MarioWiki:Proposals

Expand Featured Articles writing guidelines
Currently our writing standards regarding what constitutes as a Featured Article at MarioWiki: Featured Articles is a vague list of short phrases and one-liners, which makes it far too loose to interpretation to my liking, especially for a process where quality control is key and enforcing these guidelines is a pivotal step to picking out only the best articles in MarioWiki. I propose that we expand these guidelines into small little paragraphs, detailing what exactly we want out of a Featured Article. This will follow the model similar to how we write out our good writing policy, where key points are organized under a header as a list first, and a paragraph detailing what we want under the header will be elaborated on.

If you want the specifics on how exactly I want the writing guidelines to look like, I have worked on it in the following sandbox page, where most of my proposed points is detailed out and worked on


 * User:Baby Luigi/Featured Articles guidelines

If you suggest any improvements to the writing or any further clarity, please comment on the proposal!

Proposer: Deadline: February 15, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Everything looks nicely policy-oriented, clear-cut, and not too confusing for the average reader. Per Baby Luigi.
 * 2) Strong support. While I'm not usually very worried about the whole featured article thing, I have seen cases where a nomination does not pass simply because the list of prerequisites was not clear, either because the nominator believed the article was ready when it was not or because the opposition believed the article wasn't ready, even though it may have been. There it is. That phrase. May have been. The current policy is so vague that it doesn't answer users' question about what an article should look like and leaves them thinking "Well, I guess it could be ready. Maybe, maybe not." You shouldn't have to actually nominate an article to find out if it's ready, the policy should tell you all that. Frankly, I'm surprised it's stayed as long it has. No question, that whole section needs a rethink. Per all.
 * 3) Per all.
 * 4) Per all.
 * 5) Per all.
 * 6) Per all, though I feel the first sentence of the "Be sourced with all available Mario-related appearances." section should say "All appearances of the subject need to be present in the article."
 * 7) Per all.
 * 8) Having a well written and detailed explanation of the various points is always good.
 * 9) Per all
 * 1) Per all

Comments
Shouldn't there be a draft of this beforehand? Rule #11 especially comes to mind: "An article must be of reasonable length and not be marked as a stub." At first glance, it's hard to know where to start. Only if we put a little more thought into the actual content (such as adding information on how certain sections should be formatted, and not to mention between certain types of subjects) would this proposal actually be clear-cut and easier to implement. (Not that this will cause me to cast a conditional oppose vote, just making sure .) 15:41, 1 February 2018 (EST)
 * Never mind, didn't see the subpage. I'm apparently a little hasty. 15:42, 1 February 2018 (EST)

For the sake of proper grammar, can you change "An article must be..." to "An article must..."? It just bugs me to see "be...be" or "be...not be". - 21:49, 1 February 2018 (EST)
 * Noted. 17:15, 2 February 2018 (EST)

New features
None at the moment.

Removals
None at the moment.

How to order navigation templates
Following the proprietor's veto of the previous proposal, this proposal will determine how our articles' navigation templates should be ordered using the plan that he laid out. Steve's option involves ordering the templates alphabetically, except series are compiled together and ordered chronologically; see this (the one labeled option 5) for a visual example of this. You're free to look at the previous proposal for exactly why the templates' order should be changed, but to put it simply, the current purely-chronological ordering helps nobody. With this in mind, this proposal only has two choices, per the proprietor's request: either Steve's option (i.e. supporting the proposal), or do nothing (i.e. opposing it).

I'm still adamant about some change being necessary, but the choice is up to you.

Proposer: Deadline: February 11, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal.
 * 2) Per proposal.
 * 3) Even though colors would be grouped, it would be good that way (explained during last propsal). Per all.

Oppose

 * 1) While Porplemontage's option seems like a workable solution, there are still many, many things that need to be fixed before it can be properly implemented. First of all, series ambiguity still has not technically been resolved. (And how do we even consensually order miscellaneous games that don't necessarily fit into one series? Some readers might consider Super Mario Maker to be grouped with Mario Paint, since the two are similar in theme.) Second, how can we be certain that all readers will understand an alphabetical setup of templates in the exact same way? (Some may consider Mario's Early Years! to come before Mario Clash, for example.) Lastly, even if series is the most recognizable format, structuring it like this leads to unnecessary  and in turn may lead to needless conflicts between users, whereas the current format is clear-cut and well-defined, and as described here, the coloration does much of the real work. In short: while it's a good idea in theory, the proposed system needs lots of work before it can be put into practice.
 * 2) Don't get me wrong, it's a great idea.  But it has problems too.  Per Toadette, in addition to the fact that the proposed option groups colors.  If we group colors, why have them at all?
 * 3) Per all, especially Toadette the Achiever.
 * 4) Per all.
 * 5) I personally believe the current way works the best. Having the colors potentially separated as they are now eases navigated as it doesn't muddle them together, and also lacks the trouble of people in PAL regions looking in the wrong place for a differently-titled game that alphabetically would present.
 * 6) I think the addition of any alphabetical element is more detrimental to the system than the current ordering, as though it may be hard to establish, when it's up and running the current way is a piece of cake to work with. I think chronology, whether ordered by series or not, is the most important, per all.
 * 7) - Same vote I had last time, I see no problem with how it is now.
 * 8) Per all.
 * 9) I still prefer Option 2 on the original proposal. Alphabetical by series seems like it would just jumble things around too much, while chronological by series feels like a more logical order. With all due respect, I don't think the veto was a good idea.

Comments
I'm not sure how "series ambiguity" is an issue when we already have series pages that clearly document what goes where. We can't be expected to reasonably account for every potential assumption from the readers. I'd also say that it's much more of an assumption on our part that our readers are so familiar with the chronology of every game that they can easily navigate such a list. 01:16, 4 February 2018 (EST)
 * @Time Turner: All the same, it's true. Nonetheless, regardless of whether this proposal passes or not, I'll look into whether there is some wiki syntax for allowing the sorting of navigational templates. Like I said, it'll definitely take time to figure it out, but I'm determined to give it a try. @Yoshi the SSM: How does your vote help anything? You're supporting because "grouping colors together is good"?! Either elaborate on why grouping series together on navigation templates helps navigation, or simply change your vote to a simple "per all". 22:26, 5 February 2018 (EST)
 * Saying simply that "it's true" isn't actually a response to what I said. 22:29, 5 February 2018 (EST)
 * Yeah, I now realize my mistake saying that. 22:38, 5 February 2018 (EST)
 * I said in the last proposal, but I will give it again. Color helps start and end the series. 22:49, 5 February 2018 (EST)

Create articles for Super Mario Odyssey minor objectives
Back when Super Mario Odyssey was released, many users were confused as to which missions get articles. A discussion started on Porplemontage's talk page, and Porplemontage said that only major objectives merit articles, and minor objectives are included with the most recent major objective. However, this creates a problem with the Cap Kingdom objectives, as all three are minor with no major precedents. As such, these three objectives have no coverage on the wiki, and that's a problem. I brought it up on the wiki collaborations board on the forums, and told me to ask, who told me to attempt to counter his rule with a proposal, and that's exactly what I'm doing now. Here are all the options, explained in detail:
 * Create articles for all minor objectives: This option would completely overturn Porplemontage's rule, and all objectives would be treated the same, major or minor. This would create all articles listed below.  This is my preferred option.
 * Create Cappy of the Cap Kingdom only: This would leave everything as it is now; however, the Cap Kingdom objectives would all be covered in a single article. As such, "Cappy of the Cap Kingdom" would be considered a major objective, while "To the Top of Top-Hat Tower" and "The Kingdom Next Door" would be considered minor objectives of the first.  Other than a single new article, everything remains unchanged.  This seems to be a workable option as well, as it still gives the Cap Kingdom objectives coverage.
 * Only major objectives get articles: Do nothing. Minor objectives are included with the article of the most recent major objective, and the Cap Kingdom objectives get no coverage.  I strongly oppose this option, as the Cap Kingdom objectives are as worthy for coverage as other minor objectives.

Articles suggested by this proposal: Cappy of the Cap Kingdom To the Top of Top-Hat Tower The Kingdom Next Door Getting the Band Together Powering Up the Station An Invitation from the Mayor The Glass Is Half Full!

Proposer: Deadline: February 16, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Create articles for all minor objectives

 * 1) Preferred option, per proposal.

Create Cappy of the Cap Kingdom only

 * 1) This is a workable option as well, per proposal.
 * 2) This is the choice I'm going with. It's an exception mostly because as stated in the proposal, the objectives in the Cap Kingdom don't even have an article like this to begin with and therefore is the most justifiable into receiving one. It's also the first cutscene in the game anyway that kickstarts the entire story of the game into motion, so I say that's important enough for this mission to get its own article. I'm not a fan of splicing off separate articles for minor objectives simply because of a small title change in the mission like "round up three guys because it's one of the objectives" or "this is the same objective but since this small portion has you fight a boss it's suddenly different" like in the Ocean Kingdom's The Glass is Half Empty!'s mission.
 * 3) Per Baby Luigi.
 * 4) Per Baby Luigi.
 * 5) Per Baby Luigi.
 * 6) Baby Luigi has really good strengths about her argument, so I'm going with this option. Per all.

Restrict which sockpuppet talk pages get deleted
According to MarioWiki policy on sockpuppet talk pages: While I'm fine with blocking sockpuppets (why should I even be here if I'm not?), I'm not entirely sure why all sockpuppet talk pages need to be deleted on sight. Some (like this one, this one, this one, and, most recently, this one) actually have extensive page histories, and considering that we usually keep some pages to preserve page histories. I've narrowed down this proposal to three options:
 * "A user creating more than one account is known as, and is not allowed. Extra accounts should be blocked indefinitely and their talk pages should be deleted."


 * Option 1: Stop deleting all sockpuppet talk pages. This option would force admins to stop deleting every single sockpuppet talk page, regardless of age or page history, as well as restore any and every sockpuppet talk page that was already deleted. This is my second choice.
 * Option 2: Stop deleting only the sockpuppet talk pages with extensive history. This option would force admins to stop deleting sockpuppet talk pages with extensive page contents and/or histories, but allow them to keep deleting sockpuppet talk pages with any or all of the following if no other meaningful content is visible in the page history:
 * A template
 * A template
 * A message from a patroller or admin asking why the account shared an IP address with another
 * Gibberish, spam, or pure vandalism
 * This option also ensures the restoration of any sockpuppet talk page that meets (or rather, does not meet) the above criteria. This is my preferred option.
 * Option 3: Do nothing. This is what it says on the tin. I suggest we don't do this.

Let me know in the comments if there are any workaround solutions you have in mind.

Proposer: Deadline: February 17, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Option 2

 * 1) Per my reasons above.
 * 2) Assuming this doesn't overstep admin boundaries, this is the option I prefer. Per proposal.

Option 3

 * 1) - There's no reason to keep them, and if there is, that'll be up to the admins. Not sure if a proposal like this is allowed, since it effects how the administrators work...

Comments
Is there a reason to not keep them, especially if they were involved in numerous discussions? It's more information that'll become inaccessible. 14:03, 10 February 2018 (EST)
 * The only reason I can think of is that the sockpuppet is a dupe account of another user that's used to ban-evade and sometimes they just go unnoticed because they use proxies or whatever. 15:12, 10 February 2018 (EST)

@Time Turner: Yeah, that's the intent. 14:21, 11 February 2018 (EST)

Removing bolded text from image captions
The names of articles are bolded in their intros to draw attention to the beginning of the text; everything starts here, to put it simply. With that in mind, why are page names also bolded within image captions at the beginning of the article? It's certainly not an official rule: the Manual of Style just mentions bolding the name in the intro and not including a period in image captions if they don't form a complete sentence. Even if it's just a piece of tradition that's become widely used, there's no reason we should do it. The readers' eyes shouldn't be drawn to the image caption as if it's the same as the intro text: after all, one signifies the beginning of the actual information, whereas the other is a short description of what's literally happening in the image. It's redundant, to say the least, especially if the page has an infobox that already repeats the article's name at least a couple of times. It's redundant, to say the least. It's not as if any actual information is gained by bolding the text, it only serves to distract readers with nothing gained in return. So, why do we do this?

There's no practical reason that page names in image captions should be bolded; therefore, I propose that they should be removed.

Proposer: Deadline: February 11, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per proposal.
 * 2) Doesn't seem particularly useful, per proposal.
 * 3) Per proposal.
 * 4) Per proposal.
 * 5) Per proposal.
 * 6) Per proposal.
 * 7) Per proposal.
 * 8) Very redundant, and most readers would just assume that the intro image on the right is the subject. Per proposal.
 * 9) While I was originally going to oppose, I just saw it on the Mario article, and it just seems redundant and pointless.  Per all.
 * 10) I have to wonder if this mutated from linking the article to itself in those locations. Either way, redundant and doesn't make a lot of sense.
 * 11) Per all.

Comments
Can you link me to an article that does this? - 23:34, 5 February 2018 (EST)
 * I'd say the vast majority of our articles do this. Whether with infoboxes, like Mario or Luigi, or without, like Sistine Chapel or Ladder, if there's an image at the top (usually the top-right) that has a caption with the page name, that name's getting bolded. 23:51, 5 February 2018 (EST)

Create articles for the Mario Party 4 hosts: Revisited
I think it's time I revisited this topic again. Two years back, I proposed we created articles for the hosts of Mario Party 4, Goomba, Koopa, Boo and Shy Guy (with the likes of Whomp and Thwomp being debatable). It ended with "No Quorum" due to there being only three votes total. I want to revisit this topic and hope that we can get a few more opinions out there. I reread the past proposal to study the points made and I can see the disagreements with these articles; yes, they are technically traditional enemies dressed up and yes, there are a lot of NPC characters who do the same deal or even less. In fact, there are a lot of generic enemies who play hosting like roles, but do not have their own articles (such as Lakitu's hosting role in Mario Super Sluggers or the other various characters throughout the Mario Party series. But the way I saw it was the game was treating these four characters as individual characters for the game, leading to their hosting roles on the boards to possible playable status in the Beach Volley Folley mini-game, which I view is a bit bigger than hosting battle mini-games or popping up at a bank to snag five of your coins. On top of that, they displayed slightly more unique personalities, something was kind enough to help me with, as he was able to get prima guide bios for the hosts, which sheds a bit more light on their character (shown here). Another point of interest is the credits scene, which does back up that they are just generic enemies dressing up, but I feel that is more of their backstory and how they became said characters. In my eyes, there are solid points on both ends, but I want to settle the matter in a better way than last time.

Proposer: Deadline: February 11, 2018, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) - I still support this idea. For at least Shy Guy, Goomba, Boo and Koopa Troopa. Whomp and Thwomp are still up in the air, but that's what the comments section is for.
 * 2) I think the uniquely designed outfits make a case for these characters, since other generic versions of them still appear in the game as shopkeepers and whatnot, as well as the end cut-scene of the game all hinting their individual status. But just keep the creation to just Shy Guy, Goomba, Boo, and Koopa Troopa, since they're the only ones who get to have this sort of distinction. I think it's speculation to say that these characters are playable in Beach Volley Folley though, since they're not dressed there and could easily just be a generic character playable.
 * 3) Per all.
 * 4) Per Baby Luigi.
 * 5) Per all.
 * 6) Per all.
 * 7) Per all.