MarioWiki:Proposals

Writing guidelines
None at the moment.

New features
None at the moment.

Real World Subjects vs. Real World Terms
A recurring trend on this wiki is to create articles on real-world terms, such as Genre, Level, and Pre-release and unused content. I know we've said something like this in the first proposal aimed at reducing generic subjects, but allowing these articles as precedents would lead to further unnecessary articles, such as, , ...the list goes on. , and we don't necessarily need articles on those subjects, same as the generic subjects. Therefore, in a similar vein to the generic subjects proposal I linked to, I propose that we allow articles on real-world terms only if they have a function or purpose that makes them unique and discernible from the way the term is applied elsewhere.

The following are examples of real-world terms that would be allowed:
 * Cheat code – The cheat codes and their effects vary per game; New Super Mario Bros.s is a simple button hold that allows Luigi as a playable character, whereas Donkey Kong Country 3: Dixie Kong's Double Trouble!s has a cheats section where the player can enter five-letter code words to drastically change the gameplay (for example, typing "COLOR" in the SNES version gives Dixie and Kiddy a palette swap).
 * Game Over – The Game Over screens are entirely unique for each game, and Game Overs aren't just achievable by "losing". Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, for example, has a Game Over that occurs by making the mistake of reading Ghost T.'s diary.
 * Easter egg – Same as cheat code.
 * Fourth wall – Fourth wall breaks occur very often in the Mario universe, such as how in Mario & Luigi: Paper Jam, Starlow references the Year of Luigi when Luigi is otherwise alone in west Gloomy Woods thanks to King Boo ("You had, like, a whole YEAR named after you!"), or how in Paper Mario: Color Splash, Huey makes a remark when he sees the final memory revealing that Bowser had accidentally created his black paint alter-ego, ""You're telling me we could have avoided this entire game if we just installed a "Don't Mix the Paint" sign?!".
 * Unrevisitable locations – Same as fourth wall.

The following are examples of real-world terms that would be forbidden:
 * Glitch – They are recurring, but they don't differentiate enough in concept from glitches in other franchises.
 * Level – There's nothing different about the concept of levels in the Mario franchise. You play them, you beat them, you move on to the next level. It's the same thing.
 * Genre – Genres in the Mario franchise are conceptually no different from genres elsewhere.
 * World – Same as above.
 * Minigame – Same as above.

Whatever happens to the targeted pages in the aftermath (i.e. merging into the glossary or converting into a list) has no bearing on this proposal.

If this proposal passes, I will begin drafting some text to add to the generic subjects policy, which I will propose later on.

Proposer: Deadline: July 16, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal.
 * 2) Per proposal.

Oppose

 * 1) Your reasons seem a little too subjective for comfort. There are plenty examples of unique takes on the latter terms in various games, particularly with what the concept of what defines a "world" vs. a "level," and what a "minigame" truly is. Plus, better way to differentiate from the (trademarked? patented?) "Microgames." And why is the concept of a minigame any more notable than the concept of a game over? Sure, there are special cases, but having "unconventional" game overs is fairly common. Not to mention, once again, what makes the non-standard game overs more notable than the non-standard definition of a "world" vs. a "level?" The cardinal regions of Wario Land 3 provide a decent example of this, and the arguable "areas between Bowser fights in Super Mario 64" can also be seen as an example of this, as it fits most definitions of a "world," but is very unconventional. I suppose the domes in Super Mario Galaxy also should count here.

Comments
@Doc von Schmeltwick: Like I said, I'm open to simply merging the terms into the glossary, depending on if it would be better. As it stands, the latter terms basically repeat information found elsewhere, and for what it's worth, I wouldn't mind seeing as a page. 15:51, 9 July 2018 (EDT)

Change the way that recurring events in the Mario & Sonic series are handled
So, now that I've finished with the sponsors I've decided to move onto the Mario & Sonic series, starting with filling in some of the missing events. However, at the moment there isn't really much coverage of the series, and there's a bit of an issue with the way that some of the events are handled. Currently, events which have the same or very similar names are all listed on the same page, despite the fact that they differ significantly between games, and not only between the Wii/Wii U and DS/3DS versions. For example, the Trampoline event in the first DS game required certain patterns to be drawn with the stylus to perform various moves, whereas in the 2012 3DS game moves are performed automatically and the player must use the circle pad to keep their character within a certain area. This means that the infoboxes are overloaded with information and that the articles are just full of lots and lots of headers (Archery (event) is an example of this, and it still has a considerable amount of information missing). Therefore, I'm proposing that we split each game's version of the event into its own unique article, which only covers the event's appearance in the one game. Only the controls, missions, playable characters, etc. for one version of the event would be included on the page, with the identifier specifying the game if it only appears in one of the instalments for a specific year (Such as "Rings (Mario & Sonic at the London 2012 Olympic games)", which appears in the 3DS version but not the Wii one), or both the game and console if it appears in both (Such as "BMX (Mario & Sonic at the Rio 2016 Olympic Games (Nintendo 3DS))" and "BMX (Mario & Sonic at the Rio 2016 Olympic Games (Wii U))"). The shared name would be turned into a disambiguation page, listing all of the separate articles and any with similar names, such as 100m and 100m Dash, which would be separated as they have different names (This would also apply to any similarly named events, if the names are different they'll use the unique names instead of one with an identifier). An About template would be added to the top of name-sharing articles with a link to the disambiguation page for the other events or the events with a similar name. Events such as Balance Beam that only appear in one game will not be affected by this and will remain at the one name.

So, in summary, each version of an event from each game is split and given game-specific identifiers, the shared title is turned into a disambiguation page and About templates are added, events with different names between versions go to the unique names and events that only appear once remain unchanged.

Proposer: Deadline: July 9, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal.

Oppose

 * 1) see comment
 * 2) One look at Archery (event) said it all. Per Super Radio.

Comments
The way I see it, there should only be one page for each event that keeps all game appearances under headers, with separate infoboxes and details for each. I think this unitary management would be a lot tidier--after all, these events read like generic subjects with differing functions from game to game, akin to Frog. Bloating article titles with kilometric identifiers would feel forced and unappealing. This aside, good luck! There's many things to cover and you did a great job so far on those sponsors. -- 13:56, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Though they may read as generic subjects now, that's something that's going to have to change in the future. They really need to be treated like minigames, as that's what they are and should be covered as. They're just based on Olympic events, some of them more closely than others (While 100m is usually pretty much identical, the Basketball in the 2012 3DS game is not even close to how the event plays), similar to how Pizza Me, Mario is loosely based on pizza making. When the articles are reworked, they will take more of a minigame focus than a real-life event one, similar to the current article for Dream Spacewalk. BBQ Turtle (talk) 16:11, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * I understand what you mean, but again, it's a matter of keeping the content organised. I said we should cover all "minigames" related to an event in a single page for that event because they all share the same name and they're singular in each game they appear in. Dream Spacewalk, on the other hand, is part of a bigger set of Dream Event minigames from a particular game and requires a separate page. -- 16:22, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Yes, but by that logic, the two Dust Buddies minigames should be covered on the same page, because they share the same name and are minigames based on vacuuming in both of their appearances. You can argue that they play differently, but then the same is true for the Mario & Sonic events. In fact, both Rhythmic Gymnastics events in the 2016 game are gymnastics floor events, but they are played completely differently and are different forms of the same event, so shouldn't be put together. And if we went with the current system, the two Rhythmic Ribbon events would get put in with the batons and hoops too, and they play differently yet again, even if we compare Wii to Wii U and the 3DS ones. We can't really apply different coverage strategies to the two series at random, because the thing that's keeping the Mario & Sonic ones together (Similar name and thing it's loosely based on) is ignored in the case of Mario Party. BBQ Turtle (talk) 16:40, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Yeah, about that... One is a free-for-all minigame and the other is 1-vs-3. That's why they're split. 16:56, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * But the same could apply to Badminton, which has both Doubles and Singles, but by the current system these would share an article, on account of the fact they're similar and have similar names. Archery also comes under this, as the Team and Singles event would also get lumped together, despite being two separate events within the same game. BBQ Turtle (talk) 18:33, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Dust Buddies isn't a real world subject. However, Olympic events are and they have different functions between the Mario & Sonic games, as you say. Frogs are also a real world subject and we don't split their page into separate articles for their Yoshi's Story, Luigi's Mansion 2, and Super Mario Odyssey appearances. There was actually a proposal to do so and it failed, and I'm using Walkazo's reasoning here too. Real world/generic subjects are simply a special case. -- 17:01, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * I think Banana is a better example. The sheer complications of that page make it near impossible to split (keep in mind, there's not just one but two failed TPPs calling for a split). 17:07, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * While I do understand what you're saying about the generic subject stuff, and I understand that these are derived from real-world events, I think we need to view this from more of a minigame point of view. The articles are not covering what the event is in great depth (Or at least, shouldn't be- if there are any like that, the amount is going down to a minimum when I get to that event), they are covering how you play it and other gameplay related details. And the events, while in some cases are similar (Such as most of the cycling ones), others are vastly different- for example, in the Marathon you win by collecting the most points from collecting water bottles, or earning extra points by performing handstands on your horse in Equestrian.


 * I'd also like to add that currently some of the Dream Events are sharing articles, including Dream Long Jump and Dream Race, which are not affected by the generic subjects policy, so what gets done about those? BBQ Turtle (talk) 18:33, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * You have your points, but I'm still uncertain on adding identifiers like (Mario & Sonic at the Rio 2016 Olympic Games (3DS)) to page titles. Regardless, if other people will agree that events should be treated more like game mechanics than real world representations, then I will reconsider my vote. The Dream Long John and Dream Race examples should definitely be taken into account. -- 02:46, 3 July 2018 (EDT)
 * I'm perfectly fine with changing the identifiers, and would prefer to do so, I was putting those in as placeholder ones because I couldn't come up with anything better. I just can't think of any other ones right now personally, but suggestions are welcome. BBQ Turtle (talk) 04:26, 3 July 2018 (EDT)

Merge golf terms to
We have a lot of articles from Mario Golf series that basically amount to generic subjects. , but we do! They play parts in the games, but pretty much in exactly the same ways as they do IRL. So round them up and stick them all on one page.

This would affect Albatross, Birdie, Bogey, Bunker (obstacle), Chip In, Eagle, Fairway, Fast Fairway, Flag Shot, Flower Patch, Green, Hole-in-One, Hole, Nice Shot, Out of Bounds, Par, Pin Shot, Pin, Rough and Tournament Green

Proposer: Deadline: July 9, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) I approve this message.
 * 2) Per Reboot.
 * 3) Per proposal.
 * 4) Per all.
 * 5) Per all. Would be preferred if the page were named "Golf Glossary" and have the terms from the 3DS game, plus the other terms that aren't listed on that glossary in the game.
 * 6) Per proposal.
 * 7) Per proposal.
 * 8) Per proposal.

Comments
I am fine with either option. However, I am not voting for either, yet. I want to point out a few problems with the proposal. However, if these are address, then I can easily vote for it.
 * First, there are more terms that can be added to the list. Yet, unlike the already existing articles, they aren't really notable. However, there are tons of these that can be added. Here's just a few: Address, Lost Ball (although not possible in World Tour at least), Shot Maker, Slice, Tee Off, Yips, Club Championship, Double Peoria, Unplayable, 1W, PW, and Tee Marker.
 * Second, they are not all terms. Even the ones that already have articles. Some are rules, and other gears (though the later only applies to non-existing articles only). Mario Golf: World Tour has a Golf Glossary, so if we don't break all these up by terms, rules, and gear (call that in said game), I think this name should do it.

Wario Land 3 isn't a sports game, but a few of those things exist in it. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:45, 2 July 2018 (EDT)

@Owencrazyboy9: It'd probably by "Golf glossary" since it's not meant to be a proper term. 22:46, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * It is called Golf Glossary in the game. I can't find any instance of golf glossary or GOLF GLOSSARY, so it's most likely unnecessary to have that as a redirect. 23:02, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * All right, then. If this proposal passes, Golf Glossary it is. – Owencrazyboy9 (talk) 23:06, 2 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Umm...not your proposal :p
 * More seriously, while I'm not deeply wedded to the title I suggested, which is something of a placeholder, it is not an article about the Golf Glossary mode in MG:WT, it's a list of golfing terms which has some overlap with what is covered in that mode, so it would be inaccurate to label it as such. The name pretty much has to start "List of..." - Reboot (talk) 00:03, 3 July 2018 (EDT)
 * Yeah. List of golf terms sounds good. However, with very likely over 500 terms (including rules and gear), World Tour's Golf Glossary will be where most of the info will come from. Even if you don't use that game, it should have all the terms from it. So, maybe Golf Glossary could redirect to the article? 00:48, 3 July 2018 (EDT)

Add a sentence to and  stating that if the user ingores them, a warning will be issued
Well, i saw a user who got warned because he/she ingored these templates. However, the templates don't say that a user can get a warning for ingoring them; and has a setence: "If the action continues, than a warning will be issued", so i believe it's acceptable to put this in these two templates as well.

Here's what i want it to look like:

Proposer: Deadline: July 16, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per my proposal.

Miscellaneous
None at the moment.