and yes they are both similar to sumo wrestlers (and quite fat, haha) --XXSuperXXNintendoXx (talk) 13:36, 23 August 2012 (EDT)
 * Actually I think on this wiki the info from official Prima guides are canon. And yes i understand that there is a problem with both Sumo Bros. being called Sumo Bro. which is why I'm proposing it be moved the Sumo Bro. (Super Mario Bros. 3) and the reason that i'm proposing we move Sledge Bro. and not Sumo Bro. is because Sumo Bro. was called Sumo Bro. first. Also I think Sumo Bro. (the hammer throwing kind :P) are in fact quite similar to sumo wrestlers because think about they jump up and cause like earthquakes which stun you which sounds like something a sumo wrestler would do if he was in a video game.

@Koopa K And I say that's wrong because of the fact that 3 straight manuals have called them Sumo Bros. while only one manual (and possibly some books) call them Sledge Bros. So what I'm trying to say is that there are two types of Sumo Bros. much like how there are two types of Boomerang Brso.
 * I say it's right. Still every single other website refers to them as Sledge Bros. Only Prima refers to them as Sumo Bros. Also, if we create the article we would have to make the regular Sumo Bros. article These are completely different from Sumo Bros. Oh, and what does the game refer to them as? Sledge Bros. I would guess, because the Superstar Saga Boomerang Bros. where officially referred to as Boomerang Bros. IN THE GAME! So yea, you think Sumo Bros. I think Sledge Bros. neither of us are particularly right until the proposal ends.
 * Wait which official website calls them Sledge Bros. 0_0 and also Sledge Bros. are never called Sledge Bros. in the game they are called Sledge Brothers in the manual of SMB3 the only time a game has ever called them that. While there have been 3 straight games that have officially called them Sumo Bro. and once again whether you like Prima or not they are the official makers of Nintendo game guides what they say is canon unless it conflicts with other more reliable sources like a Nintendo Power guide or a game. Also I would like to point out that at the edit was made that said a guide had called them Sumo Bros. Prima was considered an unofficial source (or at least every one before 2007 was) and New Super Mario Bros. was made in 2006 which means that the guide that calls them Sumo Bro. would most likely be a Nintendo Power guide.
 * I never said official I just said websites. I know Prima is the official source for game guides, but that doesn't mean they don't make mistakes, as stated above XSXNX's comment. SMB3 refers to them as Sledge Bros. the only game with Sledge Bros. before Sumo Bros. were invented. Just because something is an official game guide, doesn't mean the cannot make mistakes, three times.
 * The fact that they were called sledge bros. before sumo bros. were created is both incorrect and irrelevant they were actually called Sledge Brothers. Also as for your counter to my Boomerang Bro. argument let me point out that according to this wiki in the canon policy no source is more canon then the next so long as it's official so the fact that's it's called that in game is no more canon then the fact that 3 guides have called them Sumo Bros. I also noticed you ignored my point about the fact that it was more then likely the official Nintendo Power guide that called them Sumo Bros. originally not Prima.
 * So then Nintendo Power made a mistake! Official guides can make mistakes. It is not incorrect you said it yourself.
 * Or they just renamed it why would 2 sources make the exact same mistake 3 times.
 * You know what, I would argue with that, but this argument is pointless.
 * You just have to accept the fact that Nintendo themselves renamed them Sumo Bros. (also what I just said is true because Nintendo of America used to run Nintendo Power until I believe 2007 and the NSMB guide came out in 2006.)
 * I will keep my oppose, but I accept that fact.

"let me point out that according to this wiki in the canon policy no source is more canon then the next so long as it's official"

well actually, Naming states that Nintendo Power names take priority over Prima in case of conflicts. Though I'm merely clarifying this for precision's sake, as I have the Nintendo Power NSMB guide and I can confirm that they're called "Sumo Bro" in there. --Glowsquid (talk) 17:46, 23 August 2012 (EDT)


 * As such, a Zelda enemy known as the Dinofols was named differently in every game they appeared in and we didn't create like 5 articles for it because they were the same, which appeared first Sledge Bro or the Sumo Bro, they were called Sledge Bros in the games manuel, which seems more official than a guide. Sometimes fan-names are used for articles, not everything has to be canon. Sledge Bros from SMB3 and NSMB Sledge/Sumo Bro are exactly alike, however, the SMW Sumo Bro and the NSMB Sledge/Sumo Bro are nothing alike besides their obesity, not everything on a wiki should be based off of a guide. --XXSuperXXNintendoXx (talk) 20:45, 23 August 2012 (EDT)

I'm guessing Prima just learned the name by reading the NSMB strategy guide, and that one little error made them constantly referred to as Sumo Bros.

What is the latest game Sledge Bros. appeared in? What are they called there? According to the name I will cast my vote.
 * Read the article you'll find your answer there.

@XXSuperXXNintendoXx what makes a manual made by Nintendo more canon then a guide book made by Nintendo? also the Zelda series stuff has no impact here. @Technickal that is a terrible idea to merge two things that share nothing in common but a name is ridiculous. At opposers you base your votes for the most part on the fact that Nintendo called them Sledge Bros. originally but ignore the fact that Nintendo then renamed them Sumo Bro. a name which they have been called ever since by Prima who makes the official guide books. You also ignore the fact that in that same manual Blooper Nannies were called Blooper with kids but were later renamed Blooper Nannies and the fact that Bloopers were originally called Bloobers. So I have no idea why you are opposing this unless you A: belive that we should call Bloopers Bloobers, Boos Boo Boo Diddley, and Blooper Nannies Blooper with kids. Or B: You don't want to hammer bros. sub-species to have the same name which is a flawed argument because we already have that Boomerang Bro. (Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga).

Technically, Sledge Bro. is the more common name, named that in SMB3,YS,TAoSMB3,NAB, and most likely MKW. While the Sumo Bro. name is mistakenly used in NSMB, NSMBW, and NSMB2.
 * Actually they were called Sledge Brother in SMB3 :P and i believe they were called Elite Hammer Bros. in the cartoons (either that or they were called Elite Hammer Bros. in the Nintendo Adventure Books which might not have called them anything at all), Yoshi's Safari didn't call them anything because it only listed bosses and they were technically mini-bosses (my source for that is the mushroom kingdom website which doesn't list them on the Yoshi's Safari page), and yes they were probably called Sledge Brother in SMA but i think that was just a reprint of the original manual, And I highly doubt they were called anything in MKWii since they were just back ground characters. And they would have been called Sledge Bro. in the Super Mario All-Stars game but that's not really fair to count because it was just a slightly updated version of Super Mario Bros. 3 with the same manual.
 * I can now confirm they were called Sledge Brothers in the cartoon which mean that either A: The cartoon called them both Elite Hammer Bros. and Sledge Brothers, B: The books called them elite hammer brothers, or C: The name is made up personally i'm leaning towards either A or B.