User talk:Time Turner/Archive 10

Hello to you all, I'm Time Turner, and before you leave a comment, I'd appreciate it if you could read the rules below.


 * 1) Sign all of your comments so I know who left it.
 * 2) I prefer proper spelling and grammar, but feel free to use whatever you're comfortable with.
 * 3) I will reply to you on your talk page.
 * 4) Whenever starting a new conversation, put it under a new header.

Re:Yoshi's Story
I'm familiar with it - I've had the Nintendo Power guide, and recently got my hands on the Shogakukan one for good measure (I haven't gotten around to adding anything else from it yet, but it'll at least affect the rest of the Shy Guy articles). The Prima guide could have names that the Nintendo Power guide lacks, but from what I can tell, it's from their unlicensed period. I'm not sure what the case for that is since I think they only became authorized by Nintendo shortly afterwards... You might have to ask about using pre-licensing Prima for the wiki. I can definitely help out if it's considered official/useable, though. LinkTheLefty (talk) 09:31, 14 August 2017 (EDT)

Sorry to interject myself in this convo, but you stated the Prima YS guide "It bills itself as official".

Doesn't look like it to me? Same "Unauthorized Game Secret" suffix and ghetto but not copyright-infringing artwork. The Prima Games page does say they bundled together several of their "unauthorized game guides" after becoming licensee, but I'm not really comfortable with passing material from *these* guides as official. --Glowsquid (talk) 09:55, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
 * I was aware. The guide bundle is licensed, I guess, but that the material originates from an unofficial guide and doesn't appear to have been notably changed or revised when it was rereleased makes me think twice. Maybe I'm way overthinking this, but I feel there should be some disclaimer about the nature of the book and its original status as unlicensed if we're going to insert those yoshi's story names. --Glowsquid (talk) 11:06, 14 August 2017 (EDT)

So the re-released bundle is officially licensed, but the original guide isn't? We might actually have a similar precedent for this: there are a few citations and [[Media:HowToWin.png|two]] [[Media:AtSuperMarioBros.png|images]] for How to Win at Super Mario Bros., which is the official English translation of Super Mario Brothers Kanzen Koryakubon. Mind, this does predate Nintendo Power, but the Japanese version of the guide is by Tokuma Shoten and not Shogakukan. I could be wrong, but I don't believe Tokuma Shoten were ever an official guidebook licensee -- it's just that Nintendo of America bought the rights for an overseas publication. LinkTheLefty (talk) 21:48, 14 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Sure, go ahead. I personally think it's fine. LinkTheLefty (talk) 00:00, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Here's what I gather:

What I'm most curious about is if the Prima guide has names for all the different kinds of Shy Guys, since that's unfortunately lacking in Nintendo Power but right there in Shogakukan. LinkTheLefty (talk) 23:50, 23 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Stones refer to Rock Blocks, which come in a breakable blue type and unbreakable beige-ish type.
 * Brown Question Mark Boxes are most likely the floating ? Blocks (called Mystery Blocks or Mystery Boxes in the other guide), which look somewhat similar to the blue Mystery Crates in this game. On that note, the Melon Race is called the "Special Delivery" minigame at one point in the Nintendo Power guide.
 * Bomber Birds sound like Goonies, which can carry bombs.
 * Raindrops are most definitely Do-Drops, with the same taste trait.
 * Bats are ComBats, and the description for them seems about right from what I remember.
 * Eels are Mr. Eels, going by the same generic name that was used on the website.
 * Fish are Cheep Cheeps, which are referred to as such in the Nintendo Power and Shogakukan guides.
 * I might be missing a few, but these are the appearances I'm aware of right now:

The White and Black Shy Guys aren't needed, but in case you want to check, the latter are in 3-3, 6-1, 6-2 & 6-3. There are also nameless Shy Guys that start charging from the background and foreground in 1-1, and ones that hide in trees in 1-2 & 5-4. (Also, minor correction, but Melon Race and Special Delivery are separate activities, and the latter starts by breaking something the Nintendo Power guide calls a flower pot.) LinkTheLefty (talk) 12:20, 24 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Propeller Shy Guy: 1-2, 1-3, 1-4, 2-2, 2-4, 3-1, 3-2, 3-3, 4-3, 4-4, 5-3, 5-4, 6-1, 6-4
 * Shy Guys on Pogo Sticks: 1-2, 1-3, 4-1, 5-3
 * Stilt Guy: 1-3, 4-1, 5-2, 5-4
 * Snow Guy: 3-3, 3-4
 * Fly Guy: 3-3, 3-4, 5-3
 * Submarine Guy / Sensuikan Heihō: 5-1
 * Bamboo Dancers: 5-3
 * Pirate Guy: 5-4
 * Barbecue Guy / Burner Heihō: 6-4

Just two quick notes

 * When you create Ice Cream (item), be sure to move Ice Cream to and turn Ice Cream into a disambiguation page.
 * When you create Light Bulb (item), be sure to add to Toy Tank so as to guide readers properly.

Thanks for all you do! 11:09, 17 August 2017 (EDT)

RE
Actually, I don't think Spiny is a good contrast. It's fairly obvious that it's way more common for readers to search for the Spiny enemy from the Mario franchise than anything else "Spiny", so that's why it doesn't have the identifier. But in the case of Dictionary, Milk, and Scarf, there's no definite evidence that readers will overwhelmingly search more for the Paper Mario versions of these items than the Mario's Time Machine versions, as all six of these particular items each have only appeared in one game or the other, all are key items, and all are required in some form to beat the respective game.

I have another idea: Why not merge the pairs of articles together, as per the similarities I mentioned? 17:35, 17 August 2017 (EDT)

Partners in Time script
That script is woefully incomplete, it lacks everything from the endgame, including Bowser's "What did you feed me?" line, and also spells "Hydrogush" incorrectly. I remember either E. Gadd or one of the Toads saying "Re-toadified" or some variation thereof in the endgame at one point. 18:55, August 17 2017 (CT)

Piranha Bud
Shouldn't you put a delete template on the page now that the proposal has passed? 22:33, 21 August 2017 (EDT)

Bee Proposal
's vote reminded me this was still a thing :P I have a question about where the SMG bees will be moved to, as that's not clear in the proposal. Honeybee appears to be the official name, unless there is a more recent name I don't know about. 17:01, 23 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Alright, sounds good. 17:03, 23 August 2017 (EDT)

Proposal
Hi, your third voting pool on you recent proposal is off. Shouldn't it be "Option 3: They're both" or something like that? 01:13, 25 August 2017 (EDT) 01:13, 25 August 2017 (EDT)

RE: Coin
Games go back and forth between capitalisations (even ones like Warp Pipe/warp pipe), which I guess explains why it's never consistent on articles. 22:36, 25 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Sure. 22:46, 25 August 2017 (EDT)

SMBSS edits
Hi. This is MarioXB. No, I don't know how to communicate on here, really. I only discovered the "talk" sections maybe an hour ago.

First of all, all of those edits were done at the same time, and I didn't get any email notification that someone was trying to "talk" to me, so I was not warned at all.

I don't see Mario Jc providing any references either, and I don't know how to provide references. Everything I posted is fact, it can be proven my VHS tapes I recorded myself in 1989 as well as German DVDs provided by pidax-film.de. If you go to that page, you can see episode lists in German. Running them through Google Translate will show them in English. All of the lost episodes, except for the second Tutti Frutti, are on these DVDs, though only in German. So the claim about them not being on ANY DVD is incorrect. The DVDS were only released this year. As far as the Slime Busters not having episode specific bumpers, I'm 99% sure that Mario Jc heard that from me on my SMBSS Restored: Legend of Zelda Fridays channel, which has since been edited to remove that claim. Watch my video on YouTube here,

https://youtu.be/KxLAF41vbIo

for proof of that. Marioxb (talk) 13:56, 26 August 2017 (EDT)

Donkey Kong's uncomfortably-shaped head
Look at the picture of fake Candy cutting his hair, the hair and the skin are on literally the same plane. We don't require citations for how DK and Eddie use the same model, but slightly retextured, as do K. Rool and Kutlass, Klump and Skurvy, and Kritter and Green Kroc. It's the same situation here. 20:39, 26 August 2017 (CT)

RE:Coins
I get what your proposal is going for, but the task feels so mundane to me that it seems pointless. Warp Pipe and ? Block are also inanimate objects with proper names, so why shouldn't Coins? As the name of the object, I think it should be capitalized. But if used in a general sense, like when including Red Coins or Blue Coins into the mix, then it can be lowercase. It seems like one of those case-by-case things to me. 23:20, 26 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Minigame/Mini-game deals with the spelling of the word (to hyphen or not to hyphen) rather than the capitalization, so it feels like a different case to me. And it has actually been inconsistent to the point where I've been confused myself at certain points, so I'm glad there's a clear spelling there.
 * I just went back over the proposal and I admittedly appear to have misread it. For some dyslexic reason, I thought you were voting to change the standard to "coin" rather than "Coin", and ultimately got confused as to how to vote. I'll remove my vote, but I'm still confused.
 * Clear this up for me: The standard Yellow Coins would still be called "Coins"? And would we collectively refer to all the coins as "Coins" as well? I suppose that makes sense since they are all (usually) proper names as well. I'm sorry if I'm making this even more confusing, my autism does not make thinking easy. And this wouldn't be the first time I've been confused by something simple I've unwittingly made complex. 23:42, 26 August 2017 (EDT)
 * Yeah, I didn't remove the vote yet because I wanted to see if I could make a proper vote in the same edit. And if the proposal is focusing on just the standard Yellow Coins, then I will vote to support :) 23:52, 26 August 2017 (EDT)

I'm bored!
Hey man, how are you doing? I'm doing great, especially because I'm not in school right now (Ugh...I HATE school SO MUCH!). 20:31, 28 August 2017 (EDT)

re:French names
Pas du tout! --Glowsquid (talk) 22:19, 28 August 2017 (EDT)

Aight, so


 * Ail Vengeur - The primary meaning of "vengeur" means "to avenge" but in more loose (emphasis on "loose") usage it can be used to designate something punitive or unpleasant.


 * "Chichi" can mean "worries", but it's also a semi-popular pets name.


 * "L'homme faucon" This one is puzzling.. I thought this could maybe a pop culture reference buut doing a quote search doesn't bring obvious results. It could also be a translation mistake resulting from the translator not having visual references for that character.


 * Kiriki: no obvious pun or reference.


 * Natacha Duchouine: likely a random and arbitrary name change. "Chouine" means "to whine" but it doesn't fit the character.


 * Surao Man - "[Adjective/Noun] man" is a popular naming convention in french for nicknames or purposely silly names in parodies and the like. There's also a few fake anglicisms constructed that way (ex "tennisman", which doesn't exist in english). There's no deeper meaning behind this one. --Glowsquid (talk) 23:00, 28 August 2017 (EDT)
 * It's an onomatopoeia for biting/munching. --

Pufftup
Hello again! I was leafing through a bunch of tropes for DKCTF on TVTropes when I found this:

"A single type of enemy from the original trilogy (Puftup, the pufferfish from DKC2) returns in Sea Breeze Cove, appearing in Amiss Abyss, Irate Eight, and Shoal Atoll. He's been pretty heavily redesigned, but according to some supplementary material such as the official player's guide, that's really him."

This is the "Bus Came Back" trope of Tropical Freeze. What it says, is it true? Does the Prima book confirm that Puftup from DKC2 is the same as Pufftup from DKC:TF? Can you please check this in the guide? Thank you! --
 * Ok, thank you again. And sorry for confusing the guides.

Idle Chatter
Hey, Time Turner, how are you doing, bro? I turn 15 on September 4, and I can't wait. Anyway, this music is freaking AWESOME! You have GOT to listen to it! (OK, I do this all the time, but still, I love video-game music SO MUCH! It's so CATCHY!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWJvSXAlTas 21:31, 1 September 2017 (EDT)

SWEET! Man, I am on an absolute high right now, like I always am. It feels so GOOD to be so hyper at times, you know? I freaking LOVE it! It helps me put a smile on other people's faces, and it keeps everyone relaxed and smiling and free of worries, and that's EXACTLY what I aim to do ALL the time, especially here on the wiki! Man, I just can't seem to calm down these days, but that's mostly good, I guess. 21:38, 1 September 2017 (EDT)

That's true. I'm not gonna forget that. But let's not forget to smile. I was born to smile. But I seem to be surprisingly calm for how hyper I am. It's a good balance. Anyway, I'll just try to help and do things, as usual. And as always, always assume good faith and be respectful to everyone, people! Don't get blocked and repeat your mistakes, am I right, bro?

And by the way, it's this music that will make you smile. Go ahead and give it a shot!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCZIBcpOlMc 21:44, 1 September 2017 (EDT)

RE:Pillars
Hello! Oh, pillars? I think I just made that up. As in, I came up with the most convenient name for that obstacle. Now that you brought the name into question, I checked the Wario Land KC Mario comix for any clue on their true name. I browsed rapidly through them, and to no avail... By the way, as far as this video goes, pillars appear in course 19 of Sherbet Land. Perhaps pillars appear in the same timeframe in the comix. --

Re: MK8
I don't know that much about Mario Kart 8, unfortunately. From what I can tell though, they're just flashing Piranha Plants. Niiue (talk) 17:57, 2 September 2017 (EDT)
 * If I may, the "Raving Piranha Plants" don't act any different from regular Piranha Plants. They just flash a lot of colors. Similar to the Bone Piranha Plant, it appears to just be a pallet swap. 18:00, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

Sorry to intrude. I am familiar with MK8, so AMA! --
 * Alex is right. They are just the same. As a matter of fact, I remember being munched down several times by those Raving Pirabbids Piranhas when trying to get the mini-boost on the curve...
 * I'd suggest simply mentioning in the Piranha Plant article that the Prima guide separates them like that.
 * Decided to double-check, and yes, the Raving Piranha Plants do bob their heads more than the others. I don't think there's enough info to warrant a full article, however. 18:16, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

By the way, is there a special name for those pink Piranha Plants in Sweet Sweet Canyon? (I'd wager they only look pink because of the lighting.) --

Every Piranha Plant in the game moves around slightly, but the Raving Piranha Plants appear to bob their heads to the beat of Electrodrome's music. As for the ones in Sweet Sweet Canyon, they most certainly are pink. And yellow. Kinda sherbet-colored, really. They're also bigger. I'm checking the courses with Piranha Plants in them to see if there are any differences between them. 18:21, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

Okay, so, anything with a regular Piranha Plant in it acts like a simple Piranha Plant, as well as the Bone Piranha Plant in the Bone-Dry Dunes. Sweet Sweet Canyon's Piranha Plants are Big Piranha Plants and colored in pink and yellow rather than red ("Sherbet Piranha Plant" would be a fitting title here, if Prima doesn't have one). There is also a Big Piranha Plant in Piranha Plant Slide, and the returning Piranha Plants in Royal Raceway act like they did in that game. Electrodrome's Piranha Plants (the point of this discussion) bobs their head in time with the beat of the music and also flash several colors. The Big Piranha Plants in Music Park also bob their heads in time with the music. The Deku Babas in Hyrule Circuit act like they do in Zelda: Skyward Sword, sort of swaying with their tongue sticking out. There's a lot of differences between them than I initially thought. I always just saw them a Piranha Plants aside from their cosmetic appearances :P 18:32, 2 September 2017 (EDT)
 * I thought the Sweet ones just were regular ones given a popsicle sheen. Also the Royal Raceway ones cameo in Shy Guy Falls. 18:24, 2 September 2017 (CT)

"also don"
What were you trying to say in your summary for creating Skating Shy Guy? You clearly ran out of characters with your list. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:36, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

RE: Bowser Golem
The name "Bowser Golem" was actually already written on the Mario Kart 8 article in the "Additional enemies, obstacles, and species" section, which somebody else wrote, so I just figured I would make it a redirect to Bowser's Castle (Wii U). 23:27, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

RE: Coin proposal
Rule 10 only applies to proposals with exactly two options. See this proposal if you're confused. 11:21, 3 September 2017 (EDT)

Lava Bud
Just so you know, since your proposal passed, you might want to simply undo Chester Alan Arthur's revision rather than start from scratch. (I'm sure you knew that, but why not?) Thanks! 23:07, 5 September 2017 (EDT)

Bonkers
How did you the enemy Bonkers to appear on the Dream Land stage in Super Smash Bros.3ds? Wariopig (talk) 19:38, 9 September 2017 (EDT)Wariopig

RE: Proposal archive
You can give me the list of dates and I'll go ahead and semi-protect the appropriate archive pages so you can make the changes. 22:41, 9 September 2017 (EDT)


 * It can just be added under Archive 17 without shuffling them around. There are a few archives that don't have exactly 20 proposals anyway. 02:18, 10 September 2017 (EDT)


 * Huh. Looks like a few of them weren't even protected in the first place. Anyway, the archives are open for maintenance. 01:24, 11 September 2017 (EDT)


 * Great! I'll leave Archive 43 semi-protected in the meantime. 22:56, 11 September 2017 (EDT)

Final article for MTM
My warm congratulations and condolences.

22:09, 10 September 2017 (EDT)

I'm sure it's been such an adventure...

15:17, 11 September 2017 (EDT)


 * That's what I'm talking about! Also, I am 100% sure documenting MTM was a lot more fun than school.
 * Yeah, I saw several of your notes. What I'm trying to highlight is that research out of passion always feels more compelling (not necessarily fun, but it may as well be) than school. From my perspective. Some may not agree.
 * It's the end result that matters the most! It may sound a little dramatic for a place like this, but go on and help the world further! Because you did an unparalleled job here that hasn't been left unnoticed. Also... not to be pry, but do you plan on taking on Mario is Missing too? (edit: oops, sorry, I thought that thing about Karl Marx was in the game's context...)
 * Good luck then. And sorry for the awkward mistake.

Behind Schedule on a Time Machine
Strange, isn't it? Oh and good job getting that done. But this wasn't bad enough to involve adobe, King Kong, and some mutant Koopaling "Bowser"... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:57, 11 September 2017 (EDT)

In response
I feel like having pages for not only the paper, but the SHINY versions would be a bit too much.  ~Camwood777  (talk)  19:01, 15 September 2017 (EDT)

In response again
That's... Honestly a fair point. I feel like those have enough to them, though, that they don't exactly warrant a merge. I think a policy for consistency as to what warrants a merge for similar enemies in RPGs might be in order, but I won't make such a big vote in proposals over it. Feel free to make that yourself, though.  ~Camwood777  (talk)  19:06, 15 September 2017 (EDT)

Re: Splits
Alright. Anything specific in mind? Niiue (talk) 22:46, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * I still think the two Gritty Goombas should be merged, considering all versions of the game treat them as the same enemy despite the color/stat differences. I dunno, it feels like an RPG version of green/red Koopas to me. Niiue (talk) 22:51, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * At that point, the main difference is simply that the game identifies Fighter/Super Flies as different enemies, but doesn't do the same thing with the two Gritty Goomba colorations. If anything, Superstar Saga having named variants of enemies could be considered proof that the Gritty Goombas were specifically not intended to be separate enemies, unlike, say, Troopeas and Elite Troopeas. Niiue (talk) 22:58, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * Eh, I look at stuff on a case-by-case basis. Like, take the two types of Dry Bones or Pestnuts. English is the only language where they share a name, not to mention that the purple versions of both are capable of poisoning the player, unlike the "normal" ones. But if the only real differences are stats/palette, then I figure it's more of a variant than its own thing (again, look at different-colored Koopas or Shy Guys). Niiue (talk) 23:16, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * Hm, not sure how I'd handle that. Consistency would ideally be best, so I'd probably support merging or splitting both pairs. Niiue (talk) 23:38, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * Yeah, I don't really have a preference for splitting or merging, it just depends on the situation. Niiue (talk) 23:58, 15 September 2017 (EDT)
 * Fair point. Niiue (talk) 00:07, 16 September 2017 (EDT)

RE: Locations in SMO
Now that you mention it, these kingdoms are vast enough to hold multiple relatively smaller, but still large enough, locations that can easily get their own article. (Although what concerns me are the locations that are too small like the park and the helipad in New Donk City. Maybe the small ones can be kept on the kingdom pages, and the larger ones split into separate articles with on the original page.) Anyway, I'll add them back. 22:42, 16 September 2017 (EDT)

Re: Yume Kōjō
At this point, I think you are trying to get an answer I don't have, as I've stated before. I still stand by my concerns. One week isn't enough for what you are proposing, which is hasty. The proposal is looking to execute on one popular option, when I think over half of the options apply at once. That's what makes the game itself so complicated. -- 16:23, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
 * I think my concern was one or two weeks isn't enough time. I think I just went too far with length of time needed. I think this is one of those kinds of things "we need to be sure about", more sure than standard proposal times without extensions. -- 16:27, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
 * That's the thing. What if we come across something we didn't consider? -- 16:29, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
 * Not that kind of what-if scenarios. I don't know how familiar people are with the game and it's conversion to be a Mario game, but the information we currently have, how we treat it currently, and what the proposal entails, we could lose something if we don't consider as many aspects as possible before acting on it. Your proposal seemed to come out of the blue and we have one week to decide what we want to do, by acting on one option and excluding the rest. That's why I am expressing concern like this. This isn't as simple as Tetris Attack where sprites and some game features were changed. -- 16:45, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
 * I don't think this conversation will reach a satisfying conclusion. I guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree. I voted the way I did because sometimes the best option is to do nothing, in the face of doubt, which the proposal I am left with some lingering doubts. That way, for sure, nothing is lost. I can't immediately think of anything as you want me to, but for those who can, my vote will support those editors. I'm trying to think into the future, not what is here now. I wish you could see what I see, but I am not very good with words to fully explain myself adequately, trying to help you understand, but I hope I did my best to. I wished this proposal was really . Then there is no time pressure. -- 17:43, 18 September 2017 (EDT)