MarioWiki:Proposals

List of Talk Page Proposals

 * Delete Player. (Discuss) Deadline: July 20, 2013, 23:59 GMT.
 * Move Venus Fire Trap to Fire Piranha (Discuss) Deadline: July 29, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Document "Regional Differences" in game pages, and create a policy page for them

 * Draft: User:Walkazo/Essays

This project is pretty self-explanatory. Basically, the idea of this project is to document changes made to a game during localization, re-releases, ports, etc. These changes can include anything from different placement of coins or items to drastic gameplay changes or even characters being added in later versions of a game, such as Metal Mario being added for the North American version of the game Mario Golf, for example. As explained on the draft for the policy page and the example following it, we would create sections for "Regional differences" in the pages of games that have them, and further organize them into subcategories that include "Gameplay changes", "Level design changes", "Graphical changes", and "Textual changes". Of course, if there are changes made to other aspects of the game in question, such as changes in the soundtrack of the game, additional sections can be created to properly document them.

Proposer: and Deadline: July 29, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) &mdash; Per proposal, natch.
 * 2) Sounds good, per proposal.
 * 3) - I really like this idea. Per proposal.
 * 4) Nice one. Per all
 * 5) - Per our proposal.
 * 6) Per all.
 * 7) per all, hurp. You don't know how long I've been waiting for this.
 * 8) Per all

Comments
Without going full plagiarism, maybe we could use this -

Other Appearances, Cameos and References sections
It would be useful to have subsections at the bottom of the History sections to group all the random data-deficient appearances (rather than littering the place with section-stubs), as well as things that wouldn't really fit in the History proper, like merchandise, commercials, references and cameos. Right now, they're already used on the Mario, Luigi, Princess Peach, Wario, Thwomp and Bowser articles (and maybe others too), and on a whole, seem to work well. However, the Bowser page has a rewrite template calling for the removal of the section, which is what brings me here. Currently, there's no policy about this type of section: it's just something that's been done informally, but I think that should change.

The style of these sections should follow the example on Bowser's article: nice, full paragraphs that group related bits of information (lump the games, lump the merchandise, give the "How to Draw" books a separate paragraph, etc.), as opposed to a bulleted list like Peach's page, which looks lazy and sloppy and should be avoided. Bowser's page also has a few subsections: the Wreck-It Ralph one is a good idea since the movie's pretty notable and folks are likely going to look for info about it; the others are about series in which Bowser has made multiple cameos/references, which is okay, although the Thwomp page is a better example of this practice, as it makes full use of its Zelda subsection, with multiple, information-rich paragraphs. However, even though there's a lot of into, they're still just cameos: "guest appearances" should still be incorporated into the History whenever possible, like how Wario's Densetsu no Stafy 3 appearance is nestled in his page's History, while things like the PM:TTYD badge are in the "Other Appearances" section. Similarly, while putting data-deficient Mario series games in these grab-bag sections is better than nothing, the hope is still that if enough info can be collected to make sections worth reading, it'll be done. It's also worth noting that while things like Super Mario-Kun and other obscure publications are likely to land in these sections more often than not, it's not meant to be a return to ye olden days of separating appearances by media: merchandise (including Nintendo Monopoly and Super Mario Chess) is really the only medium that should be limited to "Other Appearances" (for obvious reasons).

Finally, as seen in the examples, the name's not consistent. The goal would be to call the sections "Other appearances, cameos and references", but if (for example) there are only cameos and references (like on Thwomp's page), it'd be more accurate to call the section "Cameos and references", and if no cameos or references have been added to the section (yet), it could simply be called "Other Appearances" for the time being. If this proposal passes, the name, the structure and the content of these sections will all be outlined in a paragraph added to the History section of the Manual of Style, thereby making these handy sections official and welcome on the wiki.

Proposer: Deadline: July 16, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) - Per me. When done right, these sections are a great asset, especially for massive character pages that will simply get bogged down by attempts to incorporate one-liner appearances in the History proper.
 * 2) Although it takes a lifetime to read, per proposal.
 * 3) - Per proposal.
 * 4) We need an official writing guideline on this and this is a great start. Per proposal.
 * 5) There are no downsides to this proposal, except that it requires work to do. Accessing those giant pages is still a problem, though, but that's another issue. Per all.
 * 6) Per all
 * 7) Per proposal.
 * 8) Per LGM
 * 9) - Per Walkazo.
 * 10) — Per all. I don't know which name we will use, but we shouldn't use uppercases as in "Other Appearances".
 * 11) Per proposal.
 * 12) Per all.

Remove indirect appearances and name-only references from the "Appearances" sections on character pages
So, I was looking at the appearances section on the Wart page and noticed that for some reason he's listed as having appeared in games that only referenced his name. We include Stickers and Trophies on these sections, but I don't think a character should be listed as having appeared in a game just because his/her name is mentioned/referenced. Then there's his so-called "indirect appearances" in the Animal Crossing games, just because there's a character called Wart Jr. I don't believe these type of references should be included on the Appearances sections on any character pages, so I'm proposing that we remove them.

Proposer: Deadline: July 19, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) Per my proposal.
 * 2) Per proposal.

Comments
The "Wart Jr." thing is even debatable if it really references Wart or not. I mean, I'm pretty sure "Wart" would be a pretty common name to name a toad.
 * Yeah, which is why it's only mentioned in the Trivia. I have no idea why all the games Wart Jr. appears in are included as "indrect appearances".

The Animal Crossing ones should definitely be removed, but I think it's plausible for the "Cyber Wart" comic in Super Paper Mario to be a reference to Wart himself. The Brawl one could also be an actual reference. --
 * It's very likely that they are references, but I don't think name-only references should be included in the "Appearances" section. If a picture of the character appears, then sure, it's a cameo. But a simple mention shouldn't really count as an appearance in my opinion. Of course the reference should be mentioned in the article itself, in the "Other Appearances, Cameos and References" section (since that proposal will pass).
 * I support not counting mentions as appearances and instead listing them under the "Other Appearances, Cameos and References" section, but you'd need to specify that in the proposal. --

Paper Mario: Sticker Star Level Pages
Since Paper Mario: Sticker Star is a level-based game, there is a page for each level. However, the format for these are inconsistent, as you can tell by comparing Warm Fuzzy Plains, Water's Edge Way, and Jungle Rapids, though there are more inconsistencies. I think that there should be one format for all of these levels, which I have included below. There is also very little information on some pages, and I feel that they should be expanded. One area that many of there articles are lacking in is the Tattles section, which Kersti gives throughout each level. I believe that all of these pages should be formatted the same and have more information in general.

Suggested Normal Level Page Format:

*Not relevant for all pages

A few sentence into

=History=

=Layout=

==HP-Up Heart==* (Location/How to get)

==Traveling Toad==* (Being bullied by ___, bribe, reward)

==Secret Door==

==Secret Exit==*

=Sticker Shop=* (Inventory) (On levels like Rumble Volcano)

=Area Tattles=

==Advice==

=Enemies=

==Bosses==*

=Things=

=Trivia=*

=Names in other Languages=

NOTE: Some special levels like Bowser's Sky Castle will take away many sections or add in specialized sections for that particular level

Suggested Shop Level Page Format:

*Not relevant for all pages

=History=

=Layout=

==Secret Door==*

=Sticker Shop= (Inventory)

=Area Tattles=

=Things=*

=Trivia=*

=Names in other Languages=

Proposer: Deadline: July 16, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) I think that we should keep all of the pages on this wiki organized to the best of our ability, and this will organize and expand all of the level pages for Paper Mario: Sticker Star.
 * 2) Per Mario7.

Oppose

 * 1) - One "Overview" section like in some other leveled games' articles seems more efficient than splitting the plot and layout; then just put the subsections in there (although I'm a bit unsure if one-liners would need full sections anyway). Subsections for Bosses also seems unnecessary: just bold them in the regular enemy lists or something to cut down on header clutter. Also, Trivia sections go at the bottoms of pages (and are actually discouraged).
 * 2) Per Walkazo.
 * 3) Per Walkazo.
 * 4) Per Walkazo.

Comments
"Shop Levels" are things like Shaved-Ice Cave, right? Seems like they wouldn't even need History/Layout sections at all, or is that article actually lacking in a lot of info? I haven't played the game yet, so I wouldn't know... -
 * It's not lacking info. It's just a shop that, because of how accessing the game's locations is done, is given its own space in its "world."
 * Maybe the page layout for shops does not need to change, but the other pages are not in a set format (e.g. =Layout= =Secret Door=  =Secret Exit= for one page, but =Layout=  ==Secret Exit==  ==Secret Door== for another ) and I want to change that.

Do Something with the Mario Party One-liner sections
Recently I've found way too many one line sections in minigame articles. I just say we do something with them.

Proposer: (third option suggested by ) Deadline: July 17, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Incorporate them into the Main Sections

 * 1) Per myself.

Comments
Why are we having this proposal again? Just merge them: 9/10 of the opposers of the last proposal essentially voted for that option already when they per'd me (including "per all" votes, since "all" were pering me - until the last vote, at any rate, and not including RAP's comment). That should be enough of a show of support to go through with the change. -


 * I want to make sure I don't do something that the other users don't like.
 * Fair enough, but I still think the last proposal made it clear what users would like. At least, the users who voted. -
 * Huh?

Inconsistencies with Template Names
The vast majority of our navigational templates (templates that serve as an index of sorts for a certain subject) for games follow a specific format for its title: the beginning is always "Template:", and what subsequently follows is an abbreviation of the game's title. This is what's used for almost all of our game's templates (Template:MK7, Template:YI, Template:SMG, and others). However, this is only used for almost all of our game's templates. There are several titles out there that use the full version of their game's title for their template's title (Template:WarioWare, Inc.: Mega Microgame$!, Template:Super Mario Bros. 3, Template:Mario Superstar Baseball, and others), which, from my point of view, is a fair bit inconsistent. This is something that I would like to change.

Another point I'd like to bring up is subcategories of nav. templates: when a certain aspect of a game becomes too large to fit into a standard template (such as levels or minigames), it often gets put into its own template. The names of these often follow the same rules with "Template:(game name) [aspect]", such as Template:NSLU Levels and Template:WarioWare: D.I.Y. Microgames, but there are some that are non-indicative of what game it covers, such as Template:Baseballpowerups and Template:Battlecourses, and others that don't even mention what aspect it covers, such as Template:Doubledash, Template:Galaxy, and Template:Gadd, which I find both inconsistent and just odd. This is something else that I would like to change.

So, I want to propose a simple standard for the names of these templates. For starters, all game-centric navigation templates would have use an abbreviation of the game's name, so Template:Mario Pinball Land would become Template:MPL, Template:Mario Super Sluggers would become Template:MSS, and so on. For templates that cover larger aspects of a game, they would use both the abbrevation and the aspect that they're covering, so Template:WarioWare: Smooth Moves Microgames would become Template:WWSM Microgames, Template:Galaxy2 would become Template:SMG2 Levels, Template:Mario Party 1 would become Template:MP Minigames, and so on. For games that share an abbreviation, such as Yoshi's Story and Yoshi's Safari, they can't both have Template:YS, so as an alternative, the first few words of the title would be abbreviated, while the final word would remain in its full form. Thus, we would have Template:YStory, Template:YSafari, and so on. Just about every template can conform to these rules, and the biggest problem here would probably be changing all the links, but in the grand scheme of things, that's really not that big of a deal.

I understand that this may not be the biggest issue on the wiki, but nevertheless, this is still an issue, and it's something that I think should be dealt with, for the sake of consistency.

Proposer: Deadline: July 22, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Make the changes

 * 1) I support my proposal.
 * 2) I support Time Turner's proposal too.
 * 3) It might take a lot of time, but eventually it should be done.
 * 4) Per all. Having a standard to distinguish templates such as Template:MP9 and Template:Mario Party 9 is a great idea, though I also agree with Walkazo. Ambiguity should be the reason these templates are being adjusted, not for the sake of consistency.

Comments
Rather than random truncation, names that share the same abbreviation should just be written out in full. Similarly, any other cases where abbreviations or shorthand would create ambiguity should be avoided (i.e. "tem:MP1 Minigames" is better than "tem:MP Minigames", since the latter could refer to the series), and while the emphasis is on making template names short, making them clear is still number one priority. There should also be explicit allowances for "species"-type templates getting whatever names work (speaking of which, the two galaxy templates have always struck me more as species templates than level templates to account of how specialized their designs are - just a thought). I also think you're underselling the amount of work updating all the links is gonna be, and while having a guide definitely names sense, it shouldn't be something that should be enforced to the letter especially not retroactively and when dealing with tricky cases like shared abbreviations or cases where more than one abbreviation is understandable. Heck, part of me even wants to argue that the current mix isn't dysfunctional and readers won't see any difference anyway, and so our efforts might be better spent elsewhere, while old titles simply get grandfathered through... -
 * I've spent most of my time here systematically going through links and changing them. Doing stuff like that doesn't even faze me. In any case, you do raise a fair point (though I'm not sure I'd classify Galaxy as a species template), but... I want something to be done. Even if we don't have a rigid format for all the template names, I still want something to be done about all those ones with awkward names (MFb, Gadd, and the like). Maybe I'm just being overly OCD...
 * I enjoy that sorta maintenance work too, actually (just cruising along, not having to think - nice and peaceful), it's just that replacing templates en masse will take a lot of time that could potentially be used for other maintenance work, like updating categories or fixing headers. And I also agree that something should be done, with a nice section on naming rules/recommendations getting added to Navigation Templates as a reference for making new templates or fixing the oddball ones that should be replaced. (As for the Galaxy templates, if they were regular game templates, they'd technically have to be red, but I like their current design and colours (and I'm sure others do too), and calling them a species template lets them stay that way without technically breaking from policy.) -
 * We could see if Porple could make a bot to do it, because if you go by the comments in this TPP Porple can make a bot to delete all those links, it might be possible for him to make a bot to change the template names.

Featured Image
On the Main Page, I would like to see a Featured Image section added in. It would change every week, much like the already existing Featured Article section. It would be any picture or artwork that is related to the Mario series that had some sort of significance (not some random screenshot or logo) to something in the Mario universe. The image could be a multitude of things, as long as it is visually impressive (high-quality). There would only be one per week, so there will always be plenty to choose from. This is on many of the other websites in the NIWA, and Super Mario Wiki should have it as well. It would add content and variety to the Main Page and would attract first-time visitors to this site. Unlike a few years ago when no one updated the section, I will update it every week and would welcome anyone who wants to help. Voting will not be an issue because there will be a committee of five users, selected by administrators, (though that number can be changed it this proposal gets passed) that will decide the image of the week. An administrator, with the consent of 4 other administrators, can remove a user from the committee if they become inactive or are not carrying out their duties. This will get rid of the system that Mario Wiki had before and will fix any controversies that happened in the past. It would not replace any other sections, so it would be beneficial in many ways.

Proposer: Deadline: July 17, 2013, 23:59 GMT

Support

 * 1) It would expand the Main Page and be another interesting on this wiki that will help to improve it and make it grow

Oppose

 * 1) – Per the vote made by Super Mario Bros. in a previous proposal here.
 * 2) Per the vote YoshiKong showed us.
 * 3) &mdash; In addition to my reasons in the older proposal, the proposed committee system is relatively infeasible. It is not correct to task the administration with micromanaging a Featured Images Committee, and it does not take into account any sort of quorum system the administration already has for its internal proceedings. Rather than improving any sort of problem, this new idea simply introduces its own problems.
 * 4) Per YoshiKong.
 * 5) Per Super Mario Bros.
 * 6) Per Super Mario Bros.
 * 7) - Per SMB.
 * 8) - Per SMB, and per the same reasons I always voted for the removal of FIs whenever it came up in years past. FAs are a testament to the quality put forth by the wiki - they are a direct result of our hard work and are something to strive for and take pride in. On the other hand, FIs simply showcase Nintendo's handiwork, which would do nothing but add extra clutter to the main page, thereby detracting from the sections that actually matter.
 * 9) Per all.

Comments
Due to my going to sleep after posting this, you are aware that we voted to delete this ages ago for some odd reason. It kight be wise to see why, so you can try and convince those who voted to remove it why it should be back.
 * Thanks

YoshiKong: I read the archived proposal and I have a plan to fix it.