Talk:Boom Boom

A small bit of trivia: The Prima guide states that he is the "forgotten Koopaling". As the Prima Game Guides usually cannot be trusted, I'm wondering whether there is any evidence for this...

... Really? Weird, well, we could mention it in the Koopalings and Boom Boom articles I guess, guidebooks I don't really think should be trusted on matters like this, -- Sir Grodus


 * No. It's not official so we shouldn't. -- Son of Suns

Option 2

 * 1) Artwork are better than screenshot, period.
 * 1) Artwork are better than screenshot, period.
 * 1) Artwork are better than screenshot, period.

Comments
And we won't include both because......? - Yoshi Master

I'm guessing space issues. Though that can be resolved by just removing the cartoon picture; aside from that, I don't see any other solution. -- Sir Grodus

Why Remove cartoon image?It looks good like that.

I don't want a whole "thing" to spin out of this; it seems the majority agree that the page is good like this. If it gets bigger (I might expand the Appearances in Other Media section if I have time) we can use both of the above images. -- Sir Grodus

And the cartoon pic is blurry as hell. - Yoshi Master

?
Is or are Boom Boom(s) are character or a species? 17:30, 1 August 2007 (EDT)

i'm guessing species cuz you fight him like 6 times.

It's never been properly explained by Nintendo, but there were two Boom Booms that appeared together in Super Mario Advance 4. -- Booster

Species it is (unless that was a clone...). 14:35, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

Sorry but it said on the book that Boom Boom is The faithful Servant of Bowser so Knife other reason is right the other Boom Boom was a clone.

Spelling
My official SMA4 guide consistantly spells the name as "BOOM-BOOM". I don't know of any other official source material I could check, but should we change the spelling of Boom Boom to reflect this? -- Booster

Bradley Koopenberg?
Is it true that Boom Boom is really known as Bradley Koopenberg?

Redundancy
In the appearance section, it says Unlike them, he is bald and has no hair. which is pretty much saying the same thing twice. I've never known anybody to be bald and have hair (har har). Should I change this, or should somebody else? -- Super YoshiBros  20:51, 6 December 2011 (EST)
 * It's obviously redundant, so feel free to change it (as long as you do it properly).
 * actually, you can be bald and have hair; bald only means no hair on your head (unless you are an animal). So you could be bald but have a beard or a mustache. However, having no hair means, well, no hair, so in this case either bald or has no hair will work.M&amp;L Just because you&#39;re in red doesn&#39;t mean you&#39;re strong. Have at you! 19:38, 31 January 2012 (EST)

Relationship section with Mario
Boom Boom is not important enough to warrant a section with Mario the only thing you can say is he fights Mario well duh he's a boss of course he does every boss does. Boom Boom also has no personality and only appears in 2 games so if he gets a relationship section with Mario than so should every boss because they all dislike Mario cause they fight him


 * Ya know that it's rediculous to say Boom Boom has no personality. Everyone has personalities, like you and I, even characters of the Mario universe. You may call him heartless or emotionaless since he likes invading every kingdoms of Mushroom World with the Koopalings and/or Pom Pom because he's a villain Koopa boss. But still, he has personality and traits. You don't have to be obliged to add a relationship section with Mario for everyone else's article if Boom Boom does.--Prince Ludwig 19:26, 7 December 2011 (EST)


 * How is it *ridiculous? He literally does not demonstrate any shred of personality besides antagonizing Mario, which is ultimately the extent of their "relationship". And if he's heartless for invading the Mushroom Kingdom, then so is Bowser by extension, even though he's been shown to actually care for Peach (and his minions if I recall) from time to time. Boom Boom doesn't show any particular emotion towards invading the Mushroom Kingdom - he just follows Bowser's orders.


 * Point is, the relationship between him and Mario is hardly even there; besides their obvious dislike of each other, there's nothing notable, and he just kinda exists as another enemy for Mario to step on. Lord Grammaticus 19:59, 7 December 2011 (EST)
 * yeah, if you fight him using Luigi it's not like he acts different, he acts the same and doesn't really care who it is. He just serves Bowser. Maybe he has no soul?M&amp;L Just because you&#39;re in red doesn&#39;t mean you&#39;re strong. Have at you! 19:40, 31 January 2012 (EST)

You can say the same for one of the main antagonists of the Super Mario Bros. series? I don't think so. It's also like saying that Bowser Jr. has no soul either.--Prince Ludwig 23:04, 31 January 2012 (EST)

About Boom Boom's Classification
Boom Boom has constantly been changing from being a singular character to be being generic as shown in many sources as well as a few games. A theory that I think that explains this is that they might have given Boom Boom the Generic Character Treatment. That is where a character is generic but there is that one specific character from his species that so happens to have the same name as his species. Toad, Yoshi, and sometimes Kamek when he is mistakenly referred as Magikoopa, have been given this treatment. Maybe they might have done the same with Boom Boom. What do you guys think? Smasher345 9:57, 24 December 2012 (EST)


 * Not yet, unless Nintendo confirms they are actual clones or his species. He's often being the single character even though there are many Boom Booms out there in New Super Mario Bros. U. I'm hoping they are his clones.

But why would you assume they are clones? Because you want Boom Boom to be a singular character? Sometimes you have to face the truth, in the same way how we had to handle the Koopalings not being Bowser's children, which I accepted already. If they show multiple Boom Booms in the game in addition to some manuals and official websites referring to Boom Boom in the plural sense, that most likely means Boom Boom is generic. Thats pretty much proof that they are making Boom Boom a species where as there is no proof that they are clones. Sure you may say that some sources refer to Boom Boom in the singular sense but why with the constant changing from being a character to generic or vice versa? Like I said, the only possible explanation to this is that Boom Booms are species and there is one specific Boom Boom with the same name as his species. In fact, remember before the NSMBU website was updated, Blue Toad and Yellow Toad were both in the Generic Toads profile. After the site was updated, Blue Toad and Yellow Toad were each given their own profiles while the generic toads profile was removed. The same could have been done with Boom Boom with all these sources. It's hard to keep tradition but you have to face facts. Smasher345 12:47, 25 December 2012 (EST)


 * It seems more like you want Boom Boom to be a species. There has been no confirmation. Multiple Boom Booms on the world map may simply be Nintendo's laziness. Maybe they didn't want to program him running to the next tower, especially since you can do the worlds in different orders. Aokage (talk) 13:08, 25 December 2012 (EST)
 * At the end of the day neither side is right because Nintendo has called him both on person and a whole species but since references to him being a single person came first and since there are more sources that say he's one person the wiki should continue referring to him as one person.

I'm not saying I want Boom Boom to be a species, just that many sources including the game itself implies that he is a species. When someone sees more than one of that character, most people will naturally assume that they are generic not clones. I'll admit that I'm speculating about Boom Boom getting the generic character treatment, but sources indicate that Boom Boom is meant to be a species. The sources lead more into Boom Boom being generic than him being a singular character. Websites and manuals don't write in the plural sense for nothing especially when one game shows multiple Boom Booms. You and Prince Ludwig seem to want Boom Boom to be a singular character, only going with the singular sense sources while going as far as to disregard the sources that imply he is a species by giving speculation that the multiple Boom Booms are either clones or is just lazy on Nintendo's part. Neither of you have proof of this. Seriously, it isn't gonna be the end of the world for you guys if he isn't a singular character. But like Marshal Dan Troop said, neither side is right though I disagree that that there are more references to him being a singular character since they now lead to him being generic which could possibly be a retcon similar to the Koopalings. Smasher345


 * I'm not lying to myself, that's true. Boom Boom has to be a singular character. To be honest, once Nintendo confirms one of the two sources, many people wouldn't approve with this if there are many of his kind, including for his "twin sister", unless if he is a singular character spawning clones all over the world, that'll make him too powerful, so... As for me, I'm not sure if I'll say anything once it happens. I'll just have to keep editing the articles. Let's just way.--Prince Ludwig (talk) 00:12, 26 December 2012 (EST)

I guess you're right, we just have to wait and see. I don't necessarily think that Boom Boom being generic is a bad thing. They could still give him character development just like Yoshi and Toad even though they're generic. Pom Pom I believe is in a similar case to Toadette, we don't know if they can possibly be generic, just like the opening of Super Mario Galaxy showing two Toadettes. It would be cool if Boom Boom is a singular character since it would make him more unique. If Nintendo does confirm that those are indeed clones, then I would at least want to know which one is the real Boom Boom. Smasher345

Creating a New Page for Boom Boom Species
I'm thinking that a Boom Boom species page must be created. We got a couple of sources that mention Boom Boom in the plural sense such as a few manuals and 3 websites of Super Mario 3D Land, including Japan. Japan's sources are known to override any other region's sources. This is coupled with New Super Mario Bros. U showing multiple Boom Booms as well as a few World-e levels in Super Mario Advance 4. This cannot be denied. Only the American website refers to Boom Boom in the singular sense, as does the Super Mario Bros. 3 manual. America is known for their mistakes including the mistranslation of the Koopalings being Bowser's children and calling Kamek his species name Magikoopa. None of the other regions make these mistakes and the Super Mario Bros. 3 manual is the same manual that mentioned the Koopalings being Bowser's children. Now that a game finally shows multiple Boom Booms and he has been referred in the plural sense even in Japan, this is enough evidence to say that Boom Booms are a species and thus a species page must be created. Smasher345 14:01, 30 December 2012 (EST)
 * Can you read japanese? Aokage (talk) 14:17, 30 December 2012 (EST)
 * I believe that Boom-Boom is a species, but that no character called "Boom-Boom" exists. We should have only one page, the current one, focusing on the species. At least, in my opinion. 14:40, 30 December 2012 (EST)


 * You couldn't wait, couldn't you? -_-' --Prince Ludwig (talk) 15:09, 30 December 2012 (EST)
 * What ? 17:16, 30 December 2012 (EST)
 * He is talking about waiting until Nintendo confirms it, even though I have already provided enough evidence to suggest that he is a species. They are just in denial and often make up excuses for Boom Boom to be a singular character. And its not that I want to be mean, I'm just making them realize that he is species and that its realistic to think that, especially when two games show it and sources called him a species. Smasher345
 * Yes, the most recent Mario game show several Boom Booms at once, but "nope ! It's a singular character !"... 13:02, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * That's exactly how they act. They're in denial, much like how they were with the Koopalings confirmed to not be Bowser's children. Smasher345 15:31, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * I suggest that, if you have time, you rewrite the article. This is official, and anyway, one day it will be done, like the edits on the Koopalings article (sorry for my bad english...). 15:37, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * I wish I could but I recently spoke to an admin about this and he said for now we have to leave the page the way it is until Nintendo confirms it. He did however say that we can mention Boom Boom as a species in the most relevant parts of the article as we can't simply ignore things such as multiple Boom Booms in New Super Mario Bros U or other sources calling him a species. I made a few changes mentioning them but I can't wait till the day Nintendo confirms this because you and I both know that Boom Booms are officially a species and this is most likely what Nintendo will say. Smasher345 17:21, 31 December 2012 (EST)

No I can't read Japanese but the European, Australian, and Japanese sites are exactly the same and they all have the same screenshots with the exact same description so I know that Japan refers to it in the plural sense. Go ahead and prove me wrong with a Japanese translator, I'm sure I'm right. He has been mentioned in the plural sense on these sites along with one(actually two if you count World-e) game clearly showing multiple Boom Booms with no justification that they're clones. I'm being realistic here and all you people trying to defend Boom Boom as a character just make up excuses so that he can't be a species even though multiple ones are shown in two games, also backed up with sources referring him in the plural sense. You guys are setting yourselves up for disappointment if you think Boom Boom isn't a species. Also I agree Banon. Smasher345 17:03, 30 December 2012 (EST)

If Boom Boom is a species, would it mean that Pom Pom also is one ? 13:56, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * Well, the European, Australian, and Japanese sites of Super Mario 3D Land refer to Pom Pom in the plural sense so its possible that she is a species. This is similar to Toadette who may possibly be generic due to the opening of Super Mario Galaxy showing two Toadettes. It's hard to tell when Pom Pom only appeared in one game, but I believe she is most likely a species as well. We can think of Pom Pom as the female Boom Booms in the species. Nintendo also needs to confirm this. Smasher345 17:40, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * Pom Pom is most likely the female Boom Boom, and if the website use the plural sense, it's a species. I don't know if Nintendo will confirm this, but I think that, if Nintendo confirms that Boom Boom is a species, we should consider that Pom Pom is a species and apply the changes on the page. Also, I agree with what you said above. Where in the SMG opening can we see two Toadettes ? Note that in the same game we can see two Luigis as well, but it was humoristic. 18:15, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * I have no clue why the developers added two Luigis when you play as Luigi, but I'll admit it was funny. My guess is that Nintendo didn't want to bother changing anything of the story through Luigi's playthrough aside from changing a few dialogue to fit with Luigi. In other words, it was just for gameplay reasons as to why they kept that NPC Luigi even though the player already plays as Luigi, so I don't think its meant to be canon. Smasher345 18:45, 31 December 2012 (EST)
 * I think the European(and Australian) site just made a mistake translating. Japanese nouns have no plural form, so it could be "Boom Boom" or "Boom Booms". Multiple Boom Booms on the world map can be explained the same way as multiple Luigis in Galaxy: Nintendo was lazy. Aokage (talk) 08:00, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * And here it goes again with defending Boom Boom as a character. You do not know that Australia and Europe made mistranslations, in fact I don't think they have evered made a mistranslation at all where as America has. I'm fairly certain it mentions him as a species in Japan when the 3 websites look exactly the same. Two Luigi's was for gameplay reasons, you should know this. It is a fact that there is only one Luigi in existence which is Mario's brother. Multiple Boom Booms on the other hand can be possible because Boom Boom has been considered a species before and Super Mario Advance 4's World-e levels show two Boom Booms so don't give me that "Nintendo was lazy" excuse. You can't compare Boom Boom to Luigi. Once people see multiple Boom Booms in a game, they have to conclude that he is a species unless something in the game proves they are clones, which there isn't. YoshiKong knows this. Like I said before, you're setting yourselve up for disappointment if you think Boom Boom isn't a species. Once Nintendo confirms the classification of Boom Boom, I'm positive that they'll say he is generic, as I have two games and a couple of sources to back that up. YoshiKong already allowed me to mention Boom Boom as a species in the most relevant parts of the article until Nintendo confirms this. Smasher345 10:19, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * As I said, Japanese nouns have no plural form so they could've easily made that mistake. Just because the websites "look the same" doesn't mean they say the same thing. And FYI Super Mario Advance 4 manual refers to him in singular. Aokage (talk) 10:59, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * It may also be a translation error. What does the Japanese manual says ? 11:12, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * Isn't the Super Mario Advance 4 manual the same manual that called the Koopalings Bowser's kids? Yes, it is and look how that turned out for the Koopalings. Sorry, but whatever is shown in-game overrides manuals. I thought you knew this. Smasher345 12:00, 1 January 2013 (EST)

In Super Smasher Bros. which is a valid crossover and canon according to the coverage policy has levels that feature multiple Mario's so should we also create a Mario (species) page?
 * No-one wants to create the Mario (species) page, we just want to consider Boom Boom generic. I don't want to apply the changes right now, I will wait an official confirmation, but I'm pretty sure that Boom Boom is a species : in a mainstream game, they are several. I know that technically, SSB games are canon, but, even if there is no evidence of this anywhere, I think that Nintendo didn't mean the battles to be canon. The Subspace Emmissary is, but not the "custom" battles. Canonicty can be ambigous : if you dies in a game 50 times, are those deaths canon ? (What I'm saying don't make a lot of sense, but...) 11:34, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * It doesn't matter what you think is canon it's what the wiki thinks is canon and according to the wiki all games including ssb are canon also in Donkey Kong jr. there are two mario's at the beginning therefore according to the logic you are using here mario is not a character but a generic species.
 * Yes, I shouldn't have given my opinion (it was useless, sorry). So, I will wait Nintendo confirmation, but there is a difference between Mario, and an ennemy, isn't there ? 11:50, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * You shouldn't feel bad about being bested in a debate by the second coming of John F. Kennedy (did I mention how modest I am.) And no according to the logic that I have been presented there is no difference because you are saying that because more then one Boom Boom appears on screen he is a species well the same applies to Mario therefore he is a species.
 * You are seriously going use Super Smash Bros against my argument? That game doesn't even have canon at all, its just a fighting crossover featuring Nintendo's all-stars. There has been so many things Smash Bros. has done that isn't even canon. Multiple Marios are just alternate costumes for players that also want to play as Mario should another player already choose him. Those alternate costumes are also used for event matches and stuff which is not canon. You know what thats called? Its called GAMEPLAY REASON. Smashwiki doesn't consider it canon and wikis are information written by people so just cause you go with what the wiki says it doesn't mean its true. Smasher345 11:58, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * No dude on this wiki Smash Bros. is canon therefore using your logic Mario is a species it's wiki policy it's right your wrong you can't go against and it would require a formal proposal to change it (also I think the admins like it this way) also that's not the only game where there are two mario's in DKJR at the very beginning there are two mario's therefore mario is a species not a character using your logic.
 * I know it's the policy, and I also know that there is very little chance to change it, but come on ! 90% of the text in this wiki is interpretation of the game : we consider that those pixels are a cap, we consider that this ennemy is a Goomba. If you want to be 100% canon, the wiki should be written like this : "At first, there are two black pixels here, three red pixels here. If the player presses the A button, there are three black pixels here... ". Well, I know that what I said can be seen as total nonsense, but the Mario experience is based on human interpretation. Our common sense identifies the pixels as a cap or an ennemy, and it also identifies the two Marios fighting each other as a gameplay feature. 12:07, 1 January 2013 (EST)

Marshal Dan Troop is right. As far as canon goes, all officially licensed Mario media is canon. The argument that two Boom Booms appear on the world map at the same time means more than one Boom Boom exists is very flawed, since that's very unlikely to be a direct confirmation that there is more than one Boom Boom present in that world at that time. The European referring to Boom Boom as plural is more concrete, but to enforce any changes, I agree with YoshiKong (who has told you that it is best to wait for further Nintendo confirmation before making these changes!!) that we should wait for more information from Nintendo before doing anything. That is all.

Banon You are wrong sir for three reasons 1. you have yet to address the fact that there are two Mario's in DKJR, 2. because the wiki considers the Smash Bros. series canon then all of those fights in the story are canon, and 3. because Nintendo has historically refereed to Boom Boom as one person rather then a species look at SMB3 for the GBA the manual still refers to Boom Boom as a single character despite a level with two boom booms in it, look at SM3DL where the American website (which is the one that this wiki as an American wiki) uses refers to Boom Boom in a singular sense. You have literally no argument other then the fact that you can see more then one which doesn't work because of the fact that more then one Mario's have been seen at the same time. So either you concede that Boom Boom is a single character or you concede that Mario is a species you don't get to pick and chose what is and isn't canon based on personal beliefs.
 * As stated above, the manual and the website could be translation errors. I don't speak Japanese so I don't know, but I will wait for a proper translation. (I didn't understand your sentence "which is the one that this wiki as an American wiki", isn't a word missing ?) 12:21, 1 January 2013 (EST)

Another thing : you're right, according to our policy we should create the Mario (species) page. So the policy needs to be changed. 12:26, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * You do realize that if you changed the policy then Boom Boom would have to be considered a character not a species right?
 * Not necessarily. The change is not necessarily to consider every character that have appeared at two places at the same time a single character. It could be another change, like consider SSB pseudo-canon, or something else. 12:47, 1 January 2013 (EST)

This is getting ridiculous. We are just gonna have to wait until Nintendo confirms something. To be honest, I didn't really want to start this argument, I just don't know why you guys would ignore multiple Boom Booms on the world map as well as ignore other sources that consider him a species. Boom Boom can't be in two or more places at once, so how can this be explained? Smasher345 12:41, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * How do you explain two Luigis in Galaxy or two Marios in DKJr? The world map doesn't really represent reality. If it did, Mario would be half the size of a tower. Aokage (talk) 12:53, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * I agree, but not at 100% because scale problem is different from ennemies that are visible. 13:21, 1 January 2013 (EST)

Banon why do you keep dismissing the fact that in the beginning of DKJR there are two mario's? is that game also pseudo-canon?
 * Sorry. I can't give my opinion at this fact, because I don't know how are the two Marios represented : I haven't seen them. Can you explain me, or give me a screenshot ? 13:21, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * [[File:TwoMarios.png]]
 * That's really strange... I don't know... I will just assume that was easier to explain how Mario move the cage, but that's speculation of course. 13:28, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * That second Mario is Luigi, obviously. He just had to borrow Mario's clothes that day because all his were dirty. I'm joking, by the way, since that would be kinda hard to pick up on over text.
 * Anyway, I agree with the position that Boom Boom is a species, and there is no Boom Boom character. You clearly fight two at once in at least either SMB3 or its GBA version. -- 1337star (Mailbox SP) 13:42, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * And you see two Luigi's in SMG and two Mario's in DKJR so are they both species? also the manual for the GBA version of SMB3 refers to Boom Boom in a singular sense.
 * My theory is that Boom Boom is an actual species and that Pom Pom is a character of the Boom Boom species. The reason is because of the fact that Boom Boom appears in many different colors and that the player clearly fights two Boom Booms at the same time in this e-reader level of Super Mario Advance 4.

---signed, a.k.a.  John Roberts 13:54, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * His color scheme changes slightly, as with other characters. And World-e levels are not part of "main game", so one could argue that they're not canon. Aokage (talk) 13:59, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * I know I contradict msyelf a bit by saying that, but according to our policy it's canon. And it's a maintstream game. 14:22, 1 January 2013 (EST)

Let's recapitulate : 14:32, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * One can fight two Boom Booms at once in Super Mario Advance 4: Super Mario Bros. 3 (2003) and one can see more than one Boom Boom on the map in New Super Mario Bros. U (2012).
 * But one can see two Luigis in Super Mario Galaxy (2007) and two Marios in Donkey Kong Jr (1982). Additionnally, in the Super Smash Bros. games (1999, 2001, 2008) every character can fight against himself, and two Toadettes in Super Mario Galaxy.
 * The official Australian and European website for Super Mario 3D Land (and maybe Japanese) mention Boom Boom (and Pom Pom) in the plural sense. (2011)
 * The official American website for Super Mario 3D Land mentions Boom Boom in the singular sense. (2011)
 * The Super Mario Bros. 3 manual mentions Boom Boom in the singular sense. (1990)
 * The Super Mario History 1985-2010 booklet mentions Boom Boom in the plural sense (2010)
 * It might be a translation error, because the same manual mistranslated the Koopalings stuff.
 * We should wait Nintendo's confirmation. (that's not part of the argument)
 * Don't forget that the Super Mario All-Stars limited edition manual also mentions Boom Boom in the plural sense. Smasher345 14:50, 1 January 2013 (EST)
 * Thanks ! 14:55, 1 January 2013 (EST)

For the sake of knowing what we're talking about, I retrieved all the Japanese bios. First up, the original SMB3 manual: 「ブンブン - 砦 を守って いるボス. 両手 をぶるんぶるん回しながら 、マリオに体当り をしてくる. ３回 踏まない と倒せない. しかし、踏む ごとにパワーアップするので気 をつけよう. 」　meaning "Boom Boom - The boss that protects the fortress. While both hands spin around, [Boom Boom] comes to do a full body blow on Mario. Three stomps on the head brings down [Boom Boom]. However, watch out for the power-up [Boom Boom] does for every stomp." Next, from the SM3DL website: 「戦艦 でマリオを待ち受ける ブンブン. ぐるぐる回転 しながらマリオに迫ります. 」 meaning "In the battleship is Boom Boom, who/that awaits Mario. While revolving, [Boom Boom] approaches Mario." For the sake of thoroughness, here's Pom Pom too: 「クッパ軍 の紅一点. <span class=explain title="かれい">華麗 な<span class=explain title="うごき">動き でマリオほんろうします. 」 meaning "The Koopa army's lone female. [Pom Pom] toys with Mario using magnificent moves." I also looked around the NSMBU website but the closest I got to a bio for Boom Boom was the blurb about fortresses: 「ワールドの<span class=explain title="とちゅう">途中 にある「<span class=explain title="とりで">砦 」. <span class=explain title="さいじょう">最上 <span class=explain title="かい">階 には<span class=explain title="きょうてき">強敵 が<span class=explain title="まちうけ">待ち受け 、<span class=explain title="たおす">倒す とセーブ（<span class=explain title="きろく">記録 ）することがでいます. 」 meaning "On the way in each world is a "fortress". A strong enemy awaits on the highest floor, bring [the enemy] down and [you] can save (record [your progress])." As was mentioned earlier, there are no pluralizations in Japanese so that argument's wrong. They also leave out nouns if the subject's obvious and don't use pronouns much, hence all the []s in the translations. - So, the Japanese treats Pom Pom in the singular, but it's not really helpful about whether there's one or more Boom Boom(s), however Japanese isn't the be-all or end-all of Mario canon. Really, the only established practice we have regarding this kinda situation is "use the version that makes the most sense". Some material uses the plural for Boom Boom, others treats him like one guy, meaning we can go either way without leaving canon behind. To me, it all boils down to the fact that there are instances where we see more than one Boom Boom at a time, which means the Boom Boom that is talked about is an eponymous member of an overall Boom Boom species, and we should have two articles to reflect this. This isn't saying that there's more than one instances of the character Boom Boom - that's not possible, and the only times it really happened in-game is the DKJr. weirdness, but maybe it was just because of graphical limitations - we can't speculate on the "why" either way. The two Toadettes only happened in the storybook: we didn't count Rosalina's mom as being more than an implied character despite appearing in a storybook flashback, so we have wiggle room here too; plus, the characters weren't identified as "Toadette" and were seen from behind, so it's reasonable to say they weren't intended to be her in duplicate (but again, avoid speculation on the wiki: this is just to show that this isn't a good counterpoint to the very different situation at hand). You also can't compare the mechanics of SSB to the Super Mario games: yeah, it's all canon, but it's also apples and oranges. As for the the "two Luigis" SMG thing, they were made to look slightly different, and this was dealt with in-game with Roasalina calling the extra one Luigi's twin: it's enigmatic, but it's not the same thing as two Boom Booms being fought at the same time in SMA4, or Boom Booms appearing on every fortress top in the NSMBU map. - Since SMB3 and SM3DL both have at least once source referring to Boom Boom in the singular, the bulk of that info can stay here, with the extra SMA4 Boom Boom info going in the species article along with a mention of how the Boom Boom character (also) represents the species in the two games, and a discussion of the ambiguities and inconsistent pluralization stuff. Regarding NSMBWii, if nothing says the specific guy's in there, all the info should be moved to the species page, with only a mention here saying he might be in the game, but wasn't differentiated. The SMB film and comic references can stay here because they're referencing "the" SMB3 Boom Boom; the SPM ref could go on either page (or even both). The TV show appearance's placement depends on how the show treated its Boom Boom - having never watched it, I can't make a call on that one. Most of the other info can probably stay, like how Birdo has all the information while Birdo (species) only has the "extra" appearances and other things that can't be attributed to "the" Birdo. And when in doubt, put stuff on both pages. - Course, others might disagree - I figured I'd just offer up what I think we should do on the matter. Also, on a side-note: stop saying things are "mistranslated". Most of the time, this is nothing but (often biased) speculation, and in cases like the Koopalings stuff, it's wrong (they were his kids in the original Japanese SMB3 manual, and the English simply ran with it; it's been discussed at length on the talk page and on the articles - the only "mis-" here is "misinformation" about the source material). Stick to the facts: something may be called "X" here and "Y" there, but it's not our place to say that either version is a mistake, because we don't know that for sure. And in conclusion, Nintendo's probably not gonna give us a straight answer anytime soon, so don't hold your breath; fortunately, we have the ability to think for ourselves in the meantime, despite all the conflicting canon. - - 17:56, 1 January 2013 (EST)